Progesterone treatment?


#1
  1. Where are you from (country)?
    AUSTRALIA
  2. How did you find this forum (Google search – if so, what search terms? Via link from a forum or website – if so, what page? Other?)
    GOOGLE
  3. What is your current age, height, weight?
    27, 193 CM, 99KG
  4. Do you excercise regularly? If so, what type of excercise?
    EXERCISE FREQUENTLY, 3-5 TIMES A WEEK ANEROBIC/AEROBIC- RANGING INTENSITY
  5. What type of diet do you eat (vegetarian, meat eater, raw, fast-food/organic healthy)?
    MEAT EATER
  6. Why did you take Finasteride (hair loss, BPH, other)?
    BPH
  7. For how long did you take Finasteride (weeks/months/years)?
    APPROX 6 YEARS ON AND OFF
  8. How old were you, and WHEN (date) did you start Finasteride?
    STARTED AT THE AGE OF 20
  9. How old were you when you quit, and WHEN (date) did you quit?
    26
  10. How did you quit (cold turkey or taper off)?
    COLD TUKEY
  11. What type of Finasteride did you use – Propecia, Proscar, Fincar or other generic?
    PROSCAR
  12. What dose did you take (eg. 1 mg/day, 1 mg every other day etc.)?
    1MG/DAY
  13. How long into your use of Finasteride did you notice the onset of side effects?
    3 YEARS
  14. What side effects did you experience while on the drug that have yet to resolve since discontinuation?
    LIBIDO, ERECTILE DYSFUNCTION
    Put an X beside all that apply:

Sexual
[X ] Loss of Libido / Sex Drive
[X ] Erectile Dysfunction
Complete Impotence
[X ] Loss of Morning Erections
[X ] Loss of Spontaneous Erections
[X ] Loss of Nocturnal Erections
Watery Ejaculate
[X ] Reduced Ejaculate
[ X] Inability to Ejaculate / Orgasm
Reduced Sperm Count / Motility

Mental
[X ] Emotional Blunting / Emotionally Flat
[X ] Difficulty Focusing / Concentrating
[ X] Confusion
[X ] Memory Loss / Forgetfullness
Stumbling over Words / Losing Train of Thought
Slurring of Speech
[X ] Lack of Motivation / Feeling Passive / Complacency
[ X] Extreme Anxiety / Panic Attacks
[X ] Depression / Melancholy

Physical
[X ] Penile Tissue Changes (narrowing, shrinkage, wrinkled)
Penis curvature / rotation on axis
Testicular Pain
[X ] Testicular Shrinkage / Loss of Fullness
[ X] Genital numbness / sensitivity decrease
[ X] Weight Gain
[X ] Gynecomastia (male breasts)
[X ] Muscle Wastage
[ X] Muscle Weakness
Joint Pain
[ X] Dry / Dark Circles under eyes

Misc
Prostate pain
[X ] Persistent Fatigue / Exhaustion
Stomach Pains / Digestion Problems
Constipation / “Poo Pellets”
Vision - Acuity Decrease / Blurriness
Increased hair loss
Frequent urination
Lowered body temperature

Other (please explain)

  1. What (if any) treatments have you undertaken to recover from your side effects since discontinuation of the drug?
    MULTIPLE

  2. If you have pre or post-Finasteride bloodtests, what hormonal changes have you encountered since discontinuing the drug (pls post your test results in the “Blood Tests” section and link to them in your post)?
    ELEVATED PROLACTIN
    WITHIN RANGE FREE TEST LEVELS
    ELEVATED E2

  3. Anything not listed in the above questions you’d like to share about your experience with Finasteride?

  4. Tell us your story, in your own words, about your Finasteride usage and side effects experienced while on/off the drug.

I believe that whilst most of the side effects have faded, persistent libido issues remained
However I have recently recovered greatly in this problematic department- with continued success, and would like to share this with those who are currently in the same hell as I was.


#2

No i’m not a doctor.
Yes i’ve been there done that.
No i’m not going to cite literature as you’ve likely read everything related already

  • Only sharing how i’ve almost fully recovered from 6 years of this POISON.

Salvation routine:

Deprenyl 2.5 every day - MOIB inhibition revitalises neuro-transmitters involved in Libido, motivation, personality enhancement (ZEST FOR LIFE), emotional responses, focus etc

Progesterone cream- 5 mg every day until improvement in symptoms ESPECIALLY LIBIDO
( once converted- aids in the conversion of all other 5alpha metobolites AND upregulates GABA-AR subunit expression- this will simulate a response to acute stress)

tongkat ali- SHBG inhibitor- allows more free test
VITIMIN D3- 3000IU
MACCA ROOT- adaptogen
B-complex- high dose

Anerobic exercise- 3-4 times a week

General healthy eating

I can’t promise this will work for you… but the improvement i’ve seen is REAL. I strongly believe that you cannot adopt the mindset that something will likely NOT improve your condition if it affects NORMAL people adversely IE: progesterone. WE ARE NOT LONGER NORMAL.

All the Best

Please feel free to ask ANYTHING as i’m more than happy to help anyone i can.


#3

That’s great news, good to hear you have made good progress. Any details you can share (e.g was it just time, or did you undergo any treatment? When did libido issues start to improve?)? Thanks and hope you continue to do better.


#4

Would you mind elaborating on what treatments you have had?
Thank you.


#5

Davey/ Noniman/ Anyone else who is interested.

Cheers, whilst i believe my tenure of taking finasteride was significant, i also understand that i am relatively young (assuming this would aid naturally recovery)
That being said, i also only have been off it for a year- which is early days by most accounts. However, improvement is still improvement.

Ok so in a nutshell, i will list my treatments, all of which commenced 1 month after halting finasteride- side effects were VERY apparent and hit pretty much straight away.
Exercise and eating regime started immediately
research into PFS online also commenced
Developed a sound understanding of related endocrine function and neurotransmitters that were likely affected by 5a inhibition. (currently doing a PHD in psychophisiology and psychopharmacology so i have basic understanding and skills in involved in reaseach & analytical skills- God knows how many studies i have read using Uni’s journal database LOL)

Supplement regime: (once again not discussing the reasoning behind them as i’ll be here forever but i’m sure you both are quite away of suggested herbal remedies and their supposed benifits)

Muria Puama- 2 months/ no apparent benifit

Velvet bean- 2 months/ no apparent benifit

Resveratrol + curcumin- 3 months/ no apparent benifit

Choline and insitol- 3 months/ no apparent benifit

B complex- still currently taking 8 months

MACCA- Still talking- 8months

D3- still taking (unless summer)- 8 months

All these treatments were administered by either my urologist, Doctor or endo

Cabergoline/ dopamine agonism for elevated prolactin- 2 months, no significant effect.

Trasndermal test patches: 10mg, every day 2 months-

Clomephine citrate 50mg, ED for 6 weeks after to restore HPTA and compete with estrogen/
( no significant improvement in libdio or erectile function- however, brain fog, anxiety, mucle wastage was improved noticibly)

Now, like most of you, after 6-7 months i came to the conclusion that the issue was mostly psychological in nature. And i’m POSITIVE that all the 5a-reduced metabolites that were inhibited (allopregnanolone etc) are the ROOT cause of our condition.
I do also take into account that the relationship between endocrine and Neuro-steriods is so complex i doubt it medical literature ever be completely decypher the interactions completely. However logic suggests that by up-regulating that which has previously been inhibited- we slowly return to homo-stasis (which i believe should be our ultimate goal)

Now i self prescribed these on the basis that A) there is little chance of toxicity when you take into account any studies invovled and B) At this point in time, until post finasteride syndrome is taken seriously by the medical community, we need to critically analyse anecdotal accounts and base our recovery plans on the failures and success’s of others whilst taking into account related medical literature. I do once again stress that our bodies have now adapted to a 5a inhibited environment- hence we will likely respond differently to treatments than people who have not taken finasteride/duta.

I have been taking the following for the past 2 months, and in those 2 months i have seen a marked recovery in my problem fields of Libdio and erectile function.

Deprenyl: 5mg for the first 3 days- then 2.5 mg/day (staying under 10-15mg a day is VERY important given dose above that may cause it to loose its selectivity of MOA-B)

Progesterone cream: 5mg every day 2 weeks on, 4 days off.

bare in mind i am still not 100%- however i now benifit from noctural and morning erections. I look at women again and feel that “urge” that we all have missed so much. I respond to arosal and foreplay 10 times better than the months prior. Sensitvity has increased notibly- and i now want sex pretty much every day… (stark contrast from when the idea of sex was seen as a chor) Mental acuity, stamina, focus, ambition, drive, emotional sensitivity has also seen improvement.

Could this be placebo? Overcourse… as an aspiring scientist i have to conceed that. However it consider it a privilidge to share my story, in the hope that it may help just one of you who has unfairly had to go through this.

That would honestly make it worthwhile.

All the best.

Chris

(ps: sure as hell will never, ever taking anything patented by MERK)


#6

my apologies for the RAMPANT spelling and grammatical errors- i am typing all this whilst doing 50 other things at once
ps: i am also well aware that i am not an expert in the field and certainly do not claim to know every intricate detail about PFS and its effects/causes/interactions (please note i have a basic/ possibly intermediate understanding of these). However as i said prior, by the time peer reviewed literature is made avalaible that both acknowledges and evaluates PFS and offers a universal remedy, we have no choice but to learn from others, gain knowledge in the field and experiment via trial and error - obviously whilst mitigating potential risks (making out condition worse).

I just hope that by sharing my fortunate experience, there will be some who may be able to recover what they have lost.

Ps: with regards to progesterone supplementation- please see as a related and interesting read
hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=10&threadid=92985

All the best once more…

Chris


#7

Chris

Glad to hear that you are improving.
Lets hope you get back to 100% and you can put this mess behind you.

I have tried many of the supplements you listed, except the progesterone/deprenyl.
I wonder if its the progesterone or the deprenyl that has helped you?
I guess the only way to find out would be to ween off one at a time, then wait and see what happens.

I found a thread on deprenyl here:
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4325&hilit=Deprenyl&start=20
but it seems not many on the forum have tried it.

May be worth a shot…


#8

Hi mate,

definitely think that the rapid and dramatic improvement in my symptoms appear to be from the relatively recent use of prosgesterone and deprenyl (selegeline)- ( possibly a synergystic effect there? - sorry can’t really advise a mechanism allow i am well aware of the individual benefits each provide). Have been on both for about a month and a bit, whist giving the other supplements a break- (taking EOD)… improvement has NOT faded like most other short term fixs for PFS. ( ie: test treatement did improve libido etc but only temporarily)
Hopefully after weening off these my body will have adopted a new homostasis (endocrine and Neurological).

But as for right now i feel great! I’m praying this lasts as it almost feels like i’m 21 again.

Regards


#9

Thats excellent Chris. Glad to hear this.

My doctor offered me TRT but its not something i would be keen on, as its usually a life long commitment and there is a risk of testicular atrophy if taken long term.
Besides- it doesn’t seem to work on many of us PFS guys anyway.

Keep us posted on how you’re doing


#10

Which progesterone product are you using?


#11

Biovea progesterone cream :slight_smile:


#12

Thanks for sharing your story.

How long would you say it has taken to get to where you are after stopping taking fin?

Do you think it is possible to get to where you are in a few months of hard work?

Thanks


#13

Hi Jeff,

To be honest i’ve been reading this forum for sometime (about 3 years), as i believe my symptoms actually started before i stopped taken finasteride… I only became a member so i could let everyone here know that despite all the horrible stories we are bombarded with about PERMANENT PFS side effects, there are success stories and thus hope. And after drowning myself in a period of despair- actually believing this to be my life until i pass on- i think the best that happened to me was the realisation that i HAVE to fight this and stay positive. I’m a firm believer that whilst it may be in the best intentions of the medical and pharmaceutical community to treat any condition, be it sickenss/symtoms etc; We must also consider that 1) if you can’t patent a herb/supplement- there will likely be very few studies backing its corresponding efficacy. 2) Finasteride and 5ar inhibitors are STILL around because there is not enough solid literature regarding the severely detritmental side effects to remove them from the market ( updated warnings on the packaging seems to be the only headway our movement has made - FFS!!!). Moreover, MERCK alone makes an abosolute killing off finasteride, thus they will use their considerable influence and prolong any movement to cease its distribution - making money obviously being the key factor. 3) PFS suffers seeking consultations, remedies and relief regarding their condition must understand that any widespread medically recognised treatment will likely be something which another pharmaceutical will no doubt capitalise off as much as they can- thus the BS cycle continues.

Hence my rational for taking matters into my own hands as opposed to waiting, waiting… waiting ( which a surprising amount of sufferers advocate claiming eventually some Neuro-endocrinologist will discover the root cause Blah blah blah- i’m sorry, but despite the strong rational behind the “waiting for the medical community to cure us”, we have literally been rotting in the interim - and i refused to continue to play along with all the bureaucratic BS that came with this… LOL i do boldly point out that quite a few fantastic inventions, revelations and events in this world were sourced by an irrational thought or idea.

ANYWAY- just thought i’d share my mindset LOL via another novel… ( clearly i’m happy this appears to be behind me!)

So i quit around about this time last year- heavy side effects continued and persisted with intermittent spikes in inprovement (none lasting), until around 2 months ago- directly after stalling my old routine of vitimins, and commencing Progesterone and Deprenyl - which i believe was vastly responsible for my recovery/ continued improvement.
But please let me also stress to you the untapped potential of placebo. I cover this quite regularly in my studies, and there is a certainly a strong presence in medical literature surrounding its ability to correct imbalances in your bodies physical and psychological chemistry. (This clearly demonstrates our lack of understanding regarding the human mind/body complex).
In other words, i FIRMLY believe that you stand better chance of recovering if you adopt that mindset and stick to what ever routine you choose- whether it be mine or someone elses.

So yes, i think with a few months of hard work- absolutely. As i essentially did this after 6 years (stop-start) of 5ar inhibition (not that tenor appears to matter!). I wouldn’t go so far as to tell you what supplement and activity regime to adopt (i can only share mine) as we are all different, but i’m sure your more than capable of evaluating what you’ve read and learned here and elsewhere, apply this knowledge, then couple it with the belief you will beat this.

PS: if your are giving my method a shot, there are a few different sources for Selegeline, a simple google search will provide your options. my one was antiaging-systems.com

progesterone cream is pretty widepread too…

So once again, hope this helped… and that you can, if anything, take away a little more hope from my story… and use it to fuel your own.

All the best.


#14

I’m using a modified verision of this guy’s protocol and it’s working pretty well. Instead of doing Deprenyl + Progesgerone cream everyday, I’m doing it every other day, applying low doses of Andractim on alternate days. Then cycling Amino Acids and other supplements, similiar to cdnuts. Been doing this protocol for one month and I’m about to ween myself off both the Deprenyl and Andractim. Have had significant improvements in all areas except ED. My plan to tackle that is up the intensity of my workouts and keep cycling the amino acids.

This modified verision has worked well. Maybe someone could try this protocol, then add and develop it further.

It’s not without sides. I’ve had bloating and weight gain, likely from the progesterone cream. The Andractim suppresses your HPTA which has cost me my nocturnal erections. Both Dr. Crisler and Awor warn about supplementing DHT for a reason, but I find that low doses EOD has helped a lot. Hopefully I will keep my gains after quitting, while my HPTA gets back to normal.


#15

Second Amendment- that is fantastic, of all the theories/potential treatment plans I have reviewed and matched to a) our symptoms and b) what finasteride is known to actually do, this plan theoretically sounded like the best to address our condition. Have you thought about possibly combining selegeline with 5htp?


#16

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#17

Isn’t Deprenyl a hard core drug used to treat Parkinsons??


#18

looks like it might take something hardcore to get a desired result.


#19

Maybe. The only skepticisim I have is that he was only off a short while before recovering. It could have just been a natural recovery. If he can come back and confirm he is recovered this thread should be moved to the recoveries section.


#20

if you guy googel or go on Messo there was guy with ID DavidZee or DavidZ. He was on mono HCG therapy for years and took Sleglinine and claimed to have good benefits but again one guy’s experience can not become a rule.