Tissue changes discussion

#1

Hey guy’s i posted a few pictures of my skin in my initial posting when i joined, but I’d like to make a full thread dedicated to it.
I’m very interested to see if anyone is experiencing the same or similar changes in regard to skin, fat, muscle etc.
I feel visualisation makes things much easier to understand so I will upload a few pictures.
I don’t really feel human anymore and am completely disconnected from my own body but I’m holding on to the hope that one day or sometime soon we all can be normal or near to that as possible again, stay strong eveyone :heart:

The first three images show a leather like skin texture or rippling effect, i can’t exactly remember when this happened but probably around the same time my hands, joints etc became sore and weak a few months after stopping accutane.

The next few image’s show skin hyper elasticity, notice the fat I stretch out in some places, that in reality for me is lumpy and spongey, like my body is filled with broken down polystyrene. This is present in my thighs, chest, man boobs, arms and biceps. The fats also stringy in some places, like hard lumpy strings of fat, very unusual. This stuff im talking about also effects my penis too, blue veins, stretchy skin etc. I can stretch out my temple skin on my face along with other features too.

Next is skin thinning, i have visible blue veins under my eyelids, palms of hands, top of hands and some on my chest. I can see a few red capillaries in places too.

Lastly I’ll just add i gained a lot of weight through all this happening and my stomach always seems to bloat when i eat or just feels weird all the time, but unlike being fat, my skin became looser and looser.

The skin doesn’t heal, getting a scratch leaves a white scar, previous scars hurt to touch, scars will swell and my skin goes red if i touch it generally. If you look at my initial posting you’ll see the red lines around stomach fat, that happens body wide in regards to redness.
I’ll also add my fingers feel like bone wrapped in loose skin, i can feel the veins, tendons etc under it very easily, the same with my arm, i can feel my actual nerves and they hurt to touch, probably from the lack of so fat protecting them, if i stretch my arm out slightly i get little electric shocks like the nerves or tendons underneath have all shriveled up and i stretch them out eveytime i move.

There’s a few other things like loads of stretch marks that suddenly occurred in multiple places but they’re hard to pick up on camera.
I’d love to hear from others im regards to changes in your own tissue and also if anyone has speculation on what could be the cause, feel free to share, if it is androgens, could they cause this much of a mess? Or could accutane work im some other way in regards to skin?

  • EDIT

Forgot to add the skins very soft too, so it leaves Imprints of anything very easily, this is a picture after i layed on my bed for a few minutes, the imprints last a fair amount of time afterwards, they don’t just go away in a few minutes like they should.

EDIT - Images removed at request of author (30/Dec/18).

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#2

Thank you for sharing man, I also feel like visualization makes things easier to understand since its rare we see another person with PFS or anything of the alike in person.

While I don’t have PFS, my body has undergone vast changes. I will note a few and post pictures accordingly when I find the time.

  • Skin texture has become hard and dry. I no longer produce body sebum, at all. I only produce it on my nose and forehead now. I used to produce it in copious amounts on my entire body, so much that’d I would get acne from it. My skin also doesn’t flush with blood like it used to, it’s like its getting less circulation to the capillaries.

  • One of the most prominent traits about me was my vascularity, everything from my hands, legs, chest, shoulders, arms, even to my genitals. Everyone knew me for it. Now, I am literally not vascular at all. As my condition gets worse I’ve become less vascular and my veins even look different, like they’ve aged. Speaking on vascularity, my blood pressure has also dropped some. It used to be 130/80 and now it’s 110/65. My arms and legs fall asleep very quickly, so I know my circulation has taken a hit as well. Subsequently, I get cold extremely easily in my extremities.

  • Hair texture has become hard and dry as well. In addition, I am losing it on my entire scalp, eyebrows, nose hair, eye lashes. However, on my body, it still grows just as fast as it ever did, except about half my hair doesn’t grow anymore, it just stays as a small stub. This is something you can clearly see in pictures.

  • My muscle has become less dense and hard. It no longer feels the same is also squishy. This used to happen to me when I was completely normal. Low or high estrogen caused this. If my estrogen was in the normal range, it would feel extremely hard and dense. I no longer get a pump (active hyperemia). In addition to this, I’ve lost 12kg of muscle at least. And at 5’4, that is A LOT of muscle.

  • Lastly, my nails are much more dry, grow much slower, and the distal part of the nail where it becomes a an opaque white starts earlier on my nail bed.

I will be more than happy to post documentation of this.

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#3

Hey Gents thanks for the response.
Yes i completely understand what you said about your veins looking aged, i actually didn’t have any veins showing but now the tops of my hands have thinned so veins pop up through, but yes some seem to just look a bit odd in general.

My hair was actually the thing that people commented on with me, always had great hair and now that’s also gone thinner with a straw like texture and is very dry etc like yourself.

That’s very interesting about your muscles, how they feel soft or squishy, i think my biceps have gone squishy but it’s hard to tell with the lumps and elastic skin on top of it. Probably a mix of both for me anyhow.

I’d be more than happy to see your documentation when you have time.

#4

Thanks for sharing Devo, hope you’ve been well.

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#5

I have the exact same body changes as you devolution plus some more, i even found small lumps under my breasts. I feel we lack dht to the point estrogens run freely in our systems wrecking havoc. I think estrogen dominant men have the same symptoms (not 100% sure too brainfogged atm)

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#6

Thanks a lot @Devolution for posting your pictures.

I’m so sorry that you have had to experience all of this. I know how much it impacts. Like other pfs symptoms we were all completely unprepared for this curve ball. It is not what we expected from life and also not something any of us should have had to face. I really admire you and if the technology was there I’d offer you a virtual brothers in arms hug.

You know that test that they sometimes demonstrate in biology classes to show the elasticity of your skin? Where you pinch the skin on the top of your hand and see how long it takes to return? Has that been compromised at all? I know as a young man it should spring back.

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#7

This is called Skin Turgor and it’s to test how hydrated you are

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#8

If its for hydration, would that lead us to believe it’s absorption problems. I suspect if that is the case then maybe the liver/gut/gallbladder is the key to healing. We’ve been trying this for several months now.

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#9

No… absolutely not. Hydration is modulated almost primarily through the kidneys due to hormone release. Sex hormones, aldosterone, ADH, and renin are the biological mediators of hydration. If one of these hormones have been altered you will see changes in your hydration. However, with us, we know that our receptors have been functionally changed. And as we have seen with holyhead and myself, this has caused water retention. This is called intracellular hydration.

In addition, alterations in hormone signaling will affect your actual tissue hydration and integrity. For example, I am holding a lot of water and I am well hydrated, but my actual skin is dry and doesn’t have the same collagen content as before.

My liver, gut, and gallbladder are all functioning perfectly fine. I have no symptomatology of any of the latter not working efficiently. This is also verified by blood work. Many others with PFS could say the same.

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#10

I’m exactly the same…Huge weight and fluid gain…90lbs or so no change in diet and blood work perfect…Try baking soda helped me greatly read my blog and other posts…

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#11

i stopped propecia on 27/02/2018.
Right after, i noticed a big increase in sebum production with consequent appearance of numerous blackheads. This lasted for almost two weeks.
next, my skin turned completely dry, some fine lines appeared under the lower eyelids and this proceeded at a high rate, day by day.
some of these fine scratches turned in something similar to post-acneic scars and then, the scars, became depressed zone and the depressed zones became blown lipoatrophy.
I told this to my dermatologist who asked me "are you working? are seeing friends? and shit like that, and i knew, as others here also experienced, the “is all in your head” phenomenon. I felt alone, depressed, scared. My parents as well thought that i was crazy, they wanted to take me in a mental hospital.
This lasted for almost 2 month, then stopped.
After another month, just when i thought that nothing else could happen, started again, this time involving the naso-labial area.
Less then one month ago, involved the temples.
What else should i expect, now?

But i won’t attach photos: since this hell started, i stopped looking myself into the mirrors and i avoid cameras. Sorry :frowning::slightly_frowning_face:

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#12

@Scotsman Thanks Scotsmans i really appreciate what you said :blush: same goes with you.
As for the skin on my hands it seems to spring back instantly, it’s more stretchy but still comes back, if i do the same around my eyelids or temples it springs back but may leave a little bump for a few minutes but overall i think it’s ok ish. My arms sag ever so slightly, my lower arms, it ain’t that noticeable to it’s not as tight but that could be the weird fat underneath it, just weird how each body part feels so different.

@holyhead Hey Holyhead thanks for posting, that’s very interesting about baking soda, do you just take a spoonful of it a day? I’ll have a read some of your posts when i get a chance, i think i have some downstairs so I’ll give it a try thank you :blush:

@Go_Faster_Sonic Hi sonic, thanks very much for the detailed account. That’s extremely interesting with your skin turning dry too, i feel a constant dryness through my body from the inside out, even though my skin isn’t that dry, it feels dry and my lips are always dry along with my eyes, i feel like I’ve been stuck in a desert the past couple of months.
I also have a a few fine lines under each eyelid that never was there previously, my skin indents very easily so if i scrunch my face some indents will be left for a while, but the lines under each eye are constant for now.
I’m very sorry to hear you’ve gone through a lot of physical changes also, i actually have a depressed zone or slight indent on my cheek that i never had, i think it was from one of the spots I had on accutane and it never healed or something, I can’t specifically remember but it was never there before as far as im aware.
I also told a couple of people about my skin and each person said im looking to closely at myself, this is normal etc etc, everyone gets wrinkles and lines, your skin healing devreases with ages etc.
Yeah like going from 19-20 is a big age difference… Sigh.

That’s no worries about the pictures, i appreciate you sharing this and i completely get what you mean about looking in mirrors and stuff. I get very upset seeing my graduation photos a year ago, just feels like it’s not me physically or mentally.

We will get through this though and hopefully get our old selves back eventually :blush:

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#14

Guys, i found two studies that might help (but i think that we should fix the underlying issue);

are called:

  • Successful treatment of lipoatrophy with normal saline
  • Relapsing insulin-induced lipoatrophy, cured by prolonged low-dose oral prednisone: a case report
#15

I’m interested in reading more about this, i’ll do some searching. Thanks for sharing devo and sonic

#16

So far I have found nothing to help physical sides…TRT, Clomid, supplementation etc helped mentally and my hair and skin has improved back a “little” The crazy body changes of fat and fluid gain only continue to get worse for me…

#17

https://www.nature.com/articles/pr19842389

#18

thats because your metabolism is fucked. Have you tested your dht levels? i went from unable to gain any fat to a pregnant looking female, my dht came back below range

#19

Yeah its all on my blog I saw Mark Gordon in LA spent a fortune on labs…My hormones are all normal and estrogen is perfect he said he doesn’t know what is causeing it…If it was a simple as low DHT the TRT should have corrected it…But I suspect it is a form of androgen silencing in different tissues resulting from the so called AR Over expression of the bell curve that Charles Ryan spoke of that causes this shut down…

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#20

Hi there Go. Do you have links to the two studies you mention?

#21

just google the titles and you’ll find them. if you don’t find the full studies but only the abstracts, pm me :wink:

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