Body responds negatively to androgens

General Discussion
#1

My body responds negatively whenever my testosterone/dht raises its thus very clear to me that my entire physiology has changed and adopted to an extremely high androgen environment by reducing the sensitivity of the receptors through an epigenetic rewiring making a conformational change at the receptor sites themselves or directly caused a mutation leading to a cag repeat disorder.

Whatever is happening at the molecular level when my testosterone gets high my body is counteracting androgen activity leading to a worsening in symptoms and I start displaying an array of different issues my face goes dry, teeth and jaw pain, worsening of penile tissue, testicular pain, chronic fatigue worsens, head pressure etc etc on the latter I believe those who respond positively to androgens may just have low testosterone or histone acetylation/methylation of androgen receptors that may decrease and improve as time goes on. Note: If this was a cag repeat disorder in their case the symptoms wouldn’t be site specific.

What’s interesting to note a few months after my entire system crashed I tried working out after hearing how people here positively responded to exercise up until this point I still had modestly good libido albeit not the same as I once had but was useable, penile vascularity was good, still had nocturnal and morning erections, could still get mentally stimulated and muscles didn’t feel like sponge so I was still responding to androgens in some way but after working out intensely for 2 days at 4 hour sessions like a mad man I noticed that everything eroded away extremely fast within days I had lost all libido, couldn’t get mentally stimulated, muscles feel like sponge and this now seems to be permanent. I believe there’s those of us who are worse off are impacted in a very different manner through different mechanisms and would explain the difference in patient symptoms.

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#2

I also think to counteract this for those affected in the same way as me is to dramatically lower Testosterone; to put enough stress on the cells and hope that the body adopts to a lower androgen environment and makes a conformational change to the receptors to be able to utilise androgens again while slowly reintroducing testosterone. Btw I absolutely do not recommend this under any circumstances this is just me theorising.

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#3

Your problems sound like PAL who also feeled bad when taking androgens. But in the end, proviron cured him.

#4

Agree, you should check out PALs recovery. He basically took high doses Proviron for 7 weeks which made him feel terrible and after ending that trial within 2 months he slowly recovered. His opinion is that he basically tricked his AR sensitivity back to normal.

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#5

I fail to see how synthetic DHT would cure this condition and I would be cautious in following the advice of a user who has no background history here and just shows up out of the blue like that it seems very suspicious. I will state again that I do NOT recommend under any circumstances someone trying to lower testosterone; this is simply me making an observation as a person who is severely affected by PFS and talking in general chit chat to hear others opinions on my thoughts.

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#6

Do you have low testosterone levels?

#7

I did have low testosterone 8nml were I still had libido but I started working out for those 2 days which made me much worse and got it rechecked 6 weeks later were it jumped to 18nml quite a phenomenon. My body responds negatively to a rise in androgen activity

#8

Have you considered AR overexpression instead of lower AR sensitivity?
Have you ever experimented with soy?

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#9

You used a lot of scientific terms here yet I still believe this to be an oversimplification. (Not that it’s your fault… no scientific research on this condition whatsoever doesn’t exactly help in regards to the average person’s understanding)

The reason I say this, and I’m being frank, is because I’m back on my drug, (first time I’ve admitted that on this forum) and whenever I apply it I feel significantly better and see my androgenic capabilities return. Mucus in my throat, nose, returns, and my arm hairs lighten up and soften. (sign that collagen has returned to hair follicles) You are correct in saying that high testosterone is a bad thing, but in my experience it seems that it’s the drugs themselves that take over and modulate our androgen systems. (Not recommending anyone get back on their drug, at least yet)

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#10

Well fina blocked DHT and lowered it for a long time, sounds logical to take proviron/synthetic DHT and raise your DHT levels.

It’s not only PAL saying this and who got cured with proviron btw. And why would PAL lie, there is not logical incentive to do that at all.

Anyway, not saying proviron is a cure for all of course but it makes a lot of sense imo.

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#11

The logical incentive is that this person is using people on this forum as guinea pigs while he sits back and observes taking zero risk.

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#12

There has been many people here who have taken the drug again after getting PFS and felt no benefits that’s because the epigenetic modulation has already taken place through the resurgence of androgens and can’t be reverted by simply lowering DHT again, I’d be surprised if you felt benefits.

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#13

Seriously? He did that and it worked??

#14

@Papasmurf PAL is a fake/troll. Don’t believe this stupid theory

#15
  1. Masturbating without ejaculation (e.g. edging) increases T temporarily I believe. When I do that, my PFS symptoms (I have sexual-only PFS) improve for a few hours (stronger erectile response) THEN FALL BELOW BASELINE (perhaps as T drops?).
  2. I think weightlifting increases baseline T (plus creates spikes in T). I didn’t notice any negative impact on my symptoms during the 2 months i was lifting weights. Rather the opposite (feeling worse after I stopped).
#16

I also felt it, and it is real.
I was using minox or a shampoo that blocks the 5-alpha, and i could find much better the days after.

#17

That’s one of the weakest conspiracy theories I read.

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#18

Yeah, this type of thing is the reason people harldy post their recovery and/or don’t come back. Instead you should be grateful but nope, you get called fake/troll without any rational reason at all.

Just so you know, you have the same credibility as the person you call a troll.

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#19

You asked what logical incentive there was for somebody to lie about something like a recovery post and you were provided with one. That is not a “conspiracy theory”.

There are a few rational reasons why the credibility of somebody like @pal would be called into question and they have been given before on this forum. That you do not understand the reasons why somebody might post a fake recovery using a hitherto untested “protocol” does not mean that they don’t exist.

I’m afraid this just isn’t accurate. @Rb26dett registered in January 2019. He already had an established posting history when, in July 2019, he first reported a drastic worsening to his already bad condition

He subsequently has attributed his worsening to tribulus.

In contrast, @pal joined on March 20 and hasn’t visited the site since April 1. He made a total of 4 posts over a span of 4 days. He claimed to have PFS “constantly for 11 years” yet apparently did not make a single forum post, on any PFS board, in all of that time. Having an observable, consistent history is something people factor in when judging a person’s credibility, particularly if that person is making significant claims.

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#20

You asked what logical incentive there was for somebody to lie about something like a recovery post and you were provided with one. That is not a “conspiracy theory”.

Yes I asked for a LOGICAL incentive. The one that was given wasn’t rational at all but has the same value as a conspiracy theory.

I can come up with wild theories like that too. Here’s one, let’s see if you like this one: Propeciahelp doesn’t want a cure to be found so this organization can rake in more donations for “studies” that have brought zero value so far like Baylor and there is no transparancy at all with what happens to the donated money.

See? I can come up with wild theories too, hell mine is more logical since there’s a clear financial/profit motive. The theory that PAL is fake is just completely laughable.

There are a few rational reasons why the credibility of somebody like @pal would be called into question and they have been given before on this forum. That you do not understand the reasons why somebody might post a fake recovery using a hitherto untested “protocol” does not mean that they don’t exist.

There is no rational reason at all, sorry. He posted his recovery and gave a very thorough story of his past and what he did, there is nothing more to say. And why would he stick around a depressing place? Of course he wants to move on. Especially when people call him a liar/fake, it even looks like you support these laughable allegations with no base in reality at all. And you should know most people lurk these forums, I was lurking for 3/4 years before I made an account.

I’m afraid this just isn’t accurate. @Rb26dett registered in January 2019. He already had an established posting history when, in July 2019, he first reported a drastic worsening to his already bad condition

I read about his story, it’s really sad like many others here and I hope that he and everyone gets better. But it’s not because he has a longer history of posting here that his words are now more credible. Where is the proof he got worse from tribulus? He isn’t even a PFS victim but he has PSSD. I have no doubt in my mind that what he says is true but his words carry the same value PAL does.

Serious you guys remind me of PFS deniers on hairloss forums. I say PFS is real and have x symptoms but many dismiss my claims and me a liar or PFS to be fake.

We should be happy people even want to take the time to share their recovery story here instead of calling them names without any rational reason at all.

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