Yeah whatever freak.
your answer shows all. Insult me is not a answer. But this seems to be the only things you can do and are doing here. You do nothing than trolling in this forum, attack and insult people. Are you not able to give a normal answer? And you call me freak? Thanks a lot you gave me a good laugh with that answer. You two guys are talking the whole time about a autoimmun cause and in the whole time, you did not have a look, how much such a test costs and where it can done? lol Than a guy wants to do such a test, and he has to look by his owen. Why dont you help him? Awsome 
+1
I would say start with basic possilbities. Fin inhibit our 5AR activity and as fas as I know no one has tested for 5AR activity.
Accutane affects our skin and the sides are just like fin. There are many who claimed to have benefited from Antibiotic use.Antibiotics increase 5 AR acitivity too.
So why not find a lab go for 5 AR activity in our skin.
Brainbug channel your āenthusiasmā in another direction, its not need here and bryce watch out for parked cars.
youāre weird manā¦ i really dont get this negative shit all the timeā¦ me and brainbug are trying to get better, and you just sit at ur computer all angry trying to criticize and troll with random comments (watch out for parked cars? what r u even saying?) and all of us are in the same shitty situation as u. i kinda feel bad for u that u canāt handle ur shit rightā¦ maybe u should get off the forums or somethin for a month or 2ā¦ =\
Wrongā¦Even what you call a āPermanent-Post-receptor-hypersensitivity-epigentic-changesā is a totaly funny and non medical & scientific term.
Have you any clue about genregulation? Ok when you try to google what you call "Permanent-Post-receptor-hypersensitivity-epigentic-changes " you will not find it , I understand that.
What I like the most is, thatĀ“sā¦quick and cheap.ā¦than:
Keep in mind, its quick and cheap but heĀ“s not sure what the cost would be, donĀ“t know any institue. But it will be cheap and very quick.
Oh Tim, you might get something wrong. This is not āenthusiasmā. I realy love you guys, you are awsome. This is not āenthusiasmā I dont have much to laugh with PFS but you and Osacr are a great team.
IĀ“m so happy that we have such a high quality people like you two in this forum.
The high quality replys of tim are also great.
Anyway, instead of writing threads, like why the bla bla theorie is wrong or making awarness of the running research, what about to use your time to do something usefull. Find out what such test will cost and where you can do it. What about that? If you go on like that you āwillā look more an more like ā¦ and not like the high quality people you are in this forum. 
What I hate, are people who do nothing, know nothing and are only able to insult and attack other. You two are talking the whole time about your autoimmune caused Problem, but never have checked in this time where a test can be done and how much it will cost!!! Are you kidding??? This is so ridiculous. Other people here want to do something. We are sitting in the same boat and you two are only trolling and start belive wars that are totlay useless.
5ar activity has been trested in many of us. Lots were low but many were also normal. There is a thread on itā¦
Ermā¦ I know its not a medical or scientific term, thats the point I was making. Maybe that was lost in translation. The fact is that what you think has happened is a new disease concept so I had to invent a term for it.
The time and costs of an antibody test are less than having your genome sequenced. In fact there are millions of papers that have been published that involve antibody tests, its not something special. So, quick and cheap by research standards at least.
This is an intelligent alternative to the official theory that ācannot be possibly be wrongā. That by itself is an important first step.
No, I dont know exactly how to get a test like this organised but I am trying to see as many Drs as possible. And I am doing lots off the forum, I always have.
Dont wate your time explaining yourself to him oscar.
Yes, Oscar, this is exactly the point. You make this term, you call it "Permanent-Post-receptor-hypersensitivity-epigentic-changes " no one else. Than you claim it does not exitis. What a weird logic. What is ridiculous. Such Things are called, for your Gen-Silencing ; histone modifications, negativ autoregulations and there are many more well knowen mechanisem how a cell regulates the gen expression. Aynway, I dont want here a discussion, why the ā5AR Antibody Theorie is wongā Its you thread, I just want to make awareness, of anonymous postsā¦and show the people what you two guys are doing here.
Nice, that you call your owen theory a intelligent alternative. Good that you think you are intelligent. ItĀ“s very funny, what you are doing all the time the psychological manipulation. You create funny terms like "Permanent-Post-receptor-hypersensitivity-epigentic-changes " on the one hand, that only has the aim to make this ridiculous, on the other hand you call your owen theory a intelligent anternative. Honestly the Idea is not bad, BUT and here we can see that you do not have any medical background, you do only see what you want to see, do you know how diagnosis works? You need to have a look on the whole clinical picture of PFS. Fin can not make in one antibodys against 5AR and in other antibodys against DHT. Oscar, if you realy want to do something. You need to start like this. Look on the Symptoms all the people here have and write them down. Make a list of the Symptomes and the bloodtests and what they show. Try to make a statistik of the whole PFS clinical picture.
Oscar many here have seen many MDĀ“s this is nothing special, but did you ever visit a MD who is specialised in autoimmun diseases and told him about the Problem? PFS is not a autoimmun Problem, but if you want to check this I help you a bit, what you can do. We all are sitting in the same boat, but please stop to atrack people and the research that is going on. I also can go on and show people, what you are doing here such belivewars are useless and leads to nothing an your raising awareness of the running research also to nothing.
1. Make the clinical picture of PFS. Check this Forum and what kind of sympomes and bloodtests the people here show
2. Make a statistik of this all and what treatments has been tryed and how the people has responded
3. You are based in the UK? This was the first institue I found.
MRC National Institute for Medical Research
nimr.mrc.ac.uk/research/mole ā¦ mmunology/
The Ridgeway
Mill Hill
London
NW7 1AA, UK
Tel: +44 (0)20 8959 3666
Fax: +44 (0)20 8906 4477
Email: enquiries [at] nimr.mrc.ac.uk
Here are some more:
kcl.ac.uk/medicine/research/ ā¦ index.aspx
ed.ac.uk/schools-departments ā¦ -infection
4. Make a date there or call them or write them and take ALL you have about PFS with you and tell them about the Problemā¦Tell them what you think, ask for āsuchā a test, if they cant help you ask them where you can go.
5. Gather all UK members and make a group. ānormalā MDĀ“s do not have much interest in people with a rare diseases. You need to go to a University.
I tell you this all, not because I trust in your theory (I readly dont), I do this because it is very sad what you are doing here and you make yourself more and more to a troll. With all the things you are doing here. People here are not that stupid. Many here do not have any medical medical background and they do not have to have it. Like I wrote it many many times we all are sitting in the same boat and If you want to prove what you are saying. Do it. stop attacking other, stop attacking the real research. Stop manipulation, stop making belivewars. Go your way. Awor or anybody else here gave you this Poison. MERCK did this, this is the only enemy not all the people here who are suffering with you. We all want a cure for this. So stop making war here. Think of this.
LoL you are realy awsome, once again a very good post. What the hell are you doing here? Good timi that you dont waste your time for searching for a institute or how much a test will be. Use your time for insulting people and attacking them. Are you Oscars lil pet? You are like a lil dog, that pops out, make a lil useless and insulting comment ( you also can write wuff wuff, your posts have the same information) than you hide behind you boss again. Sorry, I can laugh my shrunken dick off because of you. Thanks for this.
This thread is about testosterone, dht, 5ar2 antibodies. If people want to post about that here its fine, if people want to derail this thread and troll, i would hope a moderator or administrator would step in. If anyone wants to abuse me personally take it to private message, if your ego will let you.
I could do with more PMās, i dont get many. 
- You are the one who insult attack people and me, now you call for a moderator? LOL
- All was about your Theorie, I even gave you some usefull links
- Just look what you and Oscar are doing. I told you many many times to stop hijacking theards.
- You are the one who called me a freak, why didnt you send me a pm?
- I wrote Oscar long time ago a PM, no reply by him.
- Finaly itĀ“s not my Problem, when you are not able to handle the truth
What kind of weird logic do you have?
The āAR Theoryā says we all have some hypersensitivity to androgens. OK? Fact is despite the time and money the worlds experts have spent examining the AR permanent change like that has never been documented. OK? And lets not forget that no Dr/Prof who has published work on Fin sides has never mentioned this either, even though they will be aware of the theory.
Looking to see if the AR is hypersensitive isnt the worst idea (even if it doesnt match the symptoms) but I also think this has been checked over 1 year ago. storage2.evectors.com/files/site ā¦ nitivo.pdf
That right, it not a bad idea and it quick and cheap to check for, thats all im saying.
I actually have conducting analysis of results in the past: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=4674
But I really think you should look at your own results. I have already shown that your high urine results could be due to antibody interference but you ignored it. viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6523&start=20&hilit=urine#p56499
How to get research started is worthy of it own thread/topic itself. I think realistically someone must visit a Dr who also conducts research to get things started. Thats how Dr Irwig and the rest got involved. A random email wont do anything. I hope to spark a Drs interest by getting an objective test done to prove neuropathy and then seeing if i can develop things from there.
I really appreciate this way of discussion, it is very aggressiv, but I have the impression it will lead to a result! Oscar, Tim can you manage to prove or disprove your theory?
If there are tests for antibodies, anyone should be able to get it done. Cause you have all what it needs inside of you, blood, sperm, urine, hair, skin whatever!
Hope you can do sth. for us! It is good to have this therories and somebody that cares about it - antibody theory sounds so easy and promising - cause it should be treadable, but if it is not correct we need to disprove it a.s.a.p.
Our condition is maybe cureable, but we should not wait that somebody do it for us!
Question: Is that a possible test?
Not OK, IĀ“m not in this thread to discuss with you the Theorie (you do this everywhere). We have results and it is totlay useless to talk to you about this. Fakt is, what You are repeting and repeting all the time, is wrong. Just because you dont know it, you can not find it and you have not talked to Prof. who work on such things, it does mean it does not exist. How many puplications have been done about the Problem we have? Doesnt it exist? By your logic not. Anyway, just for you those Problems are knowen, but for other it is not a Problem, it is called antiandrogen withdrawal syndrome and even Prof. Leibowitz described a stable low level of the PSAā¦ years after stoping a androgen deprivation. We know this problem on many many other things, how do you think people can get a insulinresistenz? This effect is totaly knowen and I can give you many many exampels. The are works about CAIS, MAIS and PAIS where pat. do not have any mutation on the AR/ DNA but the genes are shut down.
You use arguments that can also said to your theory, no Dr/Prof who has published work on Fin sides has never mentioned this either, even though they will be aware of the theory. No one has also never described, that fin can lead to a autoimmun Problem. Anyway, I dont what here a discussen, why it is not a autoimmun Problem. ItĀ“s your thread. I just jumped inside, because you are talking about it, but even do not know any istitute and how much suh tests will be. And yes, If you want to prove it, do it. Find Institutes and find out, what it will cost. But Honestly, if you do it right, you even dont have to pay for such test, when you fin the right institute and get the atention. This is why I told you to colled some datas. I do not mean this ironical. IF you want to do something, this I repat all the time, do ist. I even can offer you to help you, how you can do this. But finaly stop to troll and attack the running research. 1) You can not do anything against this 2) there are results 3) We all are sitting in the same boat 4) If you go on like this, everybody here will think you are a idiot 5) We are no enemys, cause we have the same Problemā¦ Like I said, If you want help, PM me. But please stop messing up this Forum in the way you are doing it. @ timi pfui pfui, sit.
LOL sure if you send a random email to someone it doesnt work. Do you know why? I do. I can tell you in PM. I can tell you also what you can do. Like I said, I even will help you a bit, as long as you stop to mess around the running research. Sorry, I dont have the time to read this whole thread. What kind of tests do you want to do? Just PM me.
Quote me all you like, come back at me with aggression, do something, it will just prove my point that, sadly you are no better than me. Probably worse because you are ego driven. Case closed lets move on.
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Please Brainbug, I have only mentioned this theory in about two threads. But if your idea was already known to science there would be no need for any discussions at all. CAIS/PAIS are conditions your born with, if this disease could be induced it would result in a cure for prostate cancer!!! And I have already posted about antiandrogen withdrawal syndrome viewtopic.php?f=27&t=6968&start=80#p64616 why do you think it causes insensitivity to androgens? The experts on the subject never mention anything like this.
Here are a few more studies on the subject I quickly found:
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8969653
clinchem.org/content/51/3/639.long
clinchem.org/content/51/1/25.full
eje-online.org/content/161/4/561.long
Antibody interference is a good (or only?) reason for your high test result. If your unwilling to investigate this because it doesnt match with a theory you read on the internet then that is simply insane.
Oscar, im not here to discus with you, many things you claim are not right. Androgen deprivation lead to Androgen insensitiv Prostata CAĀ“s this is well knowenā¦ anyway. If you want some help, PM me but You still did not. So I see you want to spend our time here to discuss and do on the other hand nothing. And no, it is not insane. And no, i havenĀ“t read a theorie on the internet. I just trust in results! But Oscar do something and not talk about it.
Side note (since this is not antibody related): I believe there is research from Dr. Traish that shows where prostate cells (not sure epithelial orā¦) were treated with finasteride for 30 days. After 30 days they had generated a multitude of defective ARs. My impression was that the defective AR could bind androgen but couldnāt get any work done DNA wise. More than that I donāt rememeber, I am trying to find the copy, maybe you guys have already seen it. Why this would send my total T, DHT, and 3a-andronstanediol-G levels down so low ā¦ and why that wasnāt a problem when I was on finasteride for 12 years ā¦ I donāt know. But that would seem to explain an acquired insensitivity to androgen.
Personally i am open to autoimmune, epigenetic, or other damaged AR theories too. Not trying to criticize anyoneās thinking or shut down lines of inquiry here. Sorry for the side-track, I thought it was topical.