@Papasmurf PAL is a fake/troll. Don’t believe this stupid theory
- Masturbating without ejaculation (e.g. edging) increases T temporarily I believe. When I do that, my PFS symptoms (I have sexual-only PFS) improve for a few hours (stronger erectile response) THEN FALL BELOW BASELINE (perhaps as T drops?).
- I think weightlifting increases baseline T (plus creates spikes in T). I didn’t notice any negative impact on my symptoms during the 2 months i was lifting weights. Rather the opposite (feeling worse after I stopped).
I also felt it, and it is real.
I was using minox or a shampoo that blocks the 5-alpha, and i could find much better the days after.
That’s one of the weakest conspiracy theories I read.
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Yeah, this type of thing is the reason people harldy post their recovery and/or don’t come back. Instead you should be grateful but nope, you get called fake/troll without any rational reason at all.
Just so you know, you have the same credibility as the person you call a troll.
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You asked what logical incentive there was for somebody to lie about something like a recovery post and you were provided with one. That is not a “conspiracy theory”.
There are a few rational reasons why the credibility of somebody like @pal would be called into question and they have been given before on this forum. That you do not understand the reasons why somebody might post a fake recovery using a hitherto untested “protocol” does not mean that they don’t exist.
I’m afraid this just isn’t accurate. @Rb26dett registered in January 2019. He already had an established posting history when, in July 2019, he first reported a drastic worsening to his already bad condition
He subsequently has attributed his worsening to tribulus.
In contrast, @pal joined on March 20 and hasn’t visited the site since April 1. He made a total of 4 posts over a span of 4 days. He claimed to have PFS “constantly for 11 years” yet apparently did not make a single forum post, on any PFS board, in all of that time. Having an observable, consistent history is something people factor in when judging a person’s credibility, particularly if that person is making significant claims.
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You asked what logical incentive there was for somebody to lie about something like a recovery post and you were provided with one. That is not a “conspiracy theory”.
Yes I asked for a LOGICAL incentive. The one that was given wasn’t rational at all but has the same value as a conspiracy theory.
I can come up with wild theories like that too. Here’s one, let’s see if you like this one: Propeciahelp doesn’t want a cure to be found so this organization can rake in more donations for “studies” that have brought zero value so far like Baylor and there is no transparancy at all with what happens to the donated money.
See? I can come up with wild theories too, hell mine is more logical since there’s a clear financial/profit motive. The theory that PAL is fake is just completely laughable.
There are a few rational reasons why the credibility of somebody like @pal would be called into question and they have been given before on this forum. That you do not understand the reasons why somebody might post a fake recovery using a hitherto untested “protocol” does not mean that they don’t exist.
There is no rational reason at all, sorry. He posted his recovery and gave a very thorough story of his past and what he did, there is nothing more to say. And why would he stick around a depressing place? Of course he wants to move on. Especially when people call him a liar/fake, it even looks like you support these laughable allegations with no base in reality at all. And you should know most people lurk these forums, I was lurking for 3/4 years before I made an account.
I’m afraid this just isn’t accurate. @Rb26dett registered in January 2019. He already had an established posting history when, in July 2019, he first reported a drastic worsening to his already bad condition
I read about his story, it’s really sad like many others here and I hope that he and everyone gets better. But it’s not because he has a longer history of posting here that his words are now more credible. Where is the proof he got worse from tribulus? He isn’t even a PFS victim but he has PSSD. I have no doubt in my mind that what he says is true but his words carry the same value PAL does.
Serious you guys remind me of PFS deniers on hairloss forums. I say PFS is real and have x symptoms but many dismiss my claims and me a liar or PFS to be fake.
We should be happy people even want to take the time to share their recovery story here instead of calling them names without any rational reason at all.
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It is pretty rational to assume that some people prefer other people to take risks that they are not willing to take themselves.The incentive/motive is entirely obvious: reap the benefits without having to endure potential downsides. It is risk outsourcing. It makes a lot of sense and is pretty much what most people here do who are happy to read experiences from other people, while not taking any risks themselves. That is understandable.
Now add desperation/immorality and some people will think they can trick people into taking the risk by pretending they had a positive experience on the drug. Again, this may be morally corrupt, but it is pretty logical:
a) “I have PFS and I want to treat it.”
b) “I think “XY” may have benefits in treating PFS.”
c) “I am afraid to try “XY”, because I could get worse.”
d) “Whenever people post positive experiences on the forum, other people immediately jump on the bandwagon and try the same thing.”
e) “If I pretend to have had a positive experience from XY”, people will try it and report their experiences. I will then have more information about whether “XY” can help with XY without taking any risk".
Again, this is entirely logical, albeit morally corrupt. Your argument that there is no rational incentive is clearly wrong.
This is also not a “wild theory” or “conspiracy theory”. A person being an opportunistic a****** is hardly a wild theory. And if that’s the weakest “conspiracy theory” you’ve read, it is probably the first. You realize that there are people out there who think almost all scientists and governments around the world including hundreds of thousands of people (many of them civilian) with different values, interests and allegiances have conspired to: a) fake a pandemic, so that a certain president looses an election, b) to hide the fact that the Earth is flat, c) to pretend the earth is warming to increase taxes etc.? Oh, and Lizard people!
So, a person being an opportunistic a****** and with an obvious incentive is not a “wild theory” and not a “conspiracy theory”. I mean, it literally cannot be a conspiracy theory as a conspiracy by definition involves multiple people. Nobody has suggested that PAL has colluded with anyone.
Now I think it is pretty obvious that there is a logical incentive to lie and that you have been wrong about there not being any such incentive. Your claims that this “theory” is particularly “wild” or “weak” are clearly wrong as well. But I’ll give you one more to end this right here.
This thing, you know, this “wild theory”, this thing without any “LOGICAL incentive”, that “wasn’t rational at all”, “one of the weakest conspiracy theories” you have read, is LITERALLY what happened on a PSSD forum, where a user admitted to have lied about positive benefits from a drug to trick people into taking it. It wasn’t the first time this happened there either and it has probably happened here, too.
I understand that people here are desperate and want to focus on the positives and ignore all the negatives, including negative effects from “treatments” and the idea that some users and their story may be fake to trick people, troll people or get money from people. But these things happen. Ignoring them will not make these things go away and leads to posts like this, where you take up a completely irrational stance and have been spectacularly wrong.
Finally, we will probably not find out whether PAL’s story is genuine or not. Calling him a liar is therefore wrong in my eyes. There is a large history of attempting treatment with Proviron on this forum. People should take into account all experiences recorded here and apply a healthy dose of skepticism, especially to unusual stories from people with no track record. Now, if anyone still wants to go ahead and try to replicate his story, please record your experience here.
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He’s right…The outsourcing of risks/guinea pigs isn’t anything new, and the lack of a posting history is a big strike against anyone espousing a “cure.” And this is coming from someone on the Proviron protocol.
With that said, I’m usually a pretty good reader of people and judge of credibility. Pal didn’t seem to be a socio/psychopath (I believe that’s the level of immorality it takes for someone to f**k with us like that). The truth is we’ll probably never know because of the lack of consistency in the way we all respond to things…it’s enough to drive you crazy. I also didn’t view Proviron as some extremely risky drug, like many on here have suggested. For me, AI’s and SERMS have been much harsher. I think the riskiest aspect is the UGL sourcing (and whatever cheap binders/excipients they might use), rather than the drug itself.
I happen to be responding positively to Proviron. However, the benefits so far are mostly sexual. Not a ton of energy or fat loss, but overall I feel healthier (above PFS baseline) and I have gained a few lbs of muscle over the last month (that’s normally hard as hell with PFS, especially since the gym is still closed).
The sexual benefits are marked (libido, erections, sensation, and orgasm), as if that part of me is responding normally to the increase in androgens. I have no idea what all this means in terms of where I fit in on the PFS spectrum or any rebound-recovery after I withdraw. I’ve got about 5 days left in the experiment.
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I’m not sure why anyone would want to outsource risks. Everyone’s PFS is different, and what works for one person probably won’t work for someone else.
Can’t say I’m not prone to a good old fashion conspiracy theory but I think I’ll go with my intuition on this one. Thanks for your enlightenment
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Great to hear man!
I can’t take this anymore guys the pain is on another level anytime that I walk or do any form of exercise the bone pain gets worse and worse, heart palpitations are through the roof, I woke up earlier and had a panic attack or may have been in a state of psychosis completely out of nowhere I don’t even know how to explain it but I didn’t even know where I was couldn’t recognise my own apartment I’m not making this up it was also followed by intense suicidal ideations this is completely uncharacteristic of me. If I masterbate symptoms are 10 fold, it’s like my body can’t handle androgens at all anymore, the bone pain is horrendous, I need advice guys what do I do I don’t want to die this is beyond torture.
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@Papasmurf I know you not making any of this up it’s like a horror movie. I get you trying masturbators only to see if it brings on an improvement in any way this also makes me worse so I leave well alone. I don’t know what to say other than to prey mate like you
I’m struggling to cope any longer. I’ll include you in my preys. Being with your folks may help make you feel safe rather than being alone in your apartment. 
It’s unreal man this disease is so fucking cruel I have PFS in every part of me including the bottom of my feet like how is that even possible to lose the cushion on the feet all from one pill.
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I know mate. I can’t even hold full carrier bags because the handles feel like knife blades against my palms because of the same thing been awake all night with a feeling of being smashed in the face as my eyes sockets drop to bits. It’s fucking unbearable mate this is on top of everything else and the hormonal shit killing me with anxiety, suicidal ideation, etc. Sorry mate I try to offer some comfort but get into my own hell. Someone out there needs to see what is happening to us. How many more have to go through this before the world takes notice. Get around your folks it’s the best thing you can do right now
Everyday i wakeup in the morning from my unrefreshed 6 hrs sleep, i am just in regret and remorse. I have been totally suicidal since 3 months and keep visiting this forum every few hours in need of some hope. I have read 1000s of post here and i got no answer for my miserable condition. Even the disease is not a problem, but the thought that this disease is permanent and i am just 22 year old who has whole life ahead is what makes me suicidal. I am just trying to cope becoz of my mother. She is my responsibility. She has already suffered a lot in her life and now it’s me. I feel like this miserable condition is due to some of my bad karma. But then again, there are more bad people than any of us who live their life king size. I have started to have paranoia. I have become jealous of people around me. Last week i had my final exam and i was about to faint in the examination hall becoz my body cant handle the stress anymore. My hands started to become pale. Felt like i have nothing left in my body. My results came yesterday and i am the last in my class even though i have been preparing for this exam since months day and night. The depression and anhedonia i have is miserable. I can’t blame anyone. It is all becoz of me and my stupid decision of saving hair.
U need to know that there are a lot of people in this world like u. Some are suffering even more than us.
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Can somebody stell my who low DHT should be the answer?
Low DHT is the Problem right and couses by negativ Feedback in the Hypothalamus because of the sensitiv AR .
So im my world its absoluty logical to use high DHT to to get the AR used to High DHT levels.
Or whats the Problem with this Theorie im new here so please tell me why ?
Yes the the AR is sensitiv but you could rise the levels slow every week step by step .
Stay positive guys , things will improve with time ( don’t listen to the negative folks who tell you otherwise ) , bear in mind that it’s a slow process and that most people won’t heal overnight , good things take time to come to fruition @LazarusRy @Papasmurf
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Can you share any previous bloodwork? This level of anxiety/suicidal ideation indicates your Serotonin may be way too low. I’ve had similar experience when my estrogen was too low due to taking several anti-estrogen plus androgenic stuff. I’ve said this a million times already, don’t push androgens too high with androgenic stuff (proviron included) if you’re unsure what is your estrogen level. Those heart palpitations may mean your adrenaline is shooting through the roof.
Try and test your estrogen level (E2) ASAP. Meanwhile; ~25mg-50mg 5-htp may temporarily help until your get needed tests done.