Besides OP, has anyone else experienced permanent improvements with their sleep after cycling tribulus?
Yes went away after 2 days of stopping it, Im so desperate I don’t know what else to do at this point it’s either experiment or suicide and I’m not trying to kill myself anytime soon.
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I haven’t cykled for 3 weeks now and my sleep has improved the best, Alot of 7-8 hours without waking up.
It’s only 3 weeks but I haven’t been able to sleep this good since I had pfs in 2013.
I’m hoping that I will improve further over time because a lot of people been reporting that they had big improvements after long time with good sleep routine
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Wow, that’s remarkable. Mind if I ask what your cycling regimen was like? How long did you abstain from ejaculating?
I pretty much copied the OP:s regime, but without the testosterone to push start. Only tribulus.
I did like 7-10 day each time and then waited a week before I cotinued. I did up to maximum 7 or 8 pill before I stopped.
My best improvements came after the second or/and third cycle but I masturbated every day because I was stunned, frankly.
Anyway some days after my cycle ended I felt extremely depressed after ejaculation and was in a terrible state mentally for like the next day, then feelt awesome again. This happened in two occasions before I decided to only ejaculate once a weekand only during tribulus cykle. I felt good but didn’t improve like the beginning. That’s why I’m wondering (like others) if it’s best to keep it to smaller amounts?
Now it still feels I’m having like fluctuating of improvements back and forth, hard to describe but feels good in general. Like I pushed a step up the ladder.
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Did you use Mediherb tribulus?
That’s really good to hear. Hopefully the fluctuations are a good sign that improvements are just a matter of time. So you masturbated every day since day 1 of taking tribulus then cut back later on to only on the weekends during on-cycles, am I reading that right?
Yes, but I am not 100 % sure, the Fluctuations can also mean that I’m slowly going back to the state I was before the tribulus. I’m not saying that’s the case, just that it’s very hard to know what to make of everything.
I used mediherb tribulus brand
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Have you ever felt that Tribulus making you worse before seeing the improvements?
This is something interesting, when I have the big crash, I have dull masturbation no joy at all, then over the time I star feeling more satisfaction while masturbation or sex, but after masturbation I feel bad, now I do not have those problems anymore.
I have those fluctuations until recently, but I am not feeling fluctuation neither for awhile.
The same with panic attacks, I use to have consecutive panic attacks, and also panic
Attacks are gone.
Fluctuations are part of the recovery at least is what I believe.
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Has anyone used World ABS trib? It’s supposedly 45% protodioscin. I tried to buy Mediherb off their website but it said I need to see a practitioner.
For me it didn’t make me feel worse in general, maybe in one last cycle, maybe The first couple of cycles it felt truly amazing.
I read all of your posts, very interesting
@jinstewart @Quest your AR might be too highly upregulated. I know that before I experimented with soy I could get good results off just 1/4 of a pill of tribulus, if I took a full pill of tribulus then it would agitate my PFS; only after I did extensive experimentation with soy and lowered my androgen receptor density could I use a pill of tribulus and have normal results (I had similar results with creatine too that I discussed in another thread). In this respect, its logical that in order to make the tribulus cycle work properly we should start from a position of average density androgen receptors and not PFS highly upregulated and dense androgen receptors. This is just my guess though, it sounds logical enough
secondly, I think that the overall method outlined in this tribulus protocol is something useful that we should perhaps consider applying to other problems as well. I think its entirely possible that tapering onto and off of various supplements may be the key to solving PFS/PSSD/PAS etc. I think that tribulus is a crucial component of this protocol yes, but many people have used tribulus in the past (including myself) without much to show for it, it appears that only after people began dosing tribulus in a certain way that they began to see results. I think its plausible that we could see similar effects by dosing things like creatine, mucuna pruriens, saint johns wort, gingko biloba (for PSSD) etc. I feel as if gradually increasing and decreasing the dosage of something can affect the homeostasis of the body in a unique way that conventional dosing patterns cannot.
My own theory about how this works is that when using an “additive” substance (IE something that increases a hormone/receptors/etc) it must be gradually phased up and down in order to work optimally with the body, meanwhile when using a “subtractive” substance (something that decreases hormones/receptors etc) then it obviously doesnt require such a dosing mechanism since you are taking away instead of adding.
To give a clearer mental picture of the dynamic that im discussing, think of it this way: it takes a lot of time and effort to make a painting, but you can destroy a painting much much faster.
In the same way, when using an additive substance you have to gradually ease into and out of it to get optimal results, but obviously if youre using a subtractive substance then you will get results no matter what by virtue of the fact that you are “taking something away”, “destroying something”; therefore subtractive substances have an effect on the body by virtue of a subtractive mechanism, which requires no finesse or buildup. What im saying is a bit philosophical, but it has practical implications for the body as well.
As for myself, I have recently started doing the tribulus protocol. I will report my own results in a few weeks. That being said, I understand that its possible that I may not see any results in the beginning so because of that I am preparing myself to do numerous cycles of this over many months.
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How do you think tribulus fits in with your other trial of soy? Didn’t you say the soy would downregulate AR while the Tribulus would just upregulate AR? Seems counterintuitive
@jinstewart and @Quest said that they were having difficulties doing the tribulus protocol because they were too sensitive to normal amounts of tribulus; this is strongly suggestive that their androgen receptor density is too high.
Also I want to add that originally I thought that tribulus only upregulated the androgen receptors, but now I believe that it also increases 5ar as well. That being said, I dont think it increases testosterone which is what confuses a lot of people when it comes to whether or not tribulus increases androgens or not
The way that soy fits into the tribulus protocol is that if your androgen receptor density is too high then tribulus may not work out quite as smoothly since your threshold for tolerating normal amounts of DHT will be significantly lower due to androgen receptor density being too high; however (assuming that your androgen receptor density is too high) if you use soy then this will downregulate your androgen receptors and allow you to properly activate and reupregulate your androgen receptors using tribulus.
Basically, my impression is that if you want to fully reactivate androgen receptor functioning then you have to acclimate your body to ever increasing amounts of tribulus/5ar, however this is impossible to do if your receptors are overly dense. Only by reducing receptor density can make it so that your body has the proper tolerance for high levels of DHT (caused by taking high amounts of tribulus).
In other words, androgen receptor density and androgen receptor sensitivity are two different things. Soy fixes the androgen receptor density problem, tribulus fixes the androgen receptor sensitivity problem. In theory, in order to fully resensitize the androgen receptors you must have normal androgen receptor density, if your androgen receptors are overly upregulated then your androgen receptors can only resensitize to a certain degree before the body begins to reject androgens due to overstimulation as a result of the androgen receptors being too sensitive AND too dense. This problem is avoided by reducing androgen receptor density. Does this make more sense?
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That’s a very interesting idea, yes. I felt a little better after using sulforaphane (high dose for a couple days) which does I believe destroy ARs.
However, I felt minimal/slight improvement on R-Andro, which increases DHT ofc. Definitely don’t recall feeling worse on it.
Does that fit in with what you’re thinking? I’m not one for the medical theory things so please carry on explaining friend. And thanks also.
Reckon it’s worth another run of sulforaphane or going with soy? If so, how much soy we thinking?
Might be worth mentioning @NYscientist again, who got better cycling sulforaphane (we assume, he improved loads and stopped coming! 
) Also felt mentally LOTS better on St John’s Wort, which seems to have dropped back a little but DEFINITELY improved me mentally a LOT.
Did a substantial run of RU486 too (800mg for 5 days) and felt a little better on it, but sleep was back to pre-PFS for the duration and about a week after. I don’t think much ‘stuck’ from the RU run though.
Hope that’s some good!
Hey guys, do any of you know of a way to get mediherb Tribulus in the UK?
So I just wanted to give a slight update - things I’ve been doing recently include:
- slowly cutting weight (to preserve as much muscle as possible) - running 1 or 2x weekly, lifting, jump rope and cycling. I’ve lost 3-4 lbs of body fat, which helps get rid of excess estrogen
- Vitamin D & K supplementation on the reg - I switched from K2 MK4 to MK7 recently but I’m not sure if that makes a diff, my Vit. D levels were super low
- Tribulus “cycles” - I don’t even cycle anymore, sometimes I’ll just take 2 pills at once for 2-3 days in the morning (this seems more effective than taking them in the night or taking them multiple times per day) and then let the rebound hit me, it seems that the comeback is when the improvements happen anyway
- LLLT - using this on my head to help maintain my hair, but along this I noticed that after using a red light on my head for 20 minutes every other day, for some time afterward I’ll feel more cognitively capable. This could be placebo but I’m mentioning it here anyway as I’ve been doing this.
Anyhow between all these things, I’ve had some changes. Somewhere along the line, something turned back on in my head, and I’ve rediscovered my interest in motorcycles. I haven’t considered buying one in years, and just out of nowhere, I suddenly felt the urge to seriously buy a bike again. Today I’ve gone and taken a medical exam and signed up for the ‘A’ class license and will be taking bike riding lessons starting next week most likely. Pretty crazy. I have no idea where this came from and it feels weird that I am even interested in this again and if you told me a month ago I’d be doing this I would say “There is no way I’d feel that motivated or capable to do something like that”. Well anyway, that’s it. I think any kind of increased desire to do constructive or creative things is indicative of an improvement in well being so I thought I’d mention it here.
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Skate on my son
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How have you been sleeping since starting the tribulus?