My plan is to have this third sleep study so he can see that I do not have SA- I don’t even snore. Once that is outruled, I’m hoping that my ‘significant arousals from slow wave sleep’ and chronic fatigue during the day will suffice for a xyrem rx. I
I think this forum is full of studies and theories backing this up, you just need to search it a bit.
Yep, I found a study that I will show to my doctor.
“A New Look at the 5á-Reductase Inhibitor Finasteride”, CNS Drug Reviews, Vol. 12, No. 1, pp. 53–76.
Keywords: Alcohol withdrawal — Allopregnanolone — Depression — Epilepsy — Finasteride
— Neuroactive steroids — Seizure susceptibility— Sexual behavior.
onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1 … D5C.f02t03
Going to d more digging on here too.
this is the kind of stuff you have to take to him.
you have to take him the official studies and possibly your conclusions.
And if I were you I would emphasize “scientific studies” a lot and maybe I would avoid the word “internet”, since that would seem associated to anecdotal evidence…I wouldn’t refer this website unless you have gained his trust and I would say I found the studies on pubmed or some scientific database on your university…
I am happy to say I slept great this week, it’s the first time in YEARS I am able to sleep properly ALL the days of the working week… I can’t emphasize enough how much of a difference in my mood this makes and also in libido.
I hope I keep having benefits this night and next weeks. Cheers guys, never give up
I can’t wait to see how you’ll get along with Xyrem. I’m willing to try it myself (under medical supervision) after your results.
There are some people in the forum that recovered with it.
Keep us posted mate!
Hi, how is this going’?
Please can you let me know if your sleep problem is constant or if its aggravated whenever theres a minimal stressor like having to get up to work next day?
I seem to follow this ridiculous pattern where I can sleep enough on weekends and even feel fine, but on workdays I have this horrible insomnia, which goes anywhere from constant waking up every 2 hours to early morning awakening.
Still pushing forward, I am working simultaneously with both NHS doctors (two sleep specialists one of whom is a neurologist) and also going to private sleep specialist who is also a neurologist too (I go on the 13th). In addition the study I posted above I have found another. I have forwarded it to both doctors. Here it is:
Finasteride treatment and neuroactive steroid formation.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19655698
Things I am using at the moment are magnesium (natural calm), raw cacao (for the feel good chemicals and activation of BDNF), Turmeric (which ups serotonin and is neuroprotective/ups BDNF), astaxanthin (neuroprotective), krill oil (low mercury, more absorption than regular fish oil), and coconut oil (brain fuel).
Cacao and BDNF:
“Cocoa powder triggers neuroprotective and preventive effects in a human Alzheimer’s disease model by modulating BDNF signaling pathway.”
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23554028
Turmeric on raising serotonin and activating BDNF:
“Antidepressant-like effects of curcumin in WKY rat model of depression is associated with an increase in hippocampal BDNF”
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0166432812006997
Coconut oil and the brain:
Astaxanthin for brain health
These are just to help you guys out if you are concerned about the effect of sleep deprivation- just to add, a study stated that cucurmin (turmeric) ameliorated the effects of sleep deprivation on the brain. Food for through- literally!
I’ve also eliminated foods that are inflammatory- namely, gluten, wheat and dairy. I’m doing a lot better.
I will update how it goes with the doctors but it will not be frequent- staying away from this site helps. I will not be checking for any responses. Be strong and soldier on guys.
Bad news- the NHS neurologist looked at the studies I sent him and replied by letter that he did not believe Propecia was the cause of my sleep issues… Sleep apnea treatment is still going forward- once these quacks see that this is not the solution, they will have no other alternative than to prescribe medication to restore deep sleep.
Big surprise there. Doctors are not able to think independently. CPAP salesman. I think everyone that goes to a sleep study get the same diagnosis. I am not so sure about XYRem being a silver bullet solution either. I have PM a few people that supposedly have tried it. Like all other medications it doesn’t bring back your natural sleep. It has it’s own set of side effects ect. Last night I pulled a full 8 hours of sleep with decent dream periods. Woke up feeling decent. It’s been about an hour and I’m already feeling sluggish, unmotivated, and tired. I used Ambian cr, melotonin 5mg.
Hi. I have taken P for 14 years. I had a terrible time sleeping. My heart raced, I’d jump up in the middle of the night, ect.
Once I stopped P, the heart stuff has seemed to subside, but I still had trouble sleeping at first. I solved this problem. I realized the biggest problem I was having was, get this, NAPS. It sounds silly, but I was taking a nap or two throughout the day. Then when it came time to sleep, I’d have to down a melatonin, a night time asprin, affectionately reffered to as the “blue bomber”, and if that didn’t work, Nyquil.
In any case, wicked unhealthy. But I quit the naps. It was hard at first, but once I did, I now sleep through the night soundly. It’s a blessing. You need sleep for your brain to be repaired at night.
The type of insomnia most of these guys have has nothing to do with naps.
I am one of “these guys”.
If you have insomnia, and you take naps during the day, you can very easily rule out if the source of your insomnia is nap related by eliminating naps for a week and see if you sleep better.
I know talking about “naps” as a problem sounds kind of lame, but your circadian rhythm cycle is very complex. If you’re getting premature sleep before you go for your full night’s sleep, this can cause insomnia by screwing with your sleep rhythms.
Sleep issues aren’t resolved, however, there are noticeably slow improvements. It does seem worse when I’m stressed and have to get up for work. That’s actually pretty bad.
I’m using Seriphos to lower cortisol and help with HPA Axis dysregulation. Lowering cortisol which seems rampant can help with DHEA levels.
amazon.co.uk/Interplexus-Inc … s=seriphos
I’m also taking L-theanine - no gaba agonists like Valerian, xanax etc.
Also, Magneisum Threonate, which is said to pass more easily into the brain.
Bulletproof Upgraded Aging formula which contains oxaloacetate is helping as it lowers glutamate in the brain.
I’ve also just ordered DHEA which is said to help with deeper sleep. Also, I tried Progesterone cream and it didn’t help with sleep.
Tried GHB, worked for one night- rapid tolerance. Did not help.
Currently following ketogenic diet for brain benefits but also to help with gaba production.
Doctor’s are following sleep apnea diagnosis.
That’s all the updates I have right now.
Sleep issues aren’t resolved, however, there are noticeably slow improvements. It does seem worse when I’m stressed and have to get up for work. That’s actually pretty bad."
This is where i am at.
Have you tried SSRIs?
Also: have you tried any of these?
-tianeptine
-n acetyl glucosamine + flax seed oil + turmeric
-saphron
-cannabis…
-chiropractor
-accunpunture
-yoga…surf…
- do you have ANY sort of pain or discomfort, especially in your back?
Let me know
I have been pretty sore in my upper back/neck region for the past week.
I can vouch for the chiropractor. At the 5th treatment i have been able to sleep again. Not a miracle but i can finally, since september or so, sleep the 7-9hours a night again…although i cant get rid of that early morning waking up for a couple hours. If i had to work id still be fuckd up.
Today was the 7th treatment. Its been 7days since i sleep 7-9hours a night and i feel much better. Unfortunately its interrupted sleep. I hope tgat it keeps getting better.
Im sure though, theres anpther underlying problem. But back pain was one of them
Just an up-date. No progress with doctors. In fact I haven’t seen them since my last post.
I have,however, had a major breakthrough with my sleep and am confident to say that its the best I have slept since this whole thing started.
Here it is: Seroquel and Phenibut. Seroquel is without question the most powerful sedative I have tried and I have tried alot of sleeping drugs and anti-anxiety meds. The wonderful thing about Seroquel is that there is no tolerance buildup. I have been taking seroquel since Feb 2016 and its still working today. I don’t take more than 200 mg a night (at higher doses its used as an anti-psychotic). I recently added in phenibut at doses of 250-500 mg. It’s the best I have ever slept since PFS.
With regards to the phenibut tolerance, I have been taking it for two weeks and the sedative quality of seroquel is guarding against any withdrawal.
It goes without saying that I would prefer not to have to take these drugs but without them I simply don’t sleep and without sleep I don’t see how I could prossible make ay healing progress with PFS.
Just my experience and its working for me.
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Interesting Jamie. I know both me and you took Xyrem and had little results. Is the good sleep translating to anything beneficial while you’re awake? Do you feel like you’re reaching deep sleep? I believe (like me) that you said you have no deep sleep in your sleep studies, right?
I did try Xyrem but it was not prescription… and yes it gave me an initial deep four hours and then never worked again. I also felt so toxic with it.
Yes 3 sleep studies showed that I was not getting sufficient deep sleep. One I took valium with and I did get deep sleep - so the gaba deficiency is proved by that.
I feel better and I almost feel as if I am close to getting over this. I have to be careful with the phenibut because the ringing of glutamate (excitotoxicty) can be present the next day.
I feel I need a few more heavy nights with the seroquel and phenibut, then hopefully things may start to really improve, but I am feeling better just still not my old self.