What sort of dosages are some of you guys taking for the Tongkat Ali 1:200 and the Horny Goat Weed 60% icariin?
Hey CDnuts,
When did these t-boosters really start to kick in for you? Especially the tongkat ali and horny goat weed. What dosages did you use?
Found this link that says their Tongkat Ali is legit while others claiming 1:200 are laughable:
rainforestherbs.com/FAQ.html
Here is an excerpt:
“Our premium TONEX Tongkat Ali extract standardized for more than 1.75% Eurycomanone is the optimal Tongkat Ali strength. The claims of extraction ratios of 50:1, 100:1, and even the laughable 200:1 are all unverifiable. After one dubious company started this many years ago, everyone else (except for Rainforest Herbs) has felt it was necessary to perpetuate the erroneous claim in order to be competitive.”
I think it is incumbent upon members here to at least find or report on legitimate and verifiable sources of these t-boosters so that others don’t waste money on crap. The World A.B.S supplier claims 1:200 and this website listed above contradicts these claims. Who are we to believe? I think some of these t-boosters can also be a can of worms, let alone prohormones. This rainforestherbs website also seems to sell the herb for cheaper, about 26 bucks excluding shipping if I’m not mistaken.
So I’d like to ask you cdnuts:
What sort of effects did you notice from taking the t-boosters versus when you didn’t take them? Why do you say they are mandatory? There is virtually no evidence for many of them with the exception of perhaps tongkat ali in raising test levels even though they are marketed as such. A lot of tongkat ali products seem to come from apocryphal sources. I’d like to know what dosages you used and what potencies you used. Did you mention in an earlier post that you didn’t take any blood tests? I don’t mean to be interrogative but I don’t want to waste money and precious time on things that don’t really work or may even be counterproductive. Please help us out with your own personal experiences with herbal t-boosters in more detail as I think this would be very useful.
Update with this protocol:
After 3 weeks of cycling the 7 t-boosters outlined in this thread, I started my cycle is the pro hormone EpiAndro.
On the first day of EpiAndro I felt cured. The second day I was feeling very good as well. But from the 3rd day onward, I have been feeling usually tired and lethargic.
CD nuts - why do you think I’m feeling so tired? Can I supplement my hormones with something? I’m thinking of stopping the Epiandro and returning to the t-boosters. At this rate, I don’t think I can do a full 1 month cycle of Epiandro. It’s too tiring.
Also, why do I always feel cured within the first day or two of taking these supplements? I took ZMA and felt cured for a few days then my body got used to it. I took t-boosters, same thing. Now I’m experiencing it with Epiandro. What gives?
Final question, should I stop the Epiandro and go to a PCT or just return back to the t-boosters?
Any help would be appreciated! Thus far your protocol has been the best thing I’ve found on this forum!
Now that I’m reading more about pro-hormones I think I realize what has happened. Exogenous pro hormones or steroid shut down or lower your own body’s production is testosterone. Therefore, the symptoms that I’m experiencing might be those of low testosterone.
So now I’m wondering if I should take the pro-hormone and t-boosters simultaneously or I should cycle between them like a few days in a row t-boosters, then one or two days pro hormones, then back to cycle t-boosters, etc…
Thoghts?
Hi newbie,
What effects if any have you noticed so far three weeks into the t-booster regimen? What dosages are you taking and which 7 in particular are you taking? I’m planning on taking Tongkat Ali, Horny Goat weed, Catuaba, and Rhodiola but haven’t worked out the dosages yet. Also, the lethargy you mentioned seems typical of some DHT prohormones. The horny goat weed (took one gram of 10% Icariin) I felt within an hour or two the effects. Started to get harder and more frequent erections.
Hi is it possible to have a concise post about what you took and when and how they helped symptoms? . it seems really important to get thi in one place? thanks.
Saturday the 29th of March: Took one gram Horny Goat weed, Source Naturals (10% Icariin), felt good 1 hour after taking and continued to feel good up until the next day.
Sunday the 30th of March: Took one or two tablets 80mgs each of Tongkat Ali, Source Naturals LJ100 1:100 extract, didn’t feel worse or felt nothing.
Monday the 31st of March: Took one tablet of Catuaba bark 465mg each, Solaray, dreamed vivid dreams that night. Started to feel less depressed and more upbeat, libido higher, feeling good.
Thursday the 3rd of April: Took three capsules of World A.B.S Horny Goat weed 300mgs each. Felt nothing except for some pressure in my head. Took one gram of Source Naturals Horny Goat weed and still felt nothing sexually but felt somewhat headachy.
Friday the 4th of April: Took two capsules of World A.B.S Tongkat Ali 1:200 extract. Felt no worse or better.
Today: Still feel crappy from Horny Goat weed, perhaps it was too much. A little light headed, no jitters but feel the way I do after drinking a lot of coffee where I have pressure in my head.
I don’t know about you all but after two weeks of t-boosters I feel more lethargy, sleep is getting more light and less restful, energy is low, and libido after a brief boost actually went lower. Perhaps I’m dosing it wrong but I am going to layoff for a month and say what happens and maybe try again but at lower doses. Please post your experiences.
I apologize for my rambling on this thread, it was counterproductive and inconsiderate. I sort of panicked when I “overdosed” on the Horny Goat Weed and wanted to get input on what I might be doing wrong. I am willing to commit to a prohormone cycle and just need some advice on these different compounds. Can someone please explain to me the difference in efficacy or effects between all these chemical compounds? They should all convert to DHT. I started Epistane Andro a couple of days ago at 50mgs per day (probably underdosed).
Androhard Ingredients
- 3-beta-undecanoyloxy-5-alpha-androstan-17-one
- 3-alpha-enanthoyloxy-5-alpha-androstan-17-one
5-Alpha Test Ingredients
-5-alpha-androstan-3beta-ol-17-one
Epistane Andro Ingredients
- 3-beta-hydroxy-androstane-3b-ol,17-one
Has anyone had success with cycling the T boosting herbs that cdnuts recommends? I plan on trying this soon (after a juice cleanse and along with a paleo diet, serious lifting, HIIT and an anti-estrogen) and I wanna make sure it’s worth the money because I haven’t heard many good responses to it.
I’m going to read through this entire 23 page thread this week to hopefully distill the key prohormone ingredients of cdnuts’ protocol along with sourcing the T-boosters he suggests.
Can anyone intimately familiar with androhard and the prohormones cdnuts discussed earlier in this thread quickly list the alternative products to androhard since that company has gone out of business?
Thanks very much
Epistane Andro from Iron Mag Labs
Results after 4 days using around 2 capsules per day (100 mgs):
Increased energy and strength in the gym. Faster recovery.
More mentally alert. A bit more euphoric feeling. No adverse effects so far.
Feelings of depression appear to have gone away. Erection strength has increased.
Libido about the same.
Will complete this first cycle of Epistane Andro for 6 weeks and PCT from wicked supplements (res100 and DAA) for 4 weeks. Will report progress at end of cycle.
Hi Cdnuts,
Did you take any liver support formulas after each cycle of prohormones? Seems like a recommended item. Wicked supplements sells “Cycle Guard” to help the liver. Also, what do all of you think about including TocoCaps (Toco-8 clone) in the PCT stack? The TocoCaps I’m talking about is the one from Wicked Supplements and contains beta-sitosterol in small amounts (isn’t this a 5-ar inhibitor?).
There’s very little science supporting it.
However, it may be concidental but my testosterone was tested very high while I was taking Tongkat Ali.
Regardless, high testosterone is desirable but it won’t alter your condition if you have PFS. I’ve tried most of the supplements on that list, including the elusive AndroHard, and in retrospect I wouldn’t waste my money on them.
Fasting is worthwhile, simply because most recoveries have cited it. I find it hard to believe but it’s woth trying at least.
But did you combine them with an intense bodybuilding program? Just taking supplements on their own is pointless IMO, exercise the most important thing.
I’m assuming you were following cdnuts protocol while you were taking all these right?
cdnuts and others with expertise:
I’ve read the entire thread, and these are my main questions:
*Best agreed-upon AH alternative?* (Maybe a few products should be stacked or rotated themselves?)
*For PCT: Resmed100 only by Wicked Supplements? Or do you also need the TransSynergy DAA?
*Is it advisable to add in a T-booster if feeling tired from DHT cycle (from presumed T suppression reported on this thread)? IF so, what sort of schedule of each during this “DHT phase”? EG: 2 days of DHT, 2 days of T-boosting? or stack/add in T-boosting a few times a week?
*Recommended brands/doses of Chryisin and DIM to have on hand as anti-E?
*If you’re not supposed to use the Passion Rx as one of the 7 rotating T-boosters, what are additional product options to get to 7-10 rotating T-boosters?
[Size=4]Androhard and potential alternatives – Comparison of Ingredients:
Androhard Ingredients
Super-Rb-DHEA™ (3-beta-undecanoyloxy-5-alpha-androstan-17-one) 450mg* -
Super-Ra-DHEA™ (3-alpha-enanthoyloxy-5-alpha-androstan-17-one) 150mg* -
AndroMass Ingredients
Super-4™ (3b-enanthoxyandrost-4-en-17-one) 225mg* <----is this a concern?
Super-Rb™ (3-beta-undecanoyloxy-5-alpha-androstan-17-one) 225mg* <----exact prohormones as AH, just half the dosage
Super-Ra™ (3-alpha-enanthoyloxy-5-alpha-androstan-17-one) 75mg*
5-Alpha Test Ingredients
mysupplementstore.com/ironma … -caps.html
5-alpha-androstan-3beta-ol-17-one unclear how much
Stano-Drol
strongsupplementshop.com/cel … edge-labs/
3-beta-hydroxyetioallocholan-17-one 150mg*
Epistane Andro Ingredients
mysupplementstore.com/ironma … -caps.html
3-beta-hydroxy-androstane-3b-ol,17-one 50mg
6,7 dihydroxybergamottin 15mg
Piperine 5mg[/size]
cdnuts, a few more q’s on your regimen:
** How often did you use the Celtic Dreams Allo Spray? Bedtime? Dose?
** Do you recommend the use of BCAAs and/or whey protein? Brand recommendation?
Thanks very much!