You could be right simple87.
Although I dont know why you would immediately attempt to see a practitioner of ‘functional medicine’ rather than a real expert like an immunologist, who my also be able to diagnose and then accurately treat you for the things discussed in this thread.
Call me reckless but i also don’t understand people that believe there could be an autoimmune component don’t self medicate at least a little bit on the off chance something works. I have tried Dexamethasone and will be trying Naltrexone shortly. In fact i intend to stay on Naltrexone indefinitely. The more people that try things, the better. It’s the only way i can see any of us getting out of this mess.
You have mentioned, and even PMed people, about trying these numerous times - why not do it yourself if you are so inclined - then you will see if it works first hand. You have already located the pharmacy to get what you need.
Hey UK - what was your experience on dexa? You were trying this at the same time as you were doing the propecia experiment, right? Do you think this could have interfered with any effectiveness of the dexa?
Certainly it seems to hold a lot of promise and not so many have tried it. Is there anyone who has tried it and not seen any improvement at all?
Joe91 you are reckless. No one cares about your crap on this thread, go and munch on some finpecia.
I post very sporadically on this forum for this very reason. There seems to be a lot of bitterness - fine, everyone’s in a tough spot but it would be great if we could support everyone’s effort to find relief whether we think it will be successful or not. Particularly given that other’s willingness to take risks we might not take ourselves may help us all in the long run. Just my 2 cents…
I’ve posted that very article on the forum earlier, and my regimen incorporates many of the items that little girl was taking.
I would be curious to hear what Dr. H or his colleagues have to say about this condition.
See my earlier reply to this:
If the immune system is the answer (ant-AR antibodies or whatever) why not see a clinical immunologist who will be able to run assays that can identify the antibodies involved.?
For some people it seems the less scientific backing something has the more likely they are to believe in it! Its almost as if they are treating this thing like some big joke.
visionquest99 and Simple87 you both maybe right. I have been suspecting auto immune for a long time and requested people here to go for Auto immune tests like ANA and ESR etc but very few people responded.
Second thing I don’t think by following the regimen of Isabel you or we will be cured 100% though we might get some relief as I am having relief from Vit D3.Please note Dr.Hyman also mentioned Vit D as anti inflammotry and had Isabel on 2000IU /day.We first need to idnetify the triggers of our Auto immune disorder. In her case Author says
“I found many potential triggers for her inflammation. She was being exposed to a toxic mold, Stachybotrys, in her house. Her mother worked in limestone pits exposing her to excessive amounts of fluoride while pregnant.” etc. etc
Also I have been talking about Vasectomized males, in their case their own sperm are the triggers. Oscar says if we have anti DHT or Testosterone anti bodies we should have elevated LH and FSH. But he did not answer my question why Vasectomized males have low LH, FHS and low DHT?
In my opinion we can take two route to confirm anti bodies.
1-Go for tests (but some forum members say these test might not be reliable.For some men despite normal levels there might be full scale auto immune in play)
2-Try immuno suppressants like DM or Methotrexate but should be udner Dr supervison.
Sps, those tests wont show anything, we need to look for specific antibodies, probably in specific locations.
Also Oscar said the study he presented had high lh/fsh, which(the study) is for testosterone antibodies, Lh/Fsh willl tell your balls to make testosterone, so if these are low then the brain is telling the testicles that not much testerone is required, if these were high then yeah there is a problem with t, but these are generaly low, so why is the brain trying to keep t down?
This suggests the problem is further down the line, which makes sense … 5ar2 was inhibited by a suicidal inhibitor, it regenerated, possibly the immune system attacked here.
And or 5ar2 reduced dht and neurosteroids(allopreg and thdoc) were effectively gone, 5ar2 regenerates dht/neurosteroids come back, the immune system could attack here.
Receptor antibodies, i cant think of a logical mechinism why this would happen.
This has nothing to do with vasectomy, and i really dont know why you keep bringing it up, you are making this theory look stupid. When it is completely logical.
These men had an operation to stop sperm from getting out of the penis. We on the other hand inhibited 5ar2.
I dont know why all the cortisol guys aren’t interested here.
Some really good thoughts here… To me the autoimmune angle also better addresses the phenomenon of temporary recoveries. I haven’t really delved into the science of this yet, but to me it makes more sense that are immune system lets up on ourselves and we experience a temporary recovery, as opposed to other theories that would required that damaged nerves or cells somehow repair themselves for a few days and then degenerate again? Any thoughts?
Tim, I also like your line of thinking in that we inhibited various steroids/enzymes/neurotransmitters and the resurgence of these once we came off Fin could have caused our bodies to identify them as foreign.
Again, haven’t delved into the science here so perhaps someone who’s a bit more versed than I am could guide this discussion… If we all were tested for our IgG, and they all came back abnormally high, wouldn’t that suggest an autoimmune problem? We may not be able to identify right away what is being inhibited but it would be a start…
Working with the presumption that TRT has not been effective for most, could we narrow down what our body could possibly be attacking?
Oscar - as to why I’m not jumping to see an immunologist. This certainly would be a good idea and I see no reason not to. I am attracted to Dr. Hyman’s approach of identifying not only what allergies I may have, but also any longstanding infections, environmental factors, nutrition/inflammation, etc. I’m not sure an immunologist would cover this wide a scope…
Also, just a couple more rambling thoughts expanding on this thread/previous posts:
Dexa - suppresses the immune system (would help with an autoimmune disorder) and also reduces inflammation, inflammation being a symptom of an autoimmune disorder - so it may help from two angles
Antibiotics (which people have seen improvement on) - may kill infections that are triggering an autoimmune disorder
This is a consequence of many factors, including
(i) the failure of more scientific approaches to dealing with pfs;
(ii) the failure of mainstream science to acknowledge pfs;
(iii) the absence of any credible recoveries from top docs who do acknowledge pfs;
(iv) the fact that “scientific backing” for drugs like Fin is a money-driven farce with oft-manipulated data;
(v) the sheer desperation of sufferers to return to normal.
We have every reason to look outside the mainstream medical community for answers.
This decision is up to each individual. I’ve chosen to keep my ears open to all perspectives.
Simple87 in my view the thing/things that are causing the auto-immune reaction is dht or 5ar. Not bogus infections/food allergies/enviromental conditions.
Everyone on this board inhibited 5ar therefore the former (dht, 5ar) are the only things we all have in common.
hey tim - i agree with you regarding the dht/5ar. i was thinking along the lines of if we have other allergies/sensitives that we ignore, it may put our bodies in a fight or flight state so to speak, or in a state where it will be more likely to have an autoimmune response to dht or 5ar.
if we have other infections/inflammation, i assume this would kick our immune system up a notch and make any autoimmune symptoms worse? that’s where i think the healthy lifestyle comes into play… not that it will necessarily solve the problem but in this theory it could lessen the intensity of an autoimmune response, if that makes sense…
what you guys think about the following article
groups.google.com/group/sci.med.prostate.prostatitis/browse_thread/thread/6acd03a33779a461/256792cb255187a1
Antisperm Antibodies and Prostatitis???
Who is at risk for antisperm antibodies?
Anything that disrupts the normal blood-testes barrier can result in the
formation of antisperm antibodies. This may include any of the following
conditions:
Vasectomy reversal
Varicocele (dilation of the veins surrounding the spermatic cord)
Testicular torsion (twisting of the testicle)
Congenital absence of the vas deferens
Testicular biopsy
Cryptorchidism (failure of testicular descent)
Testicular cancer
Infection (orchitis, prostatitis)
Inguinal hernia repair prior to puberty
Simple87, yes there must be something for us that is different from the “average” finasteride user, my thoughts would be a very efficient immune system or something along the lines of what sps has posted where finasteride has caused somesort of internal damage and it has unleashed the immune system. Yet all logical thoughts are welcome as i would have a f*#king clue.
Sps, oscar was tested for sperm antibodies, but i do see where you are coming from, yet im never quite sure with you. 
This thread is about anti- Testosterone, DHT, 5alpha-Reductase or AR antibodies, etc, ONLY.
It IS NOT a general thread about infections, inflammation (there is no inflammtion with these antibodies), allergies, other sensitivites or antisperm antibodies. Nor is it about any treatments for autoimmunity outside of the mainstream medical community.
If this thread isnt kept on topic then it will just become another thread about nothing in particular.
guys please read this young’s man story in detail.He is suffering exactly like us.
forum.mesomorphosis.com/mens-health-forum/checking-back-working-regaining-134311067.html#post779828
No he isn’t, he has Ankylosing spondylitis. He doesn’t even mention sexual dysfunction…
Edit: Ankylosing spondylitis is a form of autoimmune arthritis.