I have good/great results raising my testosterone too, the problem is that it last 7/8 days, not more. Well i have some lasting results too, as i am better than in march, and in the last 5 months i used just trt and hcg. But most of the results i have when my testosterone is super high faint or disappear after few days. Is your protocol supposed to be lasting in time? And the most important question is do you know any online pharmacies where i can buy drugs like andractim or testosterone etc. WITHOUT prescrtiption?
Me too I have tried trt 2 times without HCG and both times I felt very good for the first 8 days.
I have a couple questions for you.
First of all, how much andractim do you take?
Also, you said that if you take too much andractim you will feel impotent, and that means you overdosed. I’m kind of unsure of the reasoning behind this. Do you have any possible thoughts on this, as I would think if some andractim/DHT is giving you libido, more of it shouldn’t kill the libido.
The reason I ask is because I’ve been on test cyp, and hcg for a while and switched to ED sub-q. But I just added andractim into the mix. When I got it I put on 2.5g. By night I notced the effects where going down, so I added another 2.5g at night, and it seemed to kick in a bit of libido again. Today I did the same but the effects have diminished quite a bit and the improved libido/ED arn’t there anymore.
I’ve only been using a small drop once a day! The drop is usually smaller than the opening on the tube. Apply it on your scrotum, and rub it in thoroughly. The skin should feels dry after applying the gel.
According to my experience, libido is dependent on a good androgen/estrogen ratio. Believe it or not, but estradiol is important too. DHT is an estrogen antagonist, and using too much Andractim (DHT) will result in reduced libido, make it hard to achieve an erection, and reduce the penile sensitivity due to too much DHT in relation to estradiol. For those who’re not on TRT while using Andractim, overdosing will result in symptoms of hypogonadism because DHT exerts negative feedback on the HPTA (it suppresses the testosterone production).
I totally disagree with you. there are many FTM forums and youtube videos. no such thing ever reported by any FTM. To start with their T:E ratio is already in favor of E since they are girls.
At least one study on Andractim has shown that it exerts negative feedback, and a significant reduction in the testosterone level will result in symptoms of hypogonadism. Regarding FTM (a topic I’m not interested in, and don’t know much about), they’re not using Andractim but testosterone, and by injecting testosterone, their androgen/estrogen ratio will change drastically in favor of androgens, and the steroids will exert negative feedback on the HPTA, which means that the ovaries will atrophy and stop producing significant amounts of estradiol. Females have reductase enzymes too, which will convert testosterone to DHT and suppress estradiol. Testosterone is essential for libido in women as well, and injecting testosterone will increase it, at least initially.
Do some research in the body building community. Too much- or not enough estradiol will affect your libido and erection ability negatively. Sensitivity problems have been reported too, take a look at this example. One of them stated that the situation got better when he increased the amount of testosterone and added hCG. This will increase the estradiol level… Moreover, you can do some research on birth control pills for women. The reason they often experience reduced libido on those pills, is because they induce estrogen dominance and thereby lowers the testosterone level drastically.
Just a small drop? I’ve recently dropped it down to ~2g/day. So about 1/2 of their spatula sapplicator.
I really don’t think DHT is all that powerfull of an estrogen antagoinst to tell you the truth. Not enough to make much of a difference at the dose you’re taking anyways. In the studies I’ve read where Andractim was applied to hypogonadal men that were not on testosterone replacment (thus would have negative feedback on HPTA), estradiol dropped a small amount, but it was a smaller % drop than the testosterone drop. So my thinking is that any reduction in estradiol was probably just due to there being less testosterone around, which would mean less aromatase, thus less estradiol.
I agree getting a good estrogen # while having sufficient androgens is critical.
I’m getting bloodwork done tommorow so I’ll see where I’m at. But currently after ditching arimidex a couple months ago (too much of a rollercoaster ride), and moving injections to every day (to reduce E2), I feel like I’m slightly high E2, with testosterone probably in the top 75% of range, and DHT I imagine should be sufficient.
So my plan (if my assumptions are correct after seeing bloodwork) is to reduce the HCG a tad bit from 570iu’s/week, and hope that brings Estradiol #'s down to a better spot, and I imagine the Andractim will still provide plenty of androgens even if the reduced HCG brings down my testosterone a bit.
How many mg’s of DHT a day do you think a healthy body is producing, considering that it produces around 7 mg testosterone on average? It’s only a fraction, and one gram of Andractim gel contains 25 mg androstanolone (DHT)… Moreover, genital skin absorbs much more of the steroid than your regular skin, and you get the DHT delivered right where it’s needed.
Propecia induces estrogen dominance, and in some cases it gets way out of control - which causes a chain reaction throughout the whole endocrine system. Think about it. Propecia lowered your DHT level by around 70%, and suddenly you had a lot of side effects caused by estradiol, and you don’t think that DHT is an important estrogen antagonist? Take a look at this - it’s from a guy on HLT that sent me a PM:
I asked him if he monitored any other hormone levels too, but he didn’t reply before I got banned. In this case the estrogen level rose by more than 100%!!!
You’re taking an amount of andractim that keeps you in the normal range, so I doubt that has much of an effect on E2.
In this study. jcem.endojournals.org/content/83/8/2749.full
Guys were getting 16, 32, and 64mg doses of DHT (probably all larger doses than you are taking) and they were producing serum DHT levels that were 2x, 3x, and 4x the top of the normal DHT range. Those groups showed 17%, 18%, and 29% drops in estradiol respectivly. However because they wern’t on TRT their testosterone dropped 25%, 44%, and 74%. That’s a fairly small drop in estradiol, and how much of it can be attributed to DHT anti-aromatase effects? I think simply having less aromatasable androgen (testosterone) in their systems was what was probably the big reason for the drop in E2 here.
On TRT you wouldn’t have that drop in testosterone by adding andractim into the mix. So, if their aromatasable androgen (testosterone) stayed the same, would their E2 of even dropped? Maybe like a couple % drop, I don’t know, but it doesn’t seem like all that powerful of an aromatase inhibitor from this, and other studies I’ve read on the subject.
How was your numbness before and after your protocol Enden?
I used testim gel for the previous 3 days, 100 mg the first 2 days and 50 mg yesterday, very good for libido but it made me almost impotent. I went almost back to my first pfs stage, the one before taking any drugs, that is to say good libido but impotent or with severe ed. Testosterone syringes, 250 mg didn’t give me the same effect, the first 2 gave me good improvements in everything, than no results, as if i had taken nothing. How can testim gel applied on shoulders and back effect so strongly (in a negative way) erection??? I want to try andractim, how much do you use and where do you apply it precisely ?
I don’t think DHT works as an aromatase inhibitor. If you had removed gynecomastia with Andractim, you would understand how potent it actually is as an estradiol antagonist. I believe that DHT antagonizes estradiol on cell level. The male body is dependent on estradiol as well, but too much stimulation causes severe dysfunction. DHT keeps it in check. It could be the other way around, that estradiol actually antagonizes DHT, considering that it’s a potent reductase inhibitor, and exerts strong negative feedback to the HPTA. It doesn’t change the situation though. Too much estradiol will cause a lot of problems, and DHT will solve it.
It varies with the androgen/estrogen ratio. If I don’t have enough estradiol, my libido goes down, it’s harder to achieve an erection, and the sensitivity gets reduced. When it’s optimal, it’s all good. With a little bit more estradiol, libido seems to increase, sensitivity is good, but I get worse symptoms of ED. With way too much estradiol, libido disappears, and I’m left with severe ED/impotence.
Morning erections are the most important indicator of a healthy androgen/estrogen ratio.
Too much of the testosterone is probably converted to estradiol. Try 50 mg Testim applied to your chest and shoulders, with a small drop of Andractim applied to your scrotum - around the testicles. Andractim comes in a tube, and the drop shouldn’t be larger than the opening.
Andractim is available here: allsaintsclinic.org/testosterone-gel.shtml
That’s my source, and it’s legit. Before I ordered the first time, I asked the doctor to write me a prescription and send it to me by mail - and he did. They’re shipping from Cyprus, so expect some weeks for delivery.
i have andractim, i just wanted to know how you use it, in particular how much you use and where you apply it.
Esermon: I think Enden’s advice is good. In my experience if I have libido it means my DHT is good, but if I have ED it means my E2 is probably too hgih or too low. In your case it would make sense that it is too high. Like Enden said I’de back off a bit, but I’de prob get some bloodwork first to know exactly what’s going on.
If you are using gels though I’m not sure andractim is necesary really. You should have decent DHT levels already as evidence by good libido. I’de reduce testim till E2 is good. Then if there’s not enough androgen’s kicking around to do their job while E2 is good you could either a) apply a small % of your daily testim application to your scrotum which will increase DHT, and thus make a significant improvment in androgens. Or b) like Enden said, use some andractim.
I’m not really following to tell you the truth.
From what I can tell, you are saying that it isn’t a good aromatase inhibitor, thus it doesn’t really reduce the amount of estradiol in the body, but rather DHT competes with it at the receptors. However, wasn’t your post before this one trying to show how much much someone’s serum E2 increased by blocking DHT?
I don’t know, I just don’t think it has all that powerful of an effect on E2 at the doasages we are talking about (around the top of the normal range). There was a time when I was on monotherepy and my E2 was triple the top of the normal range. I really don’t think a bit of DHT would have made much difference in the extreme bloating, extreme brain fog, extreme no libido/ED. Maybe if someone was a small titch too high of E2, getting up to the top of the normal range in DHT might reduce E2 enough.
Look, it’s hypothetical - and I said I don’t think DHT works as an aromatase inhibitor. I’ll have to look for some studies to figure that out. However, it doesn’t have to work as an AI to antagonize estradiol. Hormones are synthesized regularly by the body, because when a molecule binds to a receptor, it’s gone. I believe that a constant process where something is turned on by one hormone and off by another one, will maintain the ratio between those hormones, simply by using them continuously. That would explain how estradiol could get out of control when the DHT level is reduced by 70%. Estrogen receptors will get saturated fast, which leads to a process in the target organs and tissues. If this process is slower than the normal, estradiol is likely to accumulate.
Who said my libido is good? I said my libido was good on testim, i’m pretty sure my low libido equals to low testosterone, hcg and testim now gave me good results, last time i had blood test done i had dht almost over the limit, quite low estradiol and low libido as testosterone was below the limit. Enden is it so difficult for you to answer my questions?? It takes 10 words not more to do that!!!
Fair enough.
Couple questions for you as me and you are basically doing the same protocol.
-
Are you still currently doing good on this protocol as far as libido, ED, and mood go?
-
I just got some blood work back (everything except DHT which will be in next monday). This is the first time I’ve gotten them since moving to ED sub q shots of Test cyp, and HCG.
Total Test - 13.4. Ref range 8.4-28.7
Free Test - 49.1. Ref Range 31-94
Estradiol - 86. Ref range <150 (fwiw, when converted to Pmol/L, it is 23Pmol/L)
Currently I am doing
80iu’s HCG/day (570ius/week total)
13mg Test cyp/day (91mg test/week)
50mg DHT per day
So, from moving from weekly shots and no andractim to ED shots, and andractim, my total test has dropped from 21 to 13.4; however, my free test is about the same. My estradiol has also dropped from 170 to 86 (or 46Pmol/L to 23Pmol/L).
My Libido, mood, energy, puffyness, etc… have all seen major improvments. They’ve been great. Erections are somewhat improved, but still not good enough for sex, and no morning wood or anything.
I’m curious what my DHT labs come back. But what do you think? E2 looks good. Test levels should be fine as DHT is more androgenic/important then testosterone. I don’t really want to raise testosterone (aromatizable androgens) as it will cause E2 to go up, and I really don’t want to deal with arimidex or anything. The only way it might make sense to increase test would be to reduce HCG a bit (very high aromatase), and increase test cyp (not aromatase as HCG).
So what do you think? I’m thinking I should probably do what you said, and reduce andractim down to 10mg/day. I’m not sure if I should also change the test/HCG thing as well like I said in the previous paragraph at the same time. Or maybe just wait, and only change 1 thing at a time.
Thoughts?