…so what about u correiovip?any news?
Italy,
I am still waiting for the results, they should be ready this week.
this theory makes a lot of sense but i don’t hunderstand than why some just has sexual problem and others just brainfog and others both .
what about your results? what hormones are they for?
I am very interested in your theory. I also think pituitary or hypothalamus may be damaged or sth like that.
Most of hormones made by the pituitary have not a good level: FSH (low in my case), LH, ACTH (high), TSH (a little low), prolactine (high)
I have not oxitocyn/vassopresin tests done. besides oxytocin’s sexual functions, it also reduces anxiety. It must be low. As well as vassopresin. I think it made my blood flow get worse and my urinary frequency. It makes blood get more diluted. If vassopresin is low, blood get thicker (blood flow get worse), kidneys eliminate more liquids (urinary urgency and urine less thick), heart beats more quickly. All of them happen to me. Besides alcohol inhibit it. This make us get worse when we drink.
I don’t know what doesn’t work well, pituitary or hypothalamus. or receptors (changing feedback). Perhaps they are damaged because of an autoimmune disease:
“What causes the immune system to no longer distinguish between healthy body tissues and antigens is unknown. One theory holds that various microorganisms and drugs may trigger some of these changes, particularly in persons who are genetically prone to autoimmune disorders” (nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency … 000816.htm)
Perhaps we were genetically prone and finas trigger it. I have also read women have more predisposition to autoimmune diseases because of estrogens, so it could be another reason.
does anyone have? :
- his oxitocyn and vassopresin level
- tests of any hormone of the hypothalamus (i don’t know if it is possible to check them. doctors never order them)
- any other test of pituitary or hypothalamus
thanks.
Had an GnRH-test came back in order, can post the results, only not now.
.
[quote=“correiovip”]
We were inducing a high level of T for WEEKS or MONTHS and then the body interpreted this as the pituitary is sending too much hormones to the testes, “let s lower production of LH”.
[quote]
This may be true. I took propecia for about 2-3 years and for the first year to year-and-a-half my erections and libido were through the roof! I could maintain an erection for an hour or more. And I could get erections even when I was drunk. Plus, I always wanted to have sex. Then, after about a year-and-a-half to two years I started to slowly experience the side-effects.
The only issue with this theory is that some guys suffer from low-testostone type side effects immediately after taking the drug (e.g., low libido, etc.).
Any thoughts?
It’s interesting… GHB, dopamine… I have to say that since I quit taking FIN in January, I’ve never had such cravings for beef, chocolate, and occasionally tobacco until this period of my life. Some people say that the amount of GHB from foods is not enough to have significant effects.
What have visitors/users here reported about using Xyrem?
I am back to this thread after i read JN’s recovery on the recovery section. He decided to take HGH daily. I think his results could send some clues to weather the Pituitary has an important role in our syndrome or not.
propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2261
sufferer2001recovered2009, “JN”:
"In August 2008, I sent off IGF-1 and IGF BP3 blood markers. These are good markers for Growth Hormone activity.
IGF 1 was 21 (15 to 43)- an athletic 25 yr old should be about 80 to 100.
IGF BP3 was 99 (115 to 240).
In studies on rats, penile erections were strongly correlated to IGF BP3.
Mine being so low EXPLAINS my terrible sexual side effects caused by finasteride.
I am taking HGH at 3 units per day.
Fourthly, I’d like to tentatively state I think my cure is Human Growth Hormone. I think it’s THE CURE AND MY CURE. "
This raises some questions:
- By injecting HGH, is he stimulating production of oxytocin, vasopressin, and endorphin leves?
- Does HGH increase 5arII activity?
- Does HGH have a role in gene expression or AR insensitivity?
My IGF-1 doesn’t seem so low:
IGF1 - 194 NG/ML (Range 117 - 329)
But i ll look for a IGFBP3 test, an oxytocin test and a vasopressin blood test. I think the more information we have the better.
I just read a little about a product called “Sytropin” which claims to stimulate the pituatary gland to release more growth hormone and not cause the pit. gland to shut down its natural production.
I’m skeptical about the claims.
“The other main HGH supplements are secretagogues. Secretagogues contain minute amounts of human growth hormone substance (usually measured in nanograms, or hundredths of a gram). Secretagogues are a form of homeopathic medicine. Homeopathic medicine promotes the use of tiny amounts of a natural body chemical taken to stimulate the body to produce more. Absorbing small amounts of a synthetic hormone can cause the pituitary gland to secrete more of its own natural human growth hormone into the bloodstream.”
Yet, I’ve been thinking about homeopathy or alternative medicine which might help us.
product is called “homeopathic” but I’m wondering if it would truly be called “homeopathic” by a homeopathic professional.
I 've read about these HGH stimulants before. I’ve read mixed reviews so it is hard to tell. Some artilcles state that they don’t work at all, others say the opposite, so who knows.
The more i read about HGH deficiency, more i think it has to do with my condition.
"People with HGH deficiency found that they had low energy levels and almost no stamina to sustain anything. Even this tendency improved after HGH treatment which increased the stamina and levels of energy.
In a person, who has HGH deficiency, there is a loss in strength of bones and they are at an increased risk of osteoporosis. This condition can be improved using HGH.
After using HGH many people found that their vigor for sex improved dramatically and they had a good libido rate. Muscle started gaining mass and strength after the use of HGH. The heart, kidney and immune system benefited from the consumption of HGH. In people with high levels of cholesterol, it was observed that the cholesterol level was balanced."
Update 09/19
I finally was able to get my Vasopressin blood test today. I also tested IGF1 and IGFBP3. I feel my diagnosis is hypopituitarism since 2008 when i created this thread. Unfortunatelly, i’ve been to bad doctors who took my mid-level IGF1 as a sign of good growth hormone release, which is not. Confirmation of GH deficiency needs to be done by further tests.
My hormone tests are in the blood test section.
just out of curiosity, how well do you sleep? im guessing anybody that has taken this drug including myself has not slept properly since day 1, hence byebye HGH (gets released during good sleep)
correiovip:
Are you planning to try something to stimulate the pituitary gland? Have you found a good doctor yet?
I cannot run or exercise properly right now (cardio), so I don’t feel taking one of these products will help me much until I can.
If I were to try solving this problem myself with little information (I’ve read SOME of around 25-35 different threads on this website) and never having any blood tests done, I might try a product like Sytropin if I found that after having done cardio exercise regimen daily for three-four weeks I experienced no improvement. But, I’ve also not done blood tests and I’m concerned about an imbalance of hormones due to FIN use.
I am going to have the blood tests done (if I find a doctor willing to order them) for the first time in the near future.
Hi Tbone,
No, i have not found a good doctor yet. The ones i have heard in this forum are Dr. John Crisler in USA and Dr. Hertoghe in Belgium.
It is very important you do some kind of cardio. I have tried everything to stimulate the pituitary and the best result comes from cardio exercise. I am having joint pain, so i chose bycicle riding. Even if you are Gh deficient, you will have some benefit. Those Gh stimulants are very controversial, some say they do not work. But if you are going to give it a try, let us know the results, ok? I am planing to do HGH supplementation, i ve realized that in may case only stimulating Pituitary is not suficient.
Hi alexsiki,
I usually sleep well, but there are weeks i don’t sleep that good and long.
Correiovip,
Take a look at what I posted. I also am starting to feel very confident that the pituitary gland is where the problem exists.
Hi BostonUsa,
I agree. Pituitary definetely plays a role on this. My prolactin level is mid range (normal), though. I am posting a more elaborate explanation about what i think happened to our pituitay gland.
I have many signs of Hipopituitarism:
- Gh deficiency
- LH and FSH bottom range
- Low T
correiovip,
Was your Total T low or both Free and Total low? The strange thing about this, is so many of us have such different levels on the Total and Free T.
There was a 23 year old guy that posted yesterday and his Total T was extremely low, yet his free T was very high. It was actually outside of his range. My Total is a high total for my age, but free T is low.
I’ll be getting blood test results on the 19th and will post them. I will be curious to see what the Prolactin level is.
This is a line of events of what i think has happened to me:
- Propecia inhibits 5arII
- 5arII in pituitary gland are inhibited
- Our pituitary becomes insensitive to respond to T because of that
- We become hipopituitary
- LH and FSH levels fall
- T levels fall
- GH levels fall for some
- Adrenals try to compensate for the sudden hormone decline, causing adrenal fatigue
- we are kept in a state of low hormones and 5arII inactivity
Why some guys are prone to have post propecia syndrome:
We might have predominantely 5arII in our pituitary glands and most men probably have both 5arI and 5arII. So they don´t become hipopituitary because Propecia only inhibits 5arII.
Why TRT doesn´t seem to work for us:
Because 5arII is not responding to T stimuli in whole body
Evidence: low 3Adiol G levels
Why attempts of restarting HPTA axis that work for bodybuilders have not worked for us:
Bodybuilders have their 5arII working in their pituitary glands. So when a higher Testosterone level is induced (via HCG, for example), Pituitary gland “jump starts” as 5arII is receiving the sign of T.
How to reverse this:
- Bring T levels to top pf range(HCG for example).
- A 5arII stimulant drug (we need to find something safe to do this)
- Growth hormone supplementation for a short period of time, to ensure recovery of 5arII in cells.