Update?
JN
What’s happening man?
How’s the meds going? Hydrocortisone should take you a couple weeks for full effect, have you noticed any difference?
Love to hear an update
Update.
A few weeks back I started taking the troche containing all the following together:
-pregnenolone 50mg
-DHEA 100mg
-progesterone 40mg
in addition to taking
-oxytocin 20iu
I was taking all the above once or twice a day as directed.
About an hour after taking the above I came out in a massive hot flush. I went quite red all over and burned up. My girlfriend was laughing at me. Anyway, I took it for about 3 weeks and got steadily worse; less energetic, more flabby in the middle, less good at sport, and erections got significantly worse.
I was previously HIGH in both DHEA and progesterone so I doubted I required these two agents. I was, however, very interested in pregnenolone as I have read it lowers requirement of hydrocortisone (as it is an adrenal precursor) and that it has many other positive effects. On the above 4 agents, something in there made my body temperature rise from 35.8 to 36.4, and I was suspicious it was the pregnenolone.
So I stopped all the above and therefore was taking the following:
Testosterone 60mg per week
HCG 150iu 3 times a week
HGH 1 unit 6 days per week
Arimidex (varying dose, no more than 1mg per week)
T3 100mcg a day
T4 50mcg a day
Hydrocortisone 20mg per day
Body temp fell back down to the usual 35.8, as pre troche, as I expected. Still feeling like I was not quite right.
So, I stopped taking the troche containing pregnenolone/DHEA/progesterone, and stopped taking oxytocin and I asked my anti aging doc to prescribe me pregnenolone alone. I have been taking a pregnenolone only troche at 40mg per day IN ADDITION to the meds listed above. My body temperature has risen to 36.6C (97.9 Farenheit for you americans out there) and have been feeling absolutely great!! Yes, read this again. Absolutely magnificent!!
My brain is nice and clear, I have a barrel load of energy, am really positive about everything, am working 55 hours per week in a very busy emergency department and doing well, playing loads of sport, and erections are plentiful, three quarters morning erections, nocturnal erections, great ejaculate…I no longer feel like a sufferer of anything but an indulger in life.
One point tho; last time I was on HGH I found I needed to increase my arimidex dose. I am usually able to place my E2 bang smack in the lower third of normal range by how I feel, and am confident I can do it again. I am still not sure of my exact dose of Arimidex on the above combination of meds, and it will take some weeks to get it just right. This means that my nocturnal erections, morning erections and libido are fluctuating. Whereas I used to really emotionally feel these changes, I now have no real idea as life is great. My main problem in life is squeezing in enough surfing and tennis into my tight working hours!!
Life is really good, and I’m thankful for the addition of pregnenolone to the above regimen.
Just a summary below of what I take:
Bee pollen
Raw cacao powder
Turmeric
Maca powder
2 litres vegetable juice per day
Honey
No caffeine
Vitamin B12 (dissolve under tongue) amazing for energy levels.
B complex vitamins
folinic acid tablets
6 grams fish oil per day
Pomegranate juice
Olive leaf extract
1 drop of 5% Lugol’s Iodine per day in water
Colostrum powder (from organic grass fed cows)
2 Reishi mushroom capsules per day
Goji berry powder
HORMONES
1 unit of Growth Hormone 6 mornings out of 7
100mcg T3 per day divided doses
50mcg T4
20mg hydrocortisone
40mg pregnenolone
60mg Testosterone per week
150iu HCG 3 times per week
arimidex
I have scripts for the following but NOT yet going to introduce:
Oxytocin
melatonin
DHEA
Take care everyone
JN
JN
Great to hear your continued improvements in your life generally. How is your sex life these days? Improvements in duration of erections, ejaculate volume and force of orgasm? Do you attribute this to thyroid and adrenal treatments?
Looking back over your post-fin experience you’ve tried some amount of drugs to combat this, you make Keith Richards look lightweight. Are you feeling a lot better physically and mentally now than when you were running say 250mg test p/w plus arimidex? Is this the most effective combination so far? Did TRT boost other things like beard growth?
I noticed you’ve switched from B12 injections to sublingual. My B12 is very low so I want to try this, but it’s difficult to know where to look for decent tablets that work as most are meant to be far less effective than injections. How do you get hold of a decent batch, is there something you should look for?
Although we all suffer this in varying degrees and symptoms, I think your whole experience is a good example to the rest of us never to give up hope.
Hey JN,
I’m glad to hear you’re feeling very well. It is priceless to feel like a normal guy again. I know I’m not close to being there yet, but I have made some good recovery.
Unfortunately, I don’t think any Americans could follow your protocol. No doctors in the US would script all of those and the cost of the HGH is beyond what 90% of people could afford.
Agreed, I couldn’t afford 1/4 of that list. Glad you feel good though.
so many pages on this thread, and i’m to lazy to look and see if you’ve tested pregnenolone beforehand. If so what were the results?
One thing to note is that pregnenolone is good for neurotransmitters.
Hey,
Just to let everyone know I have made a near full recovery. What does ‘near full recovery’ mean? It means I have bag loads of energy and play tennis and football to very good club level. Not many 31 yr olds can do this.
I get a full erection within a few seconds of even trying to. I have morning and nocturnal boners every day. My libido is present and feels about right considering I work a stressful 50 hour week. I have a good libido. I want sex 3 times a week. My ejaculate is good and normal consistency.
I eat well. I’m very happy. I have a lovely girlfriend who has supported me incredibly over the last 2 years I have known her.
My scalp is tingly although I cannot verify whether I lose hair or not as I wet shave my head.
I sweat. I feel warm. I feel androgenic. I feel aggressive appropriately.
I am not the same revved up sexual animal of 21 yrs old, but my Growth Hormone levels were highest at this age, and I reckon the sheer spontaneity of erections at 21 is unique to ‘being 21’. If a random girl was to have sex with me, she would be having sex with a normal 31 year. I am not consoling myself with this, merely stating what I believe to be the truth. I get daily spontaneous erections.
I’d say I am a proper, no nonsense 85 to 90% of my previous sexual self. No less than 85%. I feel I am much more in wisdom, application, craft and happiness.
I feel I could live happily to 100 in my current state. I am finally happy. My battle is as good as won.
I will experiment slightly with dosages as I educate myself further (interested in trying DHEA as a single medication, not in the combined troche like last time). I still need to perfect my dose of Arimidex. May I highly recommend Vit B12 (sublingually)?
Laters, will update in a few months.
JN
Great to hear and thanks for sharing. Hopefully that last 5%-10% is soon to follow.
Great JN
Is it to soon to say that you have disporved ARI theory (Awor’s theory) here?
How would him getting better over 10 yrs time disprove Awor’s theory? Since “generally” people tend to improve over time (granted, with some exceptions and to various degrees) couldn’t you argue that people might resensitize as we know can happen with high dose androgen treatment over time?
JN’s story does not disprove anything. In fact if anything it supports it. The need for high testosterone levels coupled with thyroid therapy help upregulate androgen receptors and then overload them.
It doesn’t really answer the question as to which helps the most as he is on so many different things. I am happy for him but most of us could not afford all of these things and it seems haphazard to me. Any other scientist or doctor will agree with me. Its risky. I can not imagine even Dr Jacobs prescribing all those things.
I would rather try and sort out the root of the problem than compensate with very very high testosterone levels. If he was on less then maybe we could understand what gives him the most benefit but he’s thought he’s hit the jackpot so many times that it is hard to say. They all could help but i want to understand why.
I am happy for you JN but I am not sure you have reached the heart of the problem. You are treating the symptoms - rather successfully it seems. If it works for you go for it but i hope you acknowledge the risks and complications.
I’m not looking for congratulations or thanks. However, I don’t look for vague, weak responses like 19 made.
19, the problem with awor is that he will shoehorn his laughable ‘androgen receptor’ theory into any argument going. The problem is that Mew adds weight to this by propogating the theory himself and making awor a moderator on this forum.
I have treated the cause of my symptoms; a hypometabolic state. I had a resting morning body temperature of 34.7 (US equivalent of 94.46 F). I predicted my elevated reverse T3 level (and indeed it was 786 on a normal range of 140 to 440), where say, 150 is optimal.
Why doesn’t everyone talk about the poor thyroid receptor, bound by the inactive reverse T3? This is the problem here. NOT the AR. There is NOTHING structurally or functionally wrong with the AR. I bet you. Does anyone want to bet? Seriously, I’d make thousands.
I also predicted (along with the help of MartinM and BostonUSA) my brief recovery on T3 but subsequent worsening as my adrenals were not initially supported. The subsequent administration of pregnenolone and hydrocortisone (along with T3) has corrected me.
Let’s talk about monring erections and spontaneous erections. I strongly believe that cortisol (thus hydrocortisone) is responsible for these. The administration of hydrocortisone brought these back. Interestingly my spontaneous, nocturnal and morning erections steadily disappeared when I was on T3 only treatment (thus gradually suppressing cortisol).
Still talking about your joke AR?
Plus my body temperature is now a healthy 36.6C, and I feel great. Game set match. My reverse T3 level was 150 (optimal). My Testosterone level is normal, thyroid normal, adrenal normal. Optimal even.
And drug side effects? Risks of treatment? Please, name the risks YOU are concerned about… Why don’t you specify the ‘side effects of the drugs?’ The only one I am concerned about is the dose of hydrocortisone as studies have shown the replacement dose in Addisons disease can cause bone thinning. I am due to receive a book entitled ‘safe use of cortisol’ in the next few days, and I will read it to optimise my use of hydrocortisone. Let me tell you it’s all about balance. Too much or too little of one hormonal agent is bad. It’s about optimisation. The optimisation we had in our hormones before taking Propecia.
Keep going on about your pointless AR theory. It never made any sense anyway. Just don’t support awor in his delusional IV procaine experiment, as that’ll kill him.
The answer to our suffering is written in this link. If anyone is short of money, it’s best to invest in T3 and hydrocortisone, and certainly consider pregnenolone. Oh, and Vitamin B12. Glorious B12.
JN
All so so true JN, I am about to embark on the same treatment as you and hope to see the same results. Do you plan to ween yourself off of HC or are you going to ride it out for a while? Also, were your thyroid antibodies high?
This is truly great to hear JN and I hope that your recovery continues right through to the last 5-10%. Certainly HC/ Pregnenolone and Armour are worth tinkering with responsibly with the right knowledge for many of us on the forum.
JN,
Great to hear how well you’re feeling. Please keep us updated on your T3/Cortisol/Pregnalone level optimization. I’m due to test and hopefully begin treatment along the same lines in the next few weeks.
Usual situation where I may scared people off. I invite anyone to tell me why I’m not treating the cause of my suffering. Anyone want to intelligently state why treating my low body temperature, high reverse T3 and subsequent adrenal fatigue is NOT treating the cause of my disease? 19, please come back. If I’m declaring myself to have made an excellent recovery, I open up my methods to close scrutiny. I want to hear YOUR specific concerns with my treatment. Seriously, give it to me, and give it to me hard.
If anyone wants to propose an alternative theory of our suffering with possible treatment options, please fire away.
There is no point people blowing hot air up my arse if a high percentage of people are afraid to voice their specific concerns.
In answer to other question, my Thyroid antibodies were not high.
JN
JN was it trans dermal preg or oral preg?
Hey JN. Like you I want to get to the bottom of this. I’m a logical man and it is your logic I have a problem with.
Firstly the risks:
- Acromegaly - you are taking HGH. You noticed before changes in your skull. It also increases the risk of type 2 diabetes.
- Side effects due to hydrocortisone. There are so many - easy bruising, weakened immune system, even psychosis or avascular necrosis. If you were not Addisonian before then you are disturbing your whole axis and may become dependent on it.
- Side effects due to too much thyroxine - atrial fib, thyrotoxic crisis leading to coma or worse - how can you possibly assess your thyroid status that removes this risk? You can’t assess how much you need exactly just like a diabetic can not control his sugars with insulin like someone without diabetes.
My problem is that nothing you say is based on scientific principles. Cortisol does not improve sexual function. Show me evidence. I did a quick search and I found
springerlink.com/content/8cg2y8r6jm29d1xr/
showing increased cortisol is bad for sexual function.
Also reverse t3 and adrenal fatigue is not established science and is widely ignored by the medical community for good reason.
Everything i hypothesise has been by using the current scientific literature and then hypothesising off that.
You have a negative tone in the way you write indicating a very emotional way of writing. You do the equivalent of saying : No, but you’re wrong without proper justification.
Lots of people think the androgen receptor problem is bad news but its not. Taking lots of hormones which costs a great deal in a non specific way does not point to the specific aetiology of our problem and sounds like more bad news to me. You have made your theory and you have your followers. That is their choice. I ask you only to bash mine with a logical frame.
.