Does someone have the whole study results from dr. Irwig, dr. Goldstein and the other one from some university in the Middle East as described in the Journal Of Sexual Medicine??
If yes pls pm because i lost them, and i can only find the abstract now.
I guess i will end up ordering the issues of the journal in the end
I have them but you have to go to Greece to get them.
Lol
Hahahahaha
LOL, That was epic SA.
why take jokes on that ?
yes, the theory was wrong but he put a big effort in it and people tried it and gave us a new knowledge
they played guinea pig role for group knowlegde benefit and we take jokes on it?
Yes some people laugh because they arenât aware of the damaging changes in their prostates nor will they ever be.
But when they wake up one day with a PSA reading of 2 and have prostate cancer or even worse cases of urogenital cancers, then it âcould be a very good laughâ for the ones like me who went through all sorts of other treatments to reach to the point of understanding how much the prostate was affected post finasteride.
Maybe i should start laughing today whilst you spend your money and psychology trying to recover your hormones whilst the culprit of your problems could be elsewhere.
So we participated in research studies and visited a series of endocrinologists and other doctors (i lost count how many iâve seen around europe nor the phone consultations with specialists all over the USA)
What was the result? Tens of thousands of euros spent and nothing to get out of it. Only confusion and dissapointment and more side effects.
Every once in a while i pour down the sink dozens of useless pills from vitamins, to hormones to other prescirbed crap to herbs to you name it.
How many have recovered by substituting all their hormones till today?
One? or maybe two? I donât remember more and even them two changed their treatments in the course of the years again and again to end up believing its just the thyroid malfunctioningâŚ
Others insisted on treating with dog anesthetics to get better, like ketamine to recover the lost DNA sequences⌠Noone laughed about that, wellâŚ
Yet a number of people felt better from using antibiotics and antifungals but offcourse this is âanecdotalâ for most, it could not possibly be connected to finasteride.
Well for me it was, the improvement was intense and lasting till today.
If it hadnât been for the testicle issue i wouldnât have bothered writing here again since the rest are pretty much cleared.
Well who cares, it turns out to be that some people here are waiting on others to feel better or worse to judge them criticize them or accuse them. like its their fault that finasteride did this to them. Go ahead laugh more, if that makes you feel better, and wait another 10-15 years till you discover some miracle pill when you are in your midst
50s, and then you can enjoy life at its most.
prop
It is not a theory. Finasteride affects the prostate badly.
Whether it causes irreversible apoptosis and which tissues or which lobes it affects more, well this is something that we cannot determine, because we cannot examine our prostates carefully.
If we could compare our prostates post-finasteride to someone who hasnât used finasteride then we could make some assumptions, or is some research could be done in this area.
Till now the only thing that is definate is that young men take finasteride and one of their most common and initial symptoms is watery ejaculate and different sorts of urological symptoms that are directly connected to the prostate. This is the organ that is supposed to get affected by finasteride and this is organ gets affected.
Some donât want to aknowledge this, its their default. For me and the urologists iâve seen it is clear. Endocrinologists wonât help you with that no matter how much you try working with them. Its out of their sphere of understanding
yes solon, the prostate is affected for sure but in which way and at what level is another question
i mean, sure is involved, but imao is hard to think that is possible recover only healing the prostate.some of us have enlarged one others smallest onesâŚ
greek doc wasânt able to cure the other sufferers
iâm sayng only that we know nothing for sure,
but thanks to all people that keeps trying to solve the problem
this is not a place for a theory battle,
if one theory or cure shows his good effects everybody will be happy
my point is only that people donât have to laugh to anybody, we r on the same boat.
Sure the scientific research is the main weapon, and his results will be the most fruitful
miracle seldom happens but in the meantime some individuals struggle to find way out in some way. if we laugh to them we laugh to ourselves
Well for something to work you must be sure you have tried it properly.
For me by treatment 38 i felt 100% and free of all issues. Even my testicles stopped bothering me. Then we decided to switch antibiotics despite the clear improvements both physical and sexual. This was a mistake but we were both eager and i was running out of money. Soon the prostate flared up again and then it was harder to treat.
In the end for the last 10-12 treatments i used the same antibiotic coctkail mixture like before and i finally plateuad. I am better than before treatments by far. Only testicle issues where the atrophy still remains yet at a smaller rate than before.
If we had stick to the original treatment plan everything would be ok by now, i know for sure ive seen how others got better over there and talk to them on the phone every now and then. For some it takes 50 for some 80 treatments. Few see signs at as early as 30 treatments.
The doctor is not even sure himself how long it may take for anyone to get better. He uses the 30 treatment plan as a basis for all. Its not a cheap treatment but what else is there left to do? I payed 8000 Euros to visit three endocrinologists in Sweden, Belgium and Spain. They did nothing more than gave me a bunch of hormones and problems got bigger soon. The biggest was during my use of anti-estrogens (nolva and clomid) and then when i started dht and anti-inflammatories once again i felt like dead meat. No erecctions, pains all over and no sensitivity in my penis.
I havenât seen any improvement from hormones, nor from herbs nor from anything else.
I donât hesitate to stress how the prostate is affected and it is the most important organ down there. How can someone explain to me that i recovered my androgenicity, my hair loss and musculature strength and sexuality whilst on 4 antibiotics and a crap diet on an island hotel room, whilst i didnât see anything like this in various university clinics around Europe?
There is a big connection down there, probably the biggest.
I wish there was a way to test the prostate tissues, their consistency and what changes down there, then every one would see what i am talking about.
My cousin did 110 treatments, he used Saw Palmetto and he had all sorts of problems. Now his only problem remains having pain during erections at max point. The rest got cleared but he donât care about it because he is obsessed with his erection. Well, i am obsessed with my testicles and forget how i was before treating the prostate. I forget i couldnât sit for more than 20 minutes on a chair, or how difficult it was for me to hold an erection. I forgot all that, because its gone, i look only at my testicles nowadays.
Well, if there was another way to get better i would have found it. But there isnât, at least for me and a bunch of ppl in here. Some just donât want to go through the ordeal. But sitting and judging others wonât make you feel any better⌠Time goes by
and noone guarantess that all this finasteride issue and what it has triggered will have a good end on us
Yes we are on the same boat.
But various individuals for various reasons tend to believe that they are smarter and can judge or criticize others who give things a try.
I tried all and ended up here.
Nor Crisler, nor Arver, nor Hertoghe, nor Chrousos, and no real big university hospital gave me more than just dissapointment. Alltogether more than 100 hospital or private doctors and 60.000 euros gone down the drain. I keep pouring down pills and herbs and vitamins since 2007 and no improvement with any of them. Miraculous treatments offered by well known drs all around and nothing worked, let alone caused more problems to us.
And i found something that made sense and worked just because it had logic and because the rest of the failed treatments drove me there but everyone is just accusing it.
Too bad, maybe i should be like the rest who propose we use hormones or other weird crap for the rest of our lives, or wait up another 10 years for something to happen or some research to spring up.
They forget that we are the ones who participate in those research studies. They jump to conclusions and not even solid ones, based on our sayings and our testings.
When i was talking about âadrenal fatigueâ back in 2007 when i was bedridden, everyone was reading my posts with suspicion or surprise, and telling me that it could not be connected to finasteride or something else happened to me.
I took the chance back then and spent a whole deal of cash and started testing all in labs in the US and it clearly showed that post-finasteride use was connected to problems with the adrenal glands and the whole HPA and thats why testosterone on its own didnât do jack all.
But the problem turned out to be not only involving the adrenals but the whole HPA.
Still people donât understand this because of lack of knowledge and experimentation.
Then as years passed by, various sufferers started testing their adrenals too and found the same issues there.
Today i understand that treating adrenals and the HPA only maskes issues. Once there is an inflammation in your body, let alone down in your prostate hormones only cover up your problems, and massive doses are needed to elicit results. Still some are not aware of that, they think anti-aging docs or endocrinologists will cure them. Well they wonât because they cant. Its not a sole endocrine problem. The sooner someone realizes this, the better for him. If it was i would be one of the first to be cured.
There are other parameters in the problem and the are within ones prostate. Only testing and treating even at an experimental level will reveal more.
Unless we find some urological institution that is eager to help us with this, and start some research on our case, we will only see the one part of the story the hormonal and base our assumptions and treatments on that.
Revealing only half the truth is worst than living in darkness thoughâŚ
thatâs a good point.
if u have the possibility to involve some researcher of ur country and start a parallel study colud be very good.
i heard a french guy that is going to sensibilize a new pfs research on pelvic floor area
Well since you seem so eager to help everybody out, why donât you go ahead with that prostatectomy you suggested may help. It would be really helpful to compare to healthy prostates and we would be so grateful for your courage. Cmon⌠pleaseâŚ
Instead of telling me what to do, why donât you tell us your side of the story and what has helped you apart from criticizing others?
have you tried anything that worked? or just being in here floating around and procreating hate and misery??
solon, are you saying inflammation is the main problem going on here? i see you mentioned inflammation in your post up there.
Yeah for me it was the major. Hormones came second.
And when i was at the best of treatments i saw that picture, i was completely androgenic, strong musculature, hair loss, scalp skin itching, erections out of the blue etc etc
baldingblog.com/2011/02/22/prostate-pain-same-day-i-took-my-first-propecia-pill/
hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=10&threadid=95797&enterthread=y
zimbio.com/Prostate+Health/articles/qRKCTNumwGC/Finasteride+prostatitis+knee+pain+connected
well it seems im not the only crazy fucker implying there is a connection.
I am still looking for the response from a young guy in the internet who took finasteride quit went and measured his hormones, found low testo high estrogen, jumped on nolvadex and in a few days he couldnât literally tolerate sitting from the pain in his prostate
and the list continuesâŚ
Subj: prostate or bladder Pain
Date: 5/9/2005
Can Propecia cause prostate problems? I have been taking Propecia for many years. For the past few years I have experienced prostate or bladder pain after weight lifting (working out legs in particular). The pain occurs 3 to 4 hours after working out, and goes away by the next day. Recently I did not take propecia for a week (lazy on a refill) and did not experience the pain after working out. What do you think?
Patrick
AskDocWeb: Some pains are intermittent, which makes them hard to track down. You shouldnât be experiencing bladder or prostate pain after working out. Have your PSA level checked and a urine sample examined as soon as possible to be one safe side.
i bet i can gather dozens of such reports in a matter of minutes
how do you know it was inflammation specifically that was the major problem?
Too many reasons.
For me inflammation is major factor and in this specific organ, hormones come second. But this is me, others may think its different.
But lifting the HPA also could make you feel better, due to better stress tolerance and more anti-inflammatory hormone production.
I just canât live on 15 pills per day especially living with no adrenals is a major risk for me. Also there is no steady result, one day i feel ok, next very tired, too many diet restrictions, headaches etc etc. And very long time (months) to see results because you need to build up adrenal reserves and proper connections between adrenal-thyroid-sex hormone activity.
More,
discussions amongst propecia users and prostatitis in young age 23 etc etc
hairlosstalk.com/interact/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=27766
How many have you experienced prostatitis AFTER taking fin/propecia or pain in the groin?
I currently have prostatitis and Iâm only 23. Iâve talked to another friend thats 25 who has used propecia and is also currently experiencing prostatitis.
I refuse to believe kids in their twenties get prostatitis suddenly. It also seems that many people who have sides while on fin/propecia get this weird clear fluid that seeps out of their penis. This is in my opinion, most likely prostatic fluid seeping out because their prostate is inflamed.
I took 1 mg of fin daily for 6 months and have been off of it for 7 months. I have been experiecing chronic prostatitis for about 2 months.
It also seems that the people who post about the sides seem to complain about prostatitis⌠(aside from hormonal imbalances)