One month on Fin destroyed me, feminised body,

Member Stories
#1

Welcome to our community. Please fill in the following template as a way of introducing yourself, and helping others to understand your background and situation.

Where are you from (country)?
UK
How did you find this forum (Google search – if so, what search terms? Via link from a forum or website – if so, what page? Other?)
Google
What is your current age, height, weight?
27,6,0, 90kg
What specific drug did you use (finasteride, dutasteride, saw palmetto, isotretinoin/Accutane, fluoxetine, sertraline, citalopram, leuprorelin, etc…)?
Finasteride
What dose did you take (eg. 1 mg/day, 1 mg every other day etc.)?
0.5mg eod
What condition was being treated with the drug?
MPB
For how long did you take the drug (weeks/months/years)?
1month
Date when you started the drug?
28/05/2020
Date when you quit the drug?
30/06/2020
Age when you quit?
25
How did you quit (cold turkey or taper off)?
Cold
How long into your usage did you notice the onset of side effects?
First pill
What side effects did you experience that have yet to resolve since discontinuation?
Feminisation, Male boobs
Check the boxes that apply. You can save your post first, then interactively check/uncheck the boxes by clicking on them. If your symptoms change, please update your list.

Sexual
[ Y] Loss of Libido / Sex Drive
[Y ] Erectile Dysfunction
[Y ] Complete Impotence
[ Y] Loss of Morning Erections
[ ] Loss of Spontaneous Erections
[ ] Loss of Nocturnal Erections
[ ] Watery Ejaculate
[ ] Reduced Ejaculate
[ ] Inability or Difficulty to Ejaculate / Orgasm
[ ] Reduced Sperm Count / Motility

Mental
[ Y] Emotional Blunting / Emotionally Flat
[ ] Difficulty Focusing / Concentrating
[ ] Confusion
[ ] Memory Loss / Forgetfulness
[ ] Stumbling over Words / Losing Train of Thought
[ ] Slurring of Speech
[ Y] Lack of Motivation / Feeling Passive / Complacency
[ ] Extreme Anxiety / Panic Attacks
[Y ] Severe Depression / Melancholy
[Y ] Suicidal Thoughts

Physical
[ ] Penile Tissue Changes (narrowing, shrinkage, wrinkled)
[ ] Penis curvature / rotation on axis
[ Y] Testicular Pain
[ ] Testicular Shrinkage / Loss of Fullness
[ ] Genital numbness / sensitivity decrease
[ ] Weight Gain
[Y ] Gynecomastia (male breasts)
[Y ] Muscle Wastage
[ ] Muscle Weakness
[ ] Joint Pain
[ ] Dry / Dark Circles under eyes

Misc
[ ] Prostate pain
[ ] Persistent Fatigue / Exhaustion
[ ] Stomach Pains / Digestion Problems
[ ] Constipation / “Poo Pellets”
[ ] Vision - Acuity Decrease / Blurriness
[ ] Tinnitus (ringing or high pitched sound in ears)
[ ] Hearing loss
[ ] Increased hair loss
[ ] Frequent urination
[ ] Lowered body temperature

[ ] Other (please explain)

What (if any) treatments have you undertaken to recover from your side effects since discontinuation of the drug?
Mnay things, Letrozole, Arimidex, Pretty much every AI out there. Tribulus, Tongkat, Proviron, Nolvadex, Cabergoline, L-dopa, Epiandrosterone, Winstrol,

If you have pre or post-drug blood tests, what hormonal changes have you encountered since discontinuing the drug (please post your test results in the “Blood Tests” section and link to them in your post)?
N/A

Anything not listed in the above questions you’d like to share about your experience?

hI been lurking a long time and reading stories and thought now i should post my own. I took fin on 28/05/2020. Initially took 1mg on the first day and then from there took 0.5mg eod. Had ballache first day which then subsided. I was depressed during the treatment which stopped after discontinuation. In total I took around 15 dosages. My hair had stopped falling out and my hairline looked stronger. Stopped the last week because i had crazy chest sensitivity, took my t shirt off i my body looked so soft and feminine. I had grown boobies. My chest was literally sticking out like a womans, and it seemingly happened overnight. I hadn’t even realized. I began to panic, immediately threw out all the medication and quickly bought some arimidex the same day from a gym friend. I took one and didn’t feel any reduction in chest sensitivity, tried more and got some nolva too, but nothing. Bought some letro instead and all sensations stopped. Im currently still on letro, usually taking one every day (2.5mg), if i can get away with half i do that.

Tried many medications over the past two years. pretty much every AI you can think off. Only one that works is letro. 6-oxo and 6-bromo also helped but they also give me slight gyno too. which is unfortunate becasue i can feel the dht running through my body, They make me horny, how I was pre fin. And whenever i stopped running them i have to get back on the letro.Everything else has no impact Exemestane give me bad brain fog. At the moment I have no sexual sides, the only thing I have is decreased libido however my dick still works so im thankful for that but my body will feminise if i dont take letro. So im not sure exactly why this is or how to fix it. Pre fin i was hovering around 88kg, After one month off fin i was down to 77. Keep in ming that this was during UK lockdown, however lost so much muscle, no more abs, my legs were soft like a womans.

Tried caber, l-dopa and mk677 but they make me worse. My left breast balloons up when i take them so i’m thinking its because of growth hormone? Caber makes me even more feminised. Same thing happens on tongakt and tribulus. Tried a 6week cycle of winstrol, still had to take letro every day. Weighing now 90kg, have decent broad shoulders and legs, however my chest still puffy and undefined. Saw CD nuts log and tried androhard, was only on for 4 weeks but helped flaten my chest and tone me up a but, but like always i have to take letro, I dont understand. I dont want to take it but id be a full woman without it. Not sure what can cure me, i still get turned off if talk to girls, but I have no motivation, low libido.

I can build muscle which is good, my thinking is clear nowadays. My diet is clean. Im trying another androhard cycle rn, Its been two days, Im going to run for 8-12 weeks, whenever the bottle finishes. I dont care anymore about my hair. I walk around number 0 all over. I just want to be able to go out in a tshirt. Last two years I spent the whole summer locked in my room. Literally nobody knows, i wear a hoody if i ever go out even if its 30 degrees celcius. How do i fix this please. Im not ever sure if its estrogen related now, since my breasts expand when i take l-dopa, how does that even work?! I have no other problems now, no digestive issues, or brain fog. please somebody help.
I should also add that I have tried low dose zinc, even 5mg gives me testicular pain.
Surely someone has had similar experience.

1 Like
#2

I’ve been in a similar condition (but with brain fog + digestion issues). I think the androgen cycling is helpful…you might require a lot of them though. You also have to eat extremely clean (low carb) and find the type/amount of exercise that works best for you.

Regarding the puffiness/watery fat all over the body, this is probably due to our low androgen function where blood levels may be fine but deep inside the tissues, the estrogen is dominating.

Be careful with the AIs…those have set a lot of people back (including me). As a former bodybuilder, I can certainly understand wanting to prevent gyno, etc, but I just don’t see how one can actually recover with an AI drug. Have you tried DIM and/or Boron? Those are just as good at lowering E2, but much safer. I actually prefer Boron since I’m so sensitive to AI drugs (they crash me) and DIM has a very similar effect on me.

#3

If it’s just water / puffiness will taking a diuretic help? Why do you think it’s not possible to recover with an ai? When i was taking 6-bromo I was so horny, chest tightened however then my nipples began to itch and even 40mg nolva couldn’t stop it. I don’t go higher on nolva since i look so bad. It reduces off big time. Ive tried dim but no help. I’ve read that dim is a 5ar inhibitor so probably won’t try it again. I tried calcium d glucarate. Even high dose 4000mg daily, felt nothing. I will try boron, what dose you recommend and brand? Appreciate your reply. I don’t even get signs of low estrogen even taking letro. My joints don’t crack or nothing. Even today having taken letro, had no choice, my left breast around the edge comes out, this is probably water retention or what do you think? Please the sooner i can solve this, i just want to be able to wear a t-shirt this summer.

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#4

The diuretic might help with bloating but obviously not the gyno or the root problem. You seem to be aromatizing heavily since you’re able to tolerate regular letro. The reason I don’t think an AI like letro would lead to long-term recovery is that it also doesn’t treating the root of the problem. It also has rebound effects.

You could try the boron at 3mg 2x/day as an alternative. It starts reducing E2 and SHBG within hours. I wouldn’t go over 9mg/day total though (check your multi).

What’s your total and free T levels?

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#5

Ye i don’t want to use letro long term but ATM it’s the only option. The gyno is pretty much gone, been using raloxifine whenever i felt a little bump and it’s always gone but i know some AIs like 6-oxo caused it but they also make my chest tight which is why I prefer them.
I’ve also tried enclomphine, i don’t get any itchy nipples from it just water retention around my breasts which is the biggest problem. Should I try a pharma diuretic? I just bought some boron. Will have to wait till I received and will inform you. I don’t have any bloods levels. I should get them but i thought if I’m taking letro every day my W2 on blood test will be crashed and the results will be skewed.

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#6

I would hold off on experimenting with diuretics. I’m not a doctor, but I assume they come with some risks.

Definitely get your Hormone levels checked - Total T, Free T, Estradiol (ultra-sensitive test), SHBG, LH/FSH, etc.

Gyno can occur from several different hormonal imbalances:

  • High prolactin (more rare)
  • Bad FT to E2 ratio, including:
    (1) low T / normal E2,
    (2) normal T / high E2, and
    (3) high T / high E2.
    It also depends on your individual susceptibility to it.
#7

Aye will do. How long before a blood test should i not take anything? Why not over 9mg boron?

1 Like
#8

Two weeks. Not much data on doses above that amount. Could be similar to over-calcification…idk.

#9

Okay should I continue taking Andro hard? Androhard is a dht supplement but even with that i got to take an ai. The dht boost isn’t enough for me. I haven’t taken any letro today. Can feel my chest more puffy and outwards. Only taken a estro complex with i3c, broccoli and calcium d glucarate. It’s literally so hard not to take letro because if i don’t my body changes so fast. How can this happen and I don’t have sexual sides. I can get hard no problem, please this doesn’t make any sense. I took 5mg mk677 once and the breasts ballooned up. You know what this means? Also i tried zinc once, 5mg hurt my balls like the first time i took fin.

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#10

This is a tough call because on one hand you need to see what is going on in your bloodwork when it’s not being influenced by anything…on the other hand, you don’t want ti-tays. Are you sure it’s full, glandular gyno or just water retention in the chest? Also, how lean are you? If you’re carrying any unnatural fat, it will make you aromatize heavily. Unfortunately with PFS, we have to work much harder to stay lean. But if you can get your total BF down to 10% or better, E2 won’t be a problem.

Only thing I can think of to have it both ways is to go on a very strict, low-carb diet to prevent the gyno while you’re waiting for the hormones to level out for the bloodwork.

#11

I believe it’s water retention, but have no clue. I just know that it feels like they are expanding. Like if i don’t take letro my breast later sticks out more. Maybe it’s water? my breast curve around the sides. I tried dandelion root which is a natural diuretic, made me go toilet more but no physical changes. I’m very lean, my legs, thighs, arms, back have no fat. Just seems to hit my chest and belly. I even took yohimbine HCl 15mg every day for two weeks doing cardio empty stomach. Was extremely tough work, at the end had no fat on my love handles but still chest had no definition and would expand without letro. And with regards to other AIs such as arimidex they do literally nothing at all. I don’t want to take letro, i tried Olympus labs eliminate which has luteolin in it and still nothing. I can take 10mg arimidex and it does nothing. I’m 6ft, stronger, fitter more athletic than I’ve ever been. Max squat pre fin was 170kg, nowadays 190kg. Deadlifting 230kg. My shoulders are broad and i have good strong base. like Ivan Drago with tits.
I can jerk it off rn if i wanted, i don’t understand how pretty much everyone has sexual side effect and i don’t. Im grateful i don’t just trying to understand why. Only reason Im not horny is because this shit is on my mind 24/7. I tried liver cleanse, with liv 52 and milk thistle. No improvement. Creatine no improvement. Even tried andractim and nothing. Surely there must be something out there to stop this estrogen madness.

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#12

It sounds like “pseudo-gyno” same as me. It expands and contracts depending on diet (esp. carbs, salt), amount of sweat, and ambient temps.

I would drop all those supps…they are only going to hit your wallet…and get tested

#13

Ye that’s what it sounds like but it seriously expands fast when i don’t take an ai. I don’t know if i can go long without letro. As of right now it’s the only thing i take. If i get tested how long should I not take anything for. What you mean amount of sweat? Isn’t this psuedo also because of estrogen dominance?

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#14

Yes, it can still be pseudo from E2 dominance. That causes us water retention in feminine areas (chest/stomach). When you sweat heavily and then cool off, you’ll probably notice that your chest is much tighter.

I would very slowly wean off the letro so you don’t get hit with its rebound effect (probably why you notice the breast swelling when you’ve been trying to stop). Just keep cutting that fucker up into smaller and smaller pieces over the course of a week or so…then get bloodwork at least two weeks out from there.

#15

That’s exactly where the water retention is. This makes sense. I’ve tried many times to taper off it. But then when I’m off the same symptoms return. If i don’t take full dose, my chest is all puffy. I also just got boron, should I try this now? Or wait?

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#16

I would take boron 3mg 1x/day when you begin the letro taper, and then start 3mg 2x/day when you’re finished.

#17

I’ll try boron tomorrow. I’m from the UK and i don’t really want to go to the doctor for a blood test. Will this be ok https://www.optimale.co.uk/product/optiman-blood-test/# or should I go to the doctor and tell him what the situation is. Also wouldn’t the boron mess with my blood results?

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#18

No sense in going through the doctor yet. Most are useless with PFS and will only think you’re mental if you ask for any in-depth exploration.

I would opt for the Enhanced Testosterone Blood Test since it includes LH/FSH and some extra ancillaries. The boron could mess with it yes, but you’re trying to straddle not getting gyno and not screwing up too much of your bloodwork. If you feel you need some E2 protection, boron seems to be a milder approach.

#19

ye ill go for that one, i appreciate your replies. Do you think its best to leave the boron for now and just use raloxifine only, and take only that for 1/2 weeks and get tested so i dont use an ai. I didnt use any letro yesterday

#20

Until you get bloodwork, I would refrain from the Ralox too. It will artificially increase LH/FSH, T/E , and possibly SHBG. You want to get as close as possible to a baseline of where everything stands.