I was doing deadlifts x3 a week while taking them, yeah.
But whats the significance of that? I don’t see the harm in trying any of this but I don’t see why you’re all taking this chap at face value.
I am sorry if cdnuts has already told about that point but I have not found it.
Has he suffered from hypogonadism?
Has he recovered from hypogonadism?
It is a very important point for me.
Thanks a lot.
If you’re deadlifting 3x a week, you’re over training. Especially if you’re doing them correctly. I can also see that you’re young, which explains alot of your comments.
Why are we taking this guy at face value? Because he is somebody that went through the hell that we are going through, managed after years to pull himself out of it and then took the time to come back and share how he did it in the hope of helping some of the rest of us. I understand with all due respect that there are some strange people that would fake recovery stories etc. out there, but to be perfectly honest if you look through the 1000+ posts CDNuts made over many years, you will see that what he went through and what he tried to get better was legitimate. If you are struggling to take people at ‘face value,’ then seeking help on this forum probably isn’t for you… its all anecdotal stuff and you won’t find peer-reviewed case control studies in the personal recovery stories section.
Also, for what its worth, I have tried all the conventional medical routes short of TRT, which I didn’t progress to as it was clear from how i reacted to pharmaceutical PCT’s that it wouldn’t be successful (T went up high, but E2 went into overdrive and couldn’t be controlled, and Clomid is very toxic anyhow and i’ve learnt my lesson there). I even flew to the other side of the world to go under the care of a hormonal expert that many people reference on this board, and there was nothing he could do to help and just put me on a tonne of pharmaceuticals.
I am probably one of the only people on this forum that is following this protocol to a T and doing every single step, having fasted, changed my diet completely and I am training like a demon. I haven’t had major results yet (when i do, ill be back to share and help) but why I buy into it? its based on totally sound reasoning… eating super clean, forcing your body into a healing mode, and training really hard to make yourself super healthy and give optimum conditions to repair, with gentle nudges from supplements as opposed to harsh pharmaceuticals.
By the way, I’m not saying that all natural formulas that are championed are legitimate, but the reason there isn’t much ‘science’ in the terms of studies behind all these things is that pharmaceutical companies cannot patent nature, and they are who pay for such studies… its the same reason there isn’t much science behind fasting… you can’t patent just drinking water and then sell it as a product. There is no doubt that pharmaceuticals offer a more ‘instant’ effect but that is because they are unnatural, and bring with them another whole host of problems, the T boosting sups are far gentler so the effects will take time, but won’t potentially wreck you further in the process. And this is from someone that has been on pretty much every pharmaceutical you can name in a bid to beat this.
I think this is the best chance anyone has to get well, to give your body the conditions to do what its supposed to do over a long period of time. Posting how you feel after a week or two of doing something isn’t indicative of whether this method will work in the long run, it will take time and a type of dedication most people would never have to make such sacrifices to give… the worst that can happen is you get physically healthier in the process of trying.
I am a silent viewer the majority of the time, but wanted to post as I don’t think its right to give someone that has taken considerable time to help us such a hard time. If you don’t ‘buy into it’ or believe it will work, then thats fine and look for answers elsewhere. All we all want to do is get better.
A few things:
I am not an endocrinologist. I am a guy who’s vanity got the best of him. That vanity lead me into hell, which lead me to this website. This website, while good at first, will suck the life out of you. It’s good to know you’re not crazy. It’s good to know that there are others in your situation. It’s good to know that there is growing awareness of your plight. It is not good to spend every waking minute of your day scrolling through every post that comes up and reading the horror stories that ensue. Not good at all. It is also completely counter productive to do nothing but think about how fucked up your are. I know it’s hard when it’s in your face every day you’re conscious, but you have to try and move on. Try and redirect your thinking. This is the first step to moving forward.
I’m seeing this from the other side now. I’m seeing how I used to be. It’s awful. Just awful. The scrambling desperation in the PM’s I get and the posts on this thread…just sickening. I get it. Believe me…I get it all to well. I don’t take one minute for granted anymore. I LOVE life. Just being. Just existing, is pleasurable.
I’m going to give you some advice. EVERYTHING you need to know about what I did is listed in the first couple pages of this thread. EVERYTHING. The outline is there. It was one of the first things I wrote. Yet I go through this thread, and people are asking for an outline? IT IS ALREADY THERE. This is a simple concept to follow, just not easy sometimes. You guys are making it out to be WAY harder then it really is.
I will leave you with this…FOLLOW THE OUTLINE. JUST FOLLOW IT. Stop thinking and obsessing over it. You’re making it more then it is. Jump on the program. Stop coming here. AND DO IT. Live your life as it is, now. It will slowly change and get better. It may take you six months or it may take you a year or more. SO WHAT. I struggled for 7 years…7 fucking years of my life, before I started getting somewhere. I took that bullet. YOU DON’T HAVE TOO. My god… you’re just wasting time.
And concerning the negative nancys…the nay sayers…the emotional vampires. Let me tell you about that type. They’ll NEVER get better. They’ll NEVER heal. That type of personality doesn’t have the mental fortitude or the capacity to do what is necessary to get where they want to go. They are their own worst enemy. One of the first things you need to embark on this is HOPE. BELIEF. This is not some magic hocus pocus bullshit, believe me. At my worst, I ALWAYS KNEW I WAS GOING TO GET BETTER…ALWAYS. I made it so. Maybe you guys should learn about manifesting things and conditioning your mind properly. Or…you can just scoff at the idea as some new age hippy snake oil waste of time. Guess what? Either way, you’re going to be right.
I wish you all the best of luck. I’ve done my piece. I cannot contribute anymore. It has been more exhausting then I had planned on, that’s for sure. But I’m at peace knowing that I left all of my knowledge and experience for those who have the strength and fortitude to take it up and run with it. You can do it. I did. So can you.
God Speed.
CD
Were you eating paleo? Avoiding alcohol and caffeine? All of it? Or just parts of it? Deadlifts 3 times per week is not sustainable and counterproductive. I only do deadlifts every other week. Your point is taken regarding these unproven supplements. I believe there are common elements that must be adhered to but that each individual should also tailor their programs to their own physiology and chemistry. I have read on this forum about recoveries where people took no supplements or took various combinations of supplements to recover fully. I also believe that cdnuts was right in that even without the supplements, if you follow the main elements of the program religiously your body will inexorably be forced down a path to recovery. I remember before this mess when I was normal, I would gain strength naturally very quickly and taking any supplements such as creatine or NO boosters or what have you felt counterproductive. I feel that this has not changed and is the reason why my body may not respond well to these t-boosters. But of course, as you said, it is worth a try for those who want to experiment and see what agrees with their own bodies. For the record, I just completed one week of this Epi Andro Rx by Iron Mag labs at 100 mgs per day. I have recorded my results in a daily journal and will now cease taking it for another two weeks to observe how I felt on and off this prohormone. If I feel worse without it I will continue the cycle for another five weeks followed by PCT and repeat as prescribed here on this thread. I strongly suggest for all here to take a scientific approach by keeping a daily log or journal and record how they felt and any progress they made. I have been doing this for the past year and a half and I can see a slow but steady increase in well being and progress to the point now where I get noctural erections on a rare occasion whereas before this was nonexistent, etc… My good days are slowly starting to outnumber my bad days and some days I actually don’t even think about, so it was worth the hard effort put forth thus far.
Hey buddy,
I think I can help. I have come to the very same conclusions and realizations that you have. Your first question is the million dollar question. We really don’t know know what the best alternative to AH is so we’ll just have to do trial and error. I have been taking EpiAndro from Iron Mag Las. I take one pill a day, every other day.
So i started with taking EpiAdro successively and it gave me tremendous lethargy. The fatigue compounded and it became overwhleping by the 4th day. I also flet depressed, spoiibly the side effect of my body shutting down its test production.
After that, I went back on the T-boosters and I felt better after a few days. So then i deceided I would alternate between T-booster and DHT prohormone - the same conlcusion that you have arrived at. So far, I have been doing it one day on, one day off and it has been good. I will give an update in a few days about it.
Each time you go back on the T-booster, you will notice a surge in estrogen too. That is because T-production has been shut down, and once it is reactivated your body increases estrogen production as well. So the way to combat this is to take DIM or some other estrogen modulator to counter-balance the surge in estrogen.
This is what I’m doing now:
Even days - 1 EpiAndro pill
Odd days - T-booster and estrogen modulator (DIM)
**Note: taking DHT prohormone for even one day still causes some lethargy. I drink 2 to 3 cups of tea when I feel fatigued on the DHT days. It doesn’t make me feel bad or anxious. So far, I have been feeling good on this regiment.
One more thing to add: I wouldn’t do the nasal mist thing. I didnt it for a few days ant it made me feel worse after a while. For sleep, I highly recommend ZMA. take it for a month or two and your sleep will improve drastically. Then you can wean off it and just take magnesium at nights before sleep.
I also take wither B-complex tot just B12 and Folic Acid in the mornings as well, alongside 5000 iu of Vitamin D3 everyday with olive oil.
Read what cdnuts says about mixing t-boosters while taking prohormones. It defeats the point. Plus he’s drinking tea for the energy boost so I’m assuming it’s caffeinated which is a big no-no. You don’t want to have caffeine at all. This newbie_86 is also the same guy who drank 4 beers when it was expressly forbidden as part of the regimen and then wonders why he doesn’t get any better. I would just follow what cdnuts said about cycling prohormones and not listen to the “newbie” who has no clue.
I don’t care for your opinion bizz. I havn’t had a drink since that incident with 4 beers. A lot of members that recovered have consumed caffeinated drinks. I don’t drink caffein except on days that I take the DHT. I don’t drink much of it either. So far, it has worked well for me and I will continue to do so.
I’m wasn’t giving you my opinion in that last. I was trying to warn others to take your advice with a grain of salt as it were. A LOT of members recovered and have drunk caffeinated drinks during their recovery you say? Who are they? I only see a handful of recoveries in this in this forum and I believe if not mistaken pretty much all of them have said to avoid caffeine or stimulants of any kind. And I believe they did this with good reason as caffeine raises cortisol which is not good for those in this condition. It’s certainly fine to share your experiences at any stage of this condition that you happen to be in, but unless you are well into your own recovery then perhaps you should be a little more guarded in the advice you give to others…especially such awful advice as you have just given recently in the last couple of posts. So there it is, this time I am giving YOU my opinion, like it or not.
This has already been posted in another thread but I just wanted to highlight it here to reinforce the credibility of this regimen to the naysayers and dogged pessimists, it states that resistance training can also restore 5-alpha reductase expression:
Resistance training restores muscle sex steroid hormone steroidogenesis in older men.
Sato K1, Iemitsu M, Matsutani K, Kurihara T, Hamaoka T, Fujita S.
Author information
Abstract
Skeletal muscle can synthesize testosterone and 5α-dihydrotestosterone (DHT) from dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) via steroidogenic enzymes in vitro, but hormone levels and steroidogenic enzyme expression decline with aging. Resistance exercise has been shown to increase in plasma sex steroid hormone levels. However, it remains unclear whether resistance training can restore impaired steroidogenic enzyme expressions in older individuals. Six young and 13 older men were recruited, and muscle biopsies were taken from the vastus lateralis at basal state. The same group of older subjects underwent resistance training involving knee extension and flexion exercises for 12 wk, and post-training biopsies were performed 4-5 d after the last exercise session. Muscular sex steroid hormone levels and sex steroidgenesis-related enzyme expressions were significantly lower in older subjects than younger ones at baseline, but 12 wk of resistance training significantly restored hormone levels (DHEA: 432±26 at baseline, 682±31 pg/μg protein, DHT: 6.2±0.9 at baseline, 9.8±1.4 pg/μg protein). Furthermore, the steroidogenesis-related enzymes such as 3β-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase (HSD), 17β-HSD, and 5α-reductase expressions were significantly restored by resistance training. We conclude progressive resistance training restores age-related declines in sex steroidogenic enzyme and muscle sex steroid hormone levels in older men.-Sato, K., Iemitsu, M., Matsutani, K., Kurihara, T., Hamaoka, T., Fujita, S. Resistance training restores muscle sex steroid hormone steroidogenesis in older men.
Hi everyone, I’ve read through some pages of this protocol - how many people have recovered by doing this so far (or showing improvements)? Or is it too soon to tell?
First of I am not a naysayer per se , BUT …
after let’s say 7 months of the knowledge of the regimen , at least 3 guys who followed this religiously must have recovered …
Nobody has recovered I don’t think anybody is going to recover I think people like CD nuts just got lucky. There is over 4000+ people that have signed up for this website and we only have 23 recoveries and I feel that all 22 recoveries are not even recoveries. So we’re looking out just one recovery which is this one here out of 4000+ people and remember how long has Propecia been out to treat hair loss over 15 years. People are suffering with this but they are not coming forward this is a long-term permanent problem.
On the other hand I will try CD nuts protocol for the next five years hoping to recover. If I do recover in the next five years or on my sixth year I will be back to post my results.
COME ON GUYS THIS GUY JUST CAME ON LIKE SIX MONTHS AGO SAYING THAT HE RECOVERED AFTER FIVE YEARS AND YOU GUYS ALREADY WANT PEOPLE TO COME FORWARD AND SAY YEAH WE WILL WE HAVE RECOVERED BECAUSE OF CDNUTS PROTOCOL GIVE ME A FUCKING BREAK.
IF YOU THINK YOU’RE GOING TO RECOVER IN SIX MONTHS OF DOING THIS PROTOCOL YOU DON’T HAVE PFS YOU HAVE SOMETHING ELSE IT WHICH IS CALLED SIX MONTHS SYNDROME
(what the fuck guys) 
Maybe you should try the protocol first?
I’m sorry but he said that he had been suffering for 5 Years in total he did not say that he “lived” his protocol 5 years …
so my point of view is legit … but you are also right maybe it takes more time . it’s an individual thing …
Here’s a perfect example of what cdnuts was talking about when it comes to naysayers. Who will all of you follow? This individual or the guy who said that even in his worst moments he knew he would get better. The people that come on this website are only a fraction at best of all those who are suffering with this affliction; and now we are also to believe that those stories of recovery simply don’t pass muster since this one individual doesn’t FEEL like they do. Should we give more credence to this individual than those who claim otherwise? Look more closely at what this individual writes, “I will try CD nuts protocol for the next five years hoping to recover”. He will TRY instead of he will MAKE himself better no matter how long it takes. I believe CD nuts was trying to instill in all of you who seriously want to get better an indomitable spirit or attitude. What this individual thinks is not it. This problem will knock you down back two steps for every step you take forward. Trust me, I know. I am about 65%-70% recovered. This is a ten percent increase since just a few months ago. I am hitting the two year mark and feel like I may need just another year or year and a half to beat this. I don’t even hardly worry about it anymore at this stage, that’s how good I feel. Thank goodness I didn’t listen to people like this, otherwise I’d still be in hell.
this is curable…with all of my heart…I know deep inside I WILL get back to 100 %
I’m sorry but he said that he had been suffering for 5 Years in total he did not say that he “lived” his protocol 5 years …
so my point of view is legit … but you are also right maybe it takes more time . it’s an
CD NOTES FIRST PAGE SECOND THREAD
“started in 2003 Stopped in 2007
Healed (100%) summer of 2012”
No matter what is going to take 4 to 5 years maybe even 7 years to recover this is noted by the makers of Propecia they said people will have the issues that we have and they will totally healed in seven years plus some people will not heal at all it’s noted in their studies
LOOK THE FIRST DAY WE TOOK PROPECIA OUR BODIES CRASHED WE JUST COULDN’T FEEL IT BECAUSE PROPECIA RAISES THE TESTOSTERONE IN THE BODY BY 20%
THIS IS ALSO NOTED IN THEIR STUDIES SO WE ARE UNABLE TO FEEL THE AFFECTS THE DAY OUR BODY CANNOT GET THE 20% TESTOSTERONE BOOSTER THAT IS IN THE PROPECIA PILL IS WAYNE WE CRASH AND ARE ABLE TO NOTICE ALL THE SYMPTOMS THAT WE ALL HAVE
COME ON GUYS WAKE UP
I’M NOT TRYING TO BRING YOU GUYS DOWN BUT THIS IS GOING TO TAKE TIME THERE IS NO WAY YOU’RE GOING TO GET FIXED AND SEVEN MONTHS YOU’RE JUST NOT
I feel sad for all of us we are going through this but we have to think long-term so they’ll be no surprises in one year of this protocol 2 years of this protocol and then you guys give up. Think long-term 4-5-6-7 years
THIS IS 100% RECOVERY
ALONG THE WAY YEAH YOU WILL SEE IMPROVEMENTS IN THOSE IMPROVEMENTS WILL STICK BUT TO GET TO 100% IT’S GOING TO BE LONG-TERM
I GUARANTEE THAT 100% GUARANTEE THAT.