What works? What doesn’t work? Herbs? Pharmaceuticals? Steroids? TRT?
Temporary or permanent, give me some solutions to this propecia/proscar mess?
I’m going on 8 or 9 years here. No recovery. Low testosterone. No drive etc. My GP is certain is was the proscar I took on and off for a couple years. I’m 35 years old now.
The good news - I took an OTC herbal test-booster product a few years ago. My libido, erections and desire all came back with a vengeance. Ran the product for about 6 weeks. Worked amazing. Even felt way more confident, relaxed, and alpha-male. Very strong feelings. Just finished two bottles of the same OTC test-booster last week, and it didn’t do squat. New formulation. My goal now is to find out exactly what was in the old formulation, and try each herb one by one. Because I’m new, I don’t want to get accused of shilling or whatever, so I won’t name the product, even though I’d be happy too.
WHY DID YOU FUCKING STOP YOU SHOULD CONTINUE USING THE FUCKING PRODUCT YOU CANNOT STOP IF SOMETHING IS WORKING FOR YOU YOU HAVE TO CONTINUE USING IT NOW YOU’VE LOST 5 TO 8 YEARS OF YOUR LIFE YOU COULD’VE BEEN CURED BY NOW
FUCK MAN THIS IS A SETBACK TO ALL OF US ON THIS FUCKING FORM
WERE WAITING FOR GUYS LIKE YOU SO WE CAN GET KNOWLEDGE YOU HAVEN’T DONE ANYTHING IN THESE EIGHT YEARS THAT YOU CLAIM
(TRY HOP PLANTS FOR HIM) Come on get on it
You cannot just let things go if you do you are not going to get cured you have to jump from product to product from product to product to find out what works for you and stay on it and tell you are cured
Hindsight is 20-20. I didn’t know then, at the age of 32 or whatever, that I had low-testosterone/ed from proscar. Only last week did my GP nail it down to the proscar I took in my twenties. Since 28ish, I figured my declining libido and erections were tied to shiftwork and a bad romantic breakup. The product was called Diesel Test Hardcore, by Get Diesel. Unfortunately, I just finished two bottles of the new formulation (2013), and it didn’t do squat. I am not endorsing their products here, to be clear.
The effects I had from the original product were nothing short of amazing. I’ll state them here, because it appears to be completely relevant to the symptoms described by PFS sufferers:
libido came back…went from masturbating once a day to four or five times a day
nocturnal and morning erections came back. Everyday, without fail.
erectile strength was near 100%
sexual thoughts came back…most of my thinking was sexual.
I literally felt my prostate grow, or throb, when I had an erection, at times.
brain fog completely disappeared. At times, I couldn’t believe how articulate, insightful and on-point i was! I always knew THAT was the real me, but for whatever reason, it rarely came through.
I felt extremely confident and relaxed. Had a really strong sense of well-being. My body felt really good and I felt a warmness in my body. But it was also very relaxing, and like a sense of confidence. Difficult to explain, but it was night and day. Very real.
I felt very alpha and in control. Situations, even threatening confrontations, didn’t rattle me. I felt I could handle almost anything. The total opposite of anxiety.
My balls literally doubled in size. No kidding. They were much, much bigger.
my depression lifted. I felt more positive and optimistic. Good, happy feelings.
the product took about 2.5 weeks to kick-in. Literally did not feel much of anything for 2.5 weeks, but when it kicked in, it was amazing. I think the bottle lasted 6 weeks? So four weeks I felt amazing.
This is why I’m not freaking out. A herbal product exists out there that can reverse what I have…and probably what everyone else on here has. Albeit, temporarily. I contacted the owner of Get Diesel (Chuck Diesel) yesterday about the old formulation, to hopefully get answers. This is my second attempt at requesting information from Chuck.
I have a feeling, although I’m not certain!, the magic ingredient was Tongkat Ali. The problem is, like all herbs and supplements, quality varies from brand to brand, and batch to batch! It’s really a crapshoot. Another possibility, is the magic Diesel Test Hardcore I took, was spiked with steroids or prohormones. Or, it may have been clean, but a synergy of herbs were acting together (not just one herb, but two or more).
As it stands, I ordered a whole bunch of pro-sexual herbs off the web. Arriving next week. If anything works, or comes close, I’ll be sure to let everyone know. Trust me, I wish I knew what it was…
This is kind of interesting. I’m not sure what was in the old formation as opposed to the new one, but it could be a number of things that aided in your previous recovery. Not only have people reported a lot of sexual improvement (albeit often temporary) from Tongkat Ali, but there is a ton of other ingredients that have been known to sponsor improvement as well. Pregnenolone, Tribulus Terrestris, Di-Indolyl-Methane (DIM) just to name a few. It sounds like people often grow a tolerance to all of these things, however.
Another thing I thought was interesting is that they advise not to use it if you suffer from ‘prostate enlargement.’
But I haven’t yet done a search for Diesel Test. I believe it’s been used and discussed many times here before. I’ll do that now.
A lot of the post-cycle therapy supplements contain Milk Thistle, which if you do a search on here you will know to stay away from. Many guys benefited or were nearly cured, only to crash again. This supplement does not contain Milk Thistle.
Instead, it contains a mixture of testosterone-boosting and estrogen-reducing supplements. Tongkat Ali is used, which has been seemingly a positive thing for guys here. Resversatrol has received positive reviews. White Button Mushrooms have received positive reviews. D-aspartic Acid has seemingly good reviews. Indole 3 Carbinol seems to have some benefits. Bromo is kind of hit or miss it seems.
I’m also pretty interested in ACETYL-L-CARNITINE supplements. Any thoughts on anything I’ve just posted?
first of all sorry that you are suffering for such a long time.
You said you felt very well for 4 weeks while you where taking the test booster with the old formula. How quickly did things return to the initial bad PFS state (immediately after you stopped or gradually)?
As far as I understand, you used a product called Diesel Test Hardcore (with the old formula) which helped several years ago. Perhaps you could go to the same pharmacy where you bought the old product and ask them what formula they sold to you at that time.
I’ll write more tomorrow. Late here. Just wanted to update - I made three attempts to contact Chuck Diesel (the owner of Get Diesel) through bodybuilding.com, his forums below, and by personal email.
A link to my question on his Getdiesel forums is here, for those that wish to follow along:
Contacting Chuck is the best way to answer these question marks. At the end of the day, he knows exactly how his old product was formulated. See, the trick to all this stuff - these OTC test-boosters list the herbs used, but not the extracts or the suppliers. And the later info (extracts and suppliers) is what matters. I’ll do my best to continue with this. Stay tuned.
If I get no response for a few weeks, I’ll contact GetDiesel directly (phone and letter mail).
Update for everyone. Had an email exchange with Chuck Diesel, the owner of Get Diesel Nutrition, who was kind enough to talk with me about the issue. According to Chuck:
the 2009-2010 formulation that worked great for me is identical to the 2013 formulation. Except the old formulation is twice as strong. Meaning, it takes twice the pills of the new stuff to equal 1 pill of the old stuff. This makes sense, as I dosed the 2013 DTH at ~5 pills a day. This is the equivalent to around 2.5 pills of the old stuff. The old cycle that worked great, I ran at around 5 pills a day and a few Sunami on the side (another Get Diesel product). The equivalent for the 2013 DTH is around 12 pills a day. This can explain why I didn’t get a big effect from the current run…
Chuck said it’s a combo of herbs, not one in particular, that did the job.
Exhausting the herbal route before I move on to clomid/hcg, makes sense to me. TRT is the last, and most extreme option.
I recently bought 200 dollars worth of prosexual herbs from beyond-a-century. Many of the herbs ordered are also found in the DTH product. Running the herbs at triple the recommended dose, along with 10mg cialus, every other day. When my inventory runs dry, I’ll take stock and reassess. If it works great, I’ll continue. If I get mixed or bad results, I’ll order a few DTH 2013 bottles, and run at 14-16 pills a day.
I’m turning 36 in a couple months. Without cialus or herbal testboosters there’s nothing going on downstairs. My testosterone came back in the bottom 15% percentile (equivalent of an 85 year old man), on the most recent bloodwork. Ideally, I need to get more bloodwork, with a full hormonal panel done on ZERO herbs.
It would be good if a few of you guys could order the current DTH and run at around 12-14 pills a day, and report back. The big question mark with herbal stuff all comes down to the supplier and extract. We can have all the right herbs that could cure this, but without the right extract, nothing will happen. That’s it for now.
So the NEW formula is half as strong as the OLD formula? And all of the exact same ingredients in the exact same proportions are in the new formula, just less of those ingredients? Let me guess, he suggested buying Diesel Test Hardcore and taking twice the recommended dosage.
It sounds to me like this Chuck Diesel guy is feeding you bullshit to get you to buy his product.
That’s correct. Same formula. New stuff half as strong as the old stuff. The size of the old pills were gigantic. The new ones, much smaller. Checks out.
If nothing else works, I will try it. What’s the risk? 150 dollars? Big deal.
I’ve been taking both Pregnenolone and DHEA, as well as many other supplements, so it’s not my intent to say these two alone would be a solution.
My goal is to get OFF TRT and use supplements, foods and exercise to boost T and DHT. Anyhow, thought this article to be very informative for the PFS dudes.
Thanks. I supplement with 80mg of pregnenolone daily for anxiety. It’s calming.
Quick update - on week 3 now with the herbal extracts from beyond-a-century. No noticeable effect. I take double (and in some cases triple), the recommended daily dose. Daminia, Avena Sativa, Tribulus, LJ100, HGW and gingseng. All high potency extracts. I’ll chronicle the entire regime at the end, for reference. Based on what’s left, I’ve probably got another couple weeks to go.
Personally, I’m doing okay. Just alright. I take 5 mg cialus everyday, which allows me to have an erection twice a day. Even after 7-8 years, I have little to no sex drive. But it’s reassuring to know I can perform if the situation comes up. Consistent weight-training has helped me get back in shape, and feel good about myself, from a masculine perspective. Oddly enough, even though I have documented low testosterone, it hasn’t affected my strength or mass gains in the gym? Will a jump in testosterone cure me? I don’t know.
Where I go from here yet, I’m not sure. My GP wants me to go on TRT - shots. I think it’s conceivable he would proscribe androgel, which I’ve heard very good things about, in terms of boosting libido (high concentration of the 5ar enzyme in skin (testosterone converts to dht when applied to the skin etc)). This route is suppressive, unfortunately. Concerns here about long term testicular atrophy.
Ideally, I want to cure this herbally. So after this round of herbs I might try the Diesel Test Hardcore again, at double the dose. Or I might try the Hot Plants for Him (yohimbe) which Manhood, another member here, has said is quite helpful. Still, it’s up in the air. I have generic clomid so I might just start that at 12.5 mg EOD.
The way I see it herbal > pct (clomid, novladex) > TRT (testosterone, HCG etc).
TRT is suppressive - both testosterone, gels and HCG.
Then again, maybe I should just try it and see how I feel? This is all somewhat up in the air, the brainfog doesn’t help. With trial and error regarding medications, and the hormonal nature of the problem, all this takes a heck of a lot of time. Each herb usually takes around 2.5 weeks to kick-in (if it does). So each trial run, requires at least a solid month-5 weeks to give it an honest shot. All the while, time is ticking by, and I’m not getting any younger (35). So. That’s where I’m at.
I’ve searched the recovery section, at some length. No silver bullet in there, either. Fasting comes up, with some regularity. As does TRT. Fasting is something I’m definitely open, too. Along with cleansing.
Quite update - took 3 tablespoons of virgin, cold-pressed coconut oil last night right before bed + 300 mg of 5HTP.
Had nocturnal erections all night (~50%). Woke up feeling horny, with an erection. Weird thing is, I can feel my prostate. Like it’s pulsating. One of those powerful erections we used to get. I skipped cialus yesterday too. Only thing I changed was the coconut oil and 5HTP. This is totally abnormal for me. I can still feel my prostate even though the erection has subsided. Hope it’s not placebo. Will update later.
coconut oil is a DHT inhibitor… would kill it. prostate swelling is not a good sign. don’t masturbate at all… you may risk getting worse when you are riding on a “fake high”.
Lots of foods are alleged 5ar inhibitors. I’m not concerned and will trial the coconut oil for some time to see if I get an improvement in libido. If low DHT was the only problem, androgel would be the perfect solution (high presence of 5ar in the skin. Testosterone converts to DHT in the skin etc). And in some cases, guys have experienced a nice recovery in libido and ED using topical testosterone gels. Some have not. I’m at zero level with no supplements anyway, so I don’t care.
Mini update - took 300 mg of 5HTP and 3 tablespoons of coconut oil before bed. Could not fall asleep. Lots of run on thoughts and emotions. Body temperature was elevated but felt oddly comfortable. Even with my regular 2.5 benadryl, could not fall asleep. Took another full benadryl and a shot of rum. Finally fell asleep 2.5 hours later. Will not take 300mg 5HTP before bed, as I believe this is the culprit. Will continue with coconut oil. Had no nocturnal erections last night, or pulsating of the prostate this morning. Was it all placebo? Too early to say.
Engorged prostate is normal, and a side effect of normal sexual health and erections. I would argue that point. I had that before PFS and noticed it completely missing with PFS (no engorged prostate).
Ran the above stack for over >3 weeks. No effect. Zero. Could be the quality of the herbs from Beyond a Century. Will not reorder from that company ever again.
Subsequent to that, ran clomid for roughly 3 months. 12.5 mg EOD for a few weeks. Then 12.5 mg ED for a few weeks. Then 25 mg ED for the remainder. Noticed an improvement. Erections went from a zero to about a 3, on a scale of 10. Libido went from about a 0 to 1, out of 10. Discontinued after the 3 month point, as benefit didn’t justify continued use.
Recently bought 2 bottles of Diesel Test Hardcore. For those that have followed this thread, I took DTH back in 2009 and experienced a complete resurrection of my sex drive, erections, confidence, clarity of thought. Nothing short of remarkable. After an email exchange with the owner of DTH (Chuck Diesel), the current product is half as strong as the 2009 version. So I currently take double the dose, plus a few more pills for good measure. I take 15 pills a day. Just started week two. So far, nothing to report. However, the first time it worked for me, DTH didn’t kick in until the 2.5 week mark. I will run Diesel Test Hardcore at 15 pills a day, 5 days on, 2 days off, for 5.5 weeks. That is enough time to know if it will work for me again, or not.
Failing that, I will try an pharma anti-estrogen. Probably aromasin. Bodybuilders have noted an improvement in erections, confidence and libido while taking aromasin. This is because estrogen has to be within a golden window. Too high or too low outside this window, it kills libido and erections in men. The assumption is that I am high in estrogen. And sometimes notice estrogen symptoms like gyno (itchy, sensitive nipples).
Failing that, I will try various Tongkat Ali formulations available on amazon.com. A couple have great and numerous reviews.
Other than that, still struggling with no libido and poor erections. I no longer take 5 mg cialus everyday. Just before a lady visit. That’s all for now. Hope some of you guys are having more luck then I am.
