Basically vincentv, we dont know. Only specific tests will tell us yes or no, two people having high ige is an indication that further testing is required here.
Even though it seems rather ridiculous, i have wondered this myself.
Any one up to try out some Trenbolone? Or has anyone tried it? It binds directly to the androgen receptor and is very anabolic and androgenic.
It would need to be used with HCG or some test. It also binds to the progesterone receptor which may cause problems with libido for some.
I think it is worth a try in low doses with HCG. Anyone have access to this?
As i have already mentioned, anti-5a-R antibodies will not cause problems by inhibiting the conversion of T->DHT. They will cause problems by attacking tissue where 5a-R is present (brain, muscle, genitials etc). This is my understanding from reading about similar illnesses such as Hashimotos and autoimmune Addisons disease.
I imagine this is why peoples hair still falls out⌠although it doesnt conveniently explain why some people say their hairloss has stopped.
Is is also true that an autoimmune reaction against an enzyme can get WORSE AFTER STOPPING medication, (see: viewtopic.php?f=27&t=5550&p=43729#p43729) another reason why I like that idea.
^Thats got nothing to do with this thread.
Ige 160* (<100)
Igm 1.2 (0.5-2)
So i am another with elevated ige. Will note that i took these tests first thing in the morning, hadnât eaten for 14 hours.
Oscar, if it was a 5ar antibody whats to say it would attack everywhere the enzyme has regenerated. I mean some people come here with the works, but some have variations, ie no brainfog, only brain fog, hair falls out, no hair falls out and so onâŚ
Possibly for some the reaction has occurred in selected locations. And maybe it is inhibiting the conversion of t-dht in these locations, as we have seen in the study you posted that prostate dht contributes very little to serum levels and the amount of members who have had a low 5ar2 conversion rate via the urine analysis.
InterestingâŚthis seriously makes me want to get buy a bottle of zyrtec.
âThey will cause problems by attacking tissue where 5a-R is present (brain, muscle, genitials etc).â
- I had a total recovery for a number of days on arimidex. I am not sure If i belive that my tissue is permanently damaged. But I did get server dandruff shortly after stopping fin. Small chunks of skin were falling out. But I felt horney as usual on arimidex so I am pretty sure my body is still able to function fine. I have high eosiniphils and low cortisol. I have developed cystic back acne after 2 years of fin. I also developed a red rash on my scrotum. This does seem to indicate an autoimmune problem or just low cortisol which I have.
âvincentv wrote:
Any one up to try out some Trenbolone?
^Thats got nothing to do with this thread.â
- Why not? Trenbolone is a potent androgen and anabolic agent which is not testosterone or dht. It binds directly to the receptor. So wouldnât this bypass any DHT or Testosterone antibodys or 5ar issues?
I hear that is 5 times as androgenic and anabolic as testosterone. This means we could try a very small does. 20 / 25 mg per week. Bodybuilders take 10 times that.
Interesting thought. I also have wondered about certain pro-hormones and designer steroidsâŚ
HoweverâŚTren (I think) and definately Deca (Nandrolone?) have a very high % of people getting major sexual issues on them. Just google âDeca Dickâ. It is pretty crazy how similar Deca Dick is to the sexual issues we have.
Sure, some people get lowered libido some get very high libido. It can also effect the progesterone receptor. But I have taken 100mgs progesterone every day without any problems. So 25mg per week should not be much of a risk. It would be dangerous to run any of those compounds without making sure you have some normal testosterone / DHT / estrogen in your system. So you would need to take them with HCG or T+preg. As far as I can see, no one had tried this yet.
elitefitness.com/forum/anabolic-steroids/update-my-tren-enan-hrt-727005.html
This guy is taking low does tren and I think he is saying his libido is great on it and it was not so great when he was on just 100MG test.
I really think this is worth a try. I can not try it till i get back to Thailand in April. I think we need a few people to try it because some people lose their libido their libido on tren so I do not think a 1 person sample will be enough.
I think instead of making speculations
1- we should get serious and start writing about this anti-body idea to universities / labs. Maybe some university or lab will take us for research and we will find the root cause.
2- get more people here to test for antibodies.
I highly suspect it is purely an anti body problem.
Thats very interesting! Of course it may not have anything to do with the partiular ideas here, but it certainly seems to be pointing in this direction. Could your Crohns have effected this?
Right! See a doctor and see what he says!
One other thing⌠has anybody on this forum EVER tested Immunoglobulin G!?! I cant find any results. Since most of the antibodies (anti-5aR, anti-AR and anti-T) are of the IgG it would be good to see some results of this too.
I have had iga and igg, both normal.
Did you post this? Did you have the 4 subclasses of IgG checked? Although levels of IgG do not normally differ in autoimmunity, hence the reason for specific antibody tests, its good to have as much info as possible.
For example IgG4 is associated with IgE (see; onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1398-9995.1993.tb00749.x/pdf).
No i just got the test labelled IgG, and no i havent posted.
I will look into getting the subclasses tested, it is a very expensive test so i will probably have to talk my doctor into it. Here is the write up about it anyway :
I want to add something.
The ANA (antinuclear antibody) can not give you conclusive result. If it is normal that doesnât mean you donât have autoimmune.
look at the case which Oscar qouted.
jcem.endojournals.org/content/83/1/14.full.pdf
Histological examination of ovarian tissue obtained during
laparotomy revealed the presence of a primary follicle, and no lesions
were observed, including signs of ovarian damage, inflammation, and
infiltration by immune cells; developing follicles were absent. Various
autoantibodies, i.e. antinuclear antibody, anti-DNA antibody, anti-ribonucleoprotein antibodies, and anti-Sm antibody, were not detected in the patientâs serum
This woman has high testosterone - and low estrogen.
âhuman menopausal gonadotropin at a dose of 225 IU for 5 days lead to ovulation and conceptionâ
I wonder how this caused ovulation.
What else can we gain from this article?
we also can learn though it shows high testosterone but it was useless ( and was not real testosterone)and can not convert to estrogen due to ABs. So maybe our testosterone or DHT are the real ones though labs will think these are normal hormones.
sorry I made typo in âSo maybe our testosterone or DHT are the real ones though labs will think these are normal hormonesâ
I wanted to say So maybe our testosterone or DHT are the not real ones though labs will think these are normal hormones
Another question thoug off topic
what happens to finasteride after it binds to 5 AR? I mean to what metabolites it breaks down?
Dihydrofinasteride.
5AR2 bound to Finasteride is permanently inactived. Patientâs body needs to resynthesize new enzymes.