Carnivore diet took me from 75-80% to 99% recovery in two weeks..... and then back down to 75-80% in week four

Therapeutic Efforts Supplements & Lifestyle
#1

Been suffering from PFS for 6 years. Other than the very slow recovery that comes with time, the only thing that has made a dent on my symptoms was water fasting and the carnivore diet. Experiments with fasting got my recovery from about 40-60% depending on the day to 60-80% depending on the day.

Been too busy and uninspired to water fast for a while but had the thought one day that the drug left my system 6 years ago so maybe it’s time to forget about the drug completely and just look at the symptoms I have and treat them all one by one. As I’ve noticed changes in diet having such a big difference in my overall health and how I feel I started looking into treating inflammation and auto-immune syndromes using diet.

Got interested in the carnivore diet after watching the Shawn Baker interview on Joe Rogan’s podcast and also from Jordan Peterson’s daughter Mikhaila’s blog (mikhailapeterson.com) and her various interviews. This inspired me to try the carnivore diet and during the third week I experienced a remarkable recovery: libido fixed, reproductive system pain and inflammation gone, found women attractive again, masturbating 2-3 times a day rather than 0-3 times a week, slept like a log and woke up early ready to go, depression lifted but best of all I had LOADS OF ENERGY, was loving work and exercise and being active in all areas of life that I couldn’t before. It also fixed the sebhorric dermatitis on my upper lip which was a recent development. Had the best week of the last 6 years hands down. Felt like I was 21 again.

In the fourth week all that good stuff went and I’d say I dropped back down to about 70-75%. Unfortunately a few things happened at the end of the third week that may have been responsible for the drop in convalescence: 3 inch rusty nail went through my heel while walking in a forest so had to go get a diphtheria/polio/tetanus jab, also had a couple of pints of beer and a mostly meat curry (no rice or naan, two meat starters and a meat main), also possibly just overdid life in the previous week (work, exercise, masturbation etc), also noticed that my meat diet had gone from 30% pork up to about 85% pork (pork is often thought to have more of a histamine/auto-immunity inducing reaction because of their dieter and faster digestive systems leaving more crappy stuff in their meat).

Carnivore dieters are not a very zealous, dogmatic or evangelical lot. There isn’t much science to it and there aren’t really any tests that have been done on carnivore dieters. However, science is very slow, is very hard to do well and there are plenty of incentives to do it badly. I’ve found a lot more common sense with the carnivore lot than with any of the other umpteen diet groups I’ve looked into over the years.

I’m very unclear as to what caused the week of 99% recovery that I experienced. It could be about what I was eating, about what I wasn’t eating, about the inevitable intermittent fasting that comes with filling yourself with meat twice a day, it could be about ketosis, it could be about autophagy, it could have been to do with the weather getting better, some sort of healing cycle might have come and gone, it could have been a domino effect of a number of things.

I’m looking into all of the above now and honestly the more scientific literature I read the more ignorant it makes me realise we all are in terms of being able to explain why something does or doesn’t work. And the more ignorant I feel, the less I feel I can draw guidance from the sciences of stuff like nutrition or autophagy etc. I feel confident in saying that many many journalistic websites latch onto a very small number of scientific publications and start pumping out articles that massively misrepresent what was actually written in the publication. For instance, autophagy is being sold to the reader as some borderline miracle process of self-healing and cleansing that happens when we fast. Go read the very few papers that have been on it and you’ll see most of it is about mice and yeast, we have no idea when it starts in humans or even how long it continues once it’s started. In terms of PFS, I have no idea if the problem is that our autophagy-triggering genes or other autophagy mechanisms aren’t working properly and that that could explain the persistence of our side-effects.

I’ve been reading about PFS for years now and in terms of science I’m still not sure if it’s a hormone, autophagy, diet or epigenetics related problem. WHAT I DO KNOW is that after experimenting with water fasting I felt 100% better for one day and the sharp pain in my testicles went away never to return, I also felt 99% better for a full week after two weeks of eating just meat and water. What I also know is that hundreds of pounds of supplements have made zero difference to anything. I’m done making expensive urine that can’t produce a 100th of the change that diet can in just a few days.

Currently back on the carnivore diet (day 4) after 2-3 days of comfort eating to deal with the despair of being given my life back only to have it taken away again a week later. If I can remain motivated to keep going with the diet and things get better I’ll probably post something here again soon.

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Post-Pork Meat-Syndrome (i'm kidding): are we more susceptible to histamine?
#2

Makes sense to me.

If your gut is in a good place especially. I know of a few stories where guys used amino acids to fix it. Histidine, cysteine, serine, combinations of aminos. I’ve been experimenting with them and and doing well with histidine, serine. Using betaine HCL with the aminos and meat meals. Using those twice a day and lysine, arginine, methionine, glycine once daily.

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#3

Sounds interesting. Keep us posted!

#4

I think one of the benefits of eating meat for pfs is the raised body temp. Of course you could also do this with steamed vegetables, I want to become a vegetarian but I’m going to experiment with this short term. The meat has to be of high quality cooked at home not what you get from fast food.

#5

Red meat can cause ED. No thanks.

#7

Ei man im in the same boat as you, 4 days and today i broke it unaware. Starting tomorrow again, this carnivore thing is huge thing for us, please keep report I guess if you follow good the diet again you will be back to 99.9% soon

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#8

How are you doing man? Im in the first day of my carnivore/keto diet. Will share results. Did you also eat low carb veggies? Or was it plain meat without garlic or onion…

I hope you are doing fine, fingers crossed :crossed_fingers:

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#9

The fact that he is basically unresponsive on this site is probably a very good sign that his recovery is continuing to improve.

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#10

Carnivore diet, is carnivore … there is lot of information on the internet… autp inmune is greatly improved while on carnivore thats one thing for sure.

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#11

I’m on carnivore again and after 3 weeks am noticing some sincere improvements. I really think being in ketosis and reducing your diet to just meat (basically amino acids), salt and water - puts your body into a state of real healing. It turns on the “opportunity” for the body to correct itself, and the longer you remain in ketosis, the better the symptoms seem to balance themselves out.

What truly sends me over the edge is: hot yoga and the sauna. Yoga puts me into a state of deep relaxation and changes my whole brain. Especially when I do hot yoga and focus of pelvic stretches to reactivate the muscles around my prostate. My libido comes back, as well as penis sensitivity - I’m starting to have orgasms like I used to which are just as enjoyable as ever. It sounds strange, but when when I do pelvic stretches, it’s as if I’m flooding the area with blood and ‘cleaning’ out the area so to speak, and this seems to turn things “on” again. I find myself having the urge to have sex and fantasizing, just like my old self. I truly think stress reduction is a major major aspect to all this. I’m a completely different human being a for a few days after yoga or a series of multiple sauna sessions with pelvic stretching. Can’t theorize too much about it, but it could be that our adrenals are so fatigued post FIN and we are in a constant state of debilitating stress that we just get used to after awhile. The body has not had a real chance of healing.

I can also concur - I’ve tried everything under the sun on here. The 100’s of supplements all made me worse or maybe two days of improvement, the Tribulus was hit/miss, amino cycling, clomid, Test, etc did nothing. If you look through the forums, you’ll see I’ve seriously tried it all…It seems like absolutely nothing I do has any real true affect on me anymore, I just remain in baseline with zero libido, sensitivity, ED, depression, anhedonia, etc.

The only thing that has had a true & honest change for me is the following:

  • Carnivore diet (strict) - like ONLY high-fat Meats and tons of water (bone broth, eggs are fine - carnivore can be really fun w/ cooking a lot of neat meats). This is the main thing that helps. The idea here is to reduce your food intake to just the very bare amino acid essentials and eradicate any foreign substances that can cause potential reactions (like veggies and sugar etc). The goal is to lose weight, lower inflammation, and stay in ketosis for as long as possible. You’ll feel great after 3-5 days.
  • Mix with BHB salts (helps me get into ketosis), Butyrate, and Inulin. Also taking Biogaia L. Reuteri probiotic. Carnivore gives you a great chance to rid your body of bad gut flora and get some really healthy bacteria in there.
  • Hot Yoga - 3 times a week. I go to CorePower Yoga and do there hot sculpt class.
  • Sauna as much as you can.
  • After a few weeks of being in ketosis/carnivore diet, start light work outs. It’s important not to push it to the max and add more inflammation and stress to the body. You just want to jump start your testosterone cycle with a short weight lifting session and some light jogging.
  • Relax, go to a Korean spa and check out their saunas. Just try and chill out and focus on eating high-fat, high-quality meats and avoid high-pressure situations. I was always skeptical of other users saying that de-stressing was a major aspect of their healing, like “OK, wow - yea I’m sure reducing stress helps a lot, duh - we’re all stressed out of our minds. But that can’t be it… there must be something physically going on that we need a supplement for, what will some simple relaxation do?” I completely get it now. When you are ACTUALLY physically de-stressed, your whole body descends into a state of change. There is something that happens in the brain, the dopaminergic/serotonergic system starts to re-activate and you start enjoying little things again, particularly libido wise. It really seems like FIN did some serious alterations to our nervous system, that true physical relaxation helps mend. This doesn’t mean just sit on the couch, or meditate for 15 minutes, you need to push your whole body into a state of stretched-out calm - what really works is going to hot yoga for an hour and stretch out all your muscles, with a good detox sweat, and escape your mind. Your body will enter a state of deep “zen” give your brain and psyche a chance to breathe.
  • Sleep - try and focus on getting as best of sleep as possible. I know this is a major problem for most. When I’m on carnivore, my sleep does improve drastically. The body seems to want to rest. Do what you can to sleep 8 hours, this is your bodies time to heal and when hormones play a major role.

I’d be curious who doesn’t notice a sincere improvement after doing the above for 3+ weeks. I don’t want to sound ultra confident, and what’s definitely true is that this syndrome affects everyone in such different ways. But putting your body in ketosis for 3-4 weeks WILL affect you in some way regardless, the benefits of which you’ll just have to see. I can safely say your body goes into a state of tranquility and healing that seems to kick-start my brain and penis again. It’s really unreal. I don’t want to say this is a cure, but after years of messing with pills and random protocols, this is the ONE thing that seems to shift the needle in a positive direction and provide me an avenue for change. I see actual PHYSICAL changes to my penis, I wake up with morning wood, I come home with a genuine urge to jack off, I have moments of real masculine calmness come back to my brain and walk a little taller. My body starts going through changes again (just like it did right after FIN), as if it’s making attempts at healing or resetting itself again. At the very least, it provides a window of opportunity to maybe introduce pills (Trib, etc) or other protocols that otherwise may not have had a chance of working. What else is interesting: every time I get off carnivore, I notice the benefits stay. Meaning I don’t fall back to my original baseline - there seems to be an unmistakeable change to my body, particularly my penis, that seems to retain even when going back to a normal diet. Once I realized this was the case for me, this became my go to protocol.

I’ll keep reporting back, but just wanted to share this for those that want to try.

Quick Note/Warning on Carnivore: As with anything keto - the carnivore diet can be dangerous if you don’t take it seriously and not stick to the diet plan. DON’T eat all meat for 5 days, then have a big pasta dinner/ice cream on Saturday, then go back to eating just meat. This is will do way more damage than help, and crank your cholesterol through the roof. You need to truly eradicate all foods except just animal meat/fats. And train your body to not rely on carbs and sugar. When you do little cheat days like that, your body will combine the carbs/sugar with animal fat to create bad cholesterol and clog your arteries in a way that’s way worse than a typical American fast food diet. If you’re going to go on carnivore, I would only recommend it for a month - 3 months. Some do 6, but you just need to read your body. But whatever you do, don’t do it half-assed with a bunch of cheat days. This is not only dangerous for your heart, but can make all your problems worse. I’m not a nutritionist, but have read a ton on Carnivore and tried it myself multiple times, so please do your own research and learn, for yourself, how the diet - if done right - can have some nutty benefits for the entire human body.

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Success Stories Compilation
#12

Wonderfull POST, I will recommend after 3 months on carnivore everything you said, and I will add that the best meat is Lamb/Beff organic with lots of Fat. You will feel bad if you are not taking anought fat, that is going to give you the energy to your cells. Also The more fat you eat the more ketosis the more benefit. Also remember that ketosis is a demythelatin agent.

#13

Can anyone recommend a site or book or anything on how to do the carnivore diet? I know it’s basically very simple, but for tips on what kind of meat to buy and how to prepare it and make it taste good etc.

#14

Hey @vkg1 - I found this decent breakdown - https://carnivoreaurelius.com/carnivore-diet/

But I would recommend getting a lot of information under your belt from multiple resources, best to understand the ‘why’ behind how it works. It’s effects on auto-immunity issues, inflammation, the gut, mental effects, it’s effect on hormones. There’s plenty of information around ketosis and it’s effect on the body as well, particularly around demethylation.

#15

I’ve been mostly carnivore with only low quantities of a few low carbs veggies like cucumbers and lettuce for a year and a half and almost all symptoms are gone. The only major one left is insomnia, but I manage to sleep with meds and herbs.

I concur that it gives lots of energy. Digestion is good, skin is radiant and it’s so easy to fast: no energy loss. I even continue to lift weights and do cardio while fasting and it’s fine.

I could make a long list of symptoms that went away, as well as extra benefits I never had before but I’m done doing long posts. I just want to raise my hand and say “it has worked for me too !”

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#16

could be that pfs had properties of an autoimmune disorder or is related to gut bacteria.

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#17

I am beginning to hope that the majority of PFS symptoms might be addressed just by reducing inflammation a lot. Findings/Dx from a MR Neurography study of the pelvis in a PFS patient

It’s going to be so hard for me to do, but I have to try at least keto if not carnivore. Aside from waiting another 20 years for enough people to get fed up with PFS enough to get serious about making research happen, keto or carnivore does seem like the only thing there really is to try.

It’s going to be so hard for me because ai basically have 3 full time jobs and have no idea how I’ll be able to both spend more time eating and more time cooking, but this seems like it’s clearly the most potentially effective not to mention safest thing there is to try. Thanks so much to Ozeph for all he has shared on here about his experience.

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#18

I’m on a carnivore / ketogenic diet for a while. My main problem is insomnia as you have mentioned in your threads many times.
How did you manage to achieve a deep sleep during night? Which herbs are you using as a sleep aid? I wake several times at night and tend to pee more often than usual. Sometimes I’m considering to do some carbbackloading with potatoes or white rice but I haven’t done it so far.

Did you followed the carnivore diet very strict for 1.5 years? Or did you enjoyed a cheat meal from time to time? (Especially for social events)

When I do a prolonged fast for 24 to 48 hours I can sleep like a baby afterwards and wake up more or less refreshed.

Btw, sorry for my english, it’s not my first language

#19

I eat no carbs during the day, only meat and fat, but I’ve been experimenting recently with eating a potato with butter (no protein) at bedtime and at least 4 hours after having had proteins. Deep sleep has remarkably improved.

The problem is if I get up to pee during the night, the night is over. So in the past I was avoiding liquids after 6 pm, but now with the potato I more often need to pee because of the water in it adding to the water to wash down the pills.

I take Valerian extract 800mg, Hops extract 800 mg, Lemon Balm extract 400 mg and passion flower extract 400 mg on one night, and on the other night I replace 400 mg Valerian and 400 mg Hops with 60 mg Silexan (lavender oil) along with the other herbs. Being quite insomniac, I also take hydroxyzine 12.5 mg (anti-histamine) and Clonazepam 3.25 mg on top of that.

It’d be quite a knock out for any one, but for me it just gets me 5-6 hours of uninterrupted sleep and the rest of the night turning and tossing around. I’m rested and have good energy during the day.

This being my last symptom I believe it has to do with Cortisol and Nor-Adrenalin. The potato brings my insulin up and lowers the Cortisol. I believe that’s why I get better sleep. I’ll try with rolled oat (a slow carbs, low glycemic) to see if it can last me longer before I begin to toss around.

#20

I can’t believe I’ll be writing this, but there exist a super low fat, low protein, very high carbs diet that seems to yield similar results to the carnivore / ketogenic diet, at least in terms of diabetes, strokes and heart attacks as well as weight loss (no idea if it helps with pfs or other epigenetic diseases like some cancers). It’s completely plant based.

The diet consists of large amounts of white rice, fruits, fruit juice and white refined sugar. No added fat except from the traces of fat in the above mentioned elements (less than 5 gr) of the diet and very few protein (25 gr.), the rest is 565 gr of carbs.

I’ve been eating almost exclusively meat and animal fat for a year and half and I think I would die if I tried this sugar diet. Nonetheless, the lady in the video below claims it might be helpful for those who don’t get good results from carnivore or ketogenic diet. It’s the other end of the spectrum !

I don’t know what to make of this, but at least it shows the studies and the reason why fat has been having a bad reputation. It looks like it’s the combination of fat and carbs that makes people sick. We need proteins, but it seems going high fat no carbs, or high carbs no fat are two viable solutions. Juice fasts makes more sense to me now (not that I’m going to try it anytime soon !)

Anyway, here’s the video:

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#21

where have you read that ketosis is demethylating? from what ive read its a DNA modulator. i care about this because i am an undermethylator so i may be taking methyl donors and actually be causing harm

https://oxfordmedicine.com/view/10.1093/med/9780190497996.001.0001/med-9780190497996-chapter-23