I could literally write a novel, so I will try to summarize…
Took Saw Paletto on and off for years…ages 15-18. I did not have baldness or prostate issues. Immediately upon stopping I developed no sex drive, no energy, major EQ issues, mental fatigue, etc
One weird symptom was it was like I could not “lift” or flex my penis, it was like it was just there to slowly flow out urine, that is it. Also prostate issue immediately began.
Doctors were no help. One product I used to use Dymatize Z-Force (tribulus + mucuna) helped immensly. Made me feel like I was 18 again. I could cycle that on and off for results, but slowly it began to not work anymore. Now if I take it, my nipples just get puffy.
So I went on TRT for 3-5 years. Tried Testosterone, HCG, and AI…in all different doses and combinations. My hormone levels looked great so many times. But Not much help. A little with mental attitute and muscle, but not worth enough to stay on…
Finally noticed a year ago a 24 hour urinary panel that my cortisol was very low (even though all blood tests show it high). Started hydro cortisone which has helped so much with energy, mental fog, some muscle, etc. I would almost say its been life saving. However, my sex drive did not change at all and then became my biggest worry. All of the things that had improved dont even matter when you have no sex drive, you feel worthless, like a waste of life almost, even though you can enjoy life…make any sense?
I read a thread here JN Story. He noticed high reverse T3. I noticed that I always had freezing hands and feet + some other hypo symptoms. So I tested my rT3 and it was high.
I am now on week 8 or so of T3 therapy to clear reverse T3. I would say it has hepled a bit with more energy and my coldness is gone. But still not much help with sex drive.
If this fails…I will look at SHBG (from T3)…nuerotranmitters…etc
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July 29th, 2011
Update: Here is a little bit more detailed picture of my story…
About, 6 years ago, I was on spring break my senior year of high school. During this whole week I was using Saw Pawmetto, basically because I heard it was healthy and had used it and some other vitamins off and on just to stay healthy (vit c, glucosamine, etc). So ya, I never had prostate or baldness issue prior to this, but I did take a genetic test a few months ago that said I am 2x as likely to get prostate cancer and male pattern baldness, so genetically, I was susceptible to them (even thought i didnt know it back then).
Obviously being on Spring Break there was a good amount of drinking, but I wouldn’t say anymore than average for that age. Basically the night I returned home, at one point I was shaving and halfway through, I felt like I had just been hit by a truck. I was extremely fatigued out of nowhere. I basically stopped halfway through shaving and went to bed. \I have read a lot of stories here, where people crashed after a night or week of drinking…just like me
I woke up the next morning with strep throat, impetigo rash on my mustache area, and sores in my mouth. It took me 7-10 days to recover and during that time I did not eat much cuz the sores in my mouth were so bad. Anyways I chalk the infections (strep, impetigo, and sores) just to me immune system probably being lowered from all the drinking before hand. But I noticed that my sex drive was completely gone, and at first I had issues getting erections. The doctor (and 5 after that) were all pretty shitty, tested me for STDs (even though I knew it wasn’t that as I didn’t have any sexual relations just prior to the illness). I have also read many stories, where people had illnesses, stress, infections, rashes, etc right at the onset of their crash.
*{I did have "stressors prior to the illness. The mono/ebv about 1 - 1.5 years prior. I had a knee injury (torn ACL, MCL, and PCL) from football that ruined my would be college career. the surgery for this was very big/stressfull. I also ended up having a 2nd surgery. These were 6 months and 2 months prior to illness. But still, I felt 100% fine all the way up until the illness/saw pawmetto that caused the crash}
*[Now I must admit, there were other symptoms other than libido loss. Its been a while so I forget all, but there was less energy, some erection issues, memory problems, slightly depressed (could have been from no libido though), at first it was like I could not move my penis at all there was no feeling to it, urinary flow weakened, I had one or two panic attacks, anxiety etc. But by far the worse to me was the low libido, it was emotionally and physically embarrassing and depressing. Especially considering I had a fairly new gf at the time who was a 10/10]
I tried Dymatize Z-Force, which is basically a Tribulus (testosterone) + Mucuna (dopamine) product. When I would take this, it made me feel normal again, if not, more horny that normal. I could use this for a month or 2, but would have to cycle it as it would lose effectiveness. Then it would only work for a week or two. I stopped using it for a long time. I used it once last summer and it worked for a day, then stopped. If I use it now, it wont work at all, but makes my nipples puffier. Same for other products like LongJack, Maca, etc.
So About 1-2 years after this crash (and 5 doctors later), I finally decided to pay to see Dr. Crisler. He got me more labs tests done. My testosterone came back extremely low. I had about 2 tests prior to this (but post crash), and testosterone came back normal. Oh, well I though I finally found something that would help me. So I went on TRT. I tried different doses, with and without AI and HCG. So many times my labs looked perfect. I had a slight boost in mental thoughts, but that is about it. So after 3-4 years on TRT, I decided it wasnt worth it and stopped cold turkey. This was a year ago, and my latest labs (24 hour urninary) shows midrange testosterone at the moment.
Around the same time I noticed that a 24 hour urinary panel (from years ago) had really low cortisol. Well I did have a lot of symptoms of adrenal fatigue, but my blood cortisol tests ALWAYS came back good or even nearly high. I decided to try hydro cortisone. This was one year ago and I am still on it. It helped a TON with energy and mental fog. But still, my libido was very low. I assume that the illness originally lowered my cortisol it just got worse and worse over the years. For what its worth it took me 8 months to find the right dose and timing of HC to make me feel good.
Just a few months ago, I found out about reverse T3. I never suspected thyroid issues because thyroid labs were always good. But I did have some hypothyroid symptoms as well and my hands and feet were ALWAYS cold. So I got reverse T3 testes and sure enough it was high. I have been on t3 now for 9 weeks now. It has cured the cold feet/hands, maybe gave me more energy and mental awareness, but still, no libido. At this point, most of the time I can get an erection that is strong and lasts though, so this is a big improvement, even though it is not as strong and fierce as it used to be. It still takes more effort to get it up too.
Technically reverse T3 doesnt completely clear from the cells until 12 weeks after T3 supplementation, but I doubt that in 3 weeks when this happens I will suddenly get my libido back. Either way, hopefully after the rT3 clearance, I will be able to get off T3 and my Rt3 levels wont rise again. I suspect they were high in the first place from either the acute illness or low cortisol and just got “stuck” high (this can and does happen).
I do still have an extremely weakened urinary flow, so bad that my stream splits into two… which is prostate issues. I have never brought this up to Drs, but I have had weakened stream, dull ache in pelvic floor, dribble and stop/start especially at end of urination. All of these prostate issue came on day 1 of my crash.
I really want to get more comprehensive blood tests to see EXACTLY where everything is at that point and go from there. My issue now is $$ (after I have spent thousands of my own to get to where I am currently ,which I have very little of left and wont be working again until January since I am student teaching and do not get payed for it. Doctors have been no help. Even Dr Crisler, who is a world leader did not help much. It was myself that discovered adrenal + reverse t3 issues. I had to explain to my family dr what reverse t3 was. Now he says I am a hypochondriac and worry too much. so I doubt I’ll be going back to him.
Also, I continued to take Saw Palmetto on and off after the crash, all the way up to 6 months ago. I simply had no idea that it was what caused my PFS crash. It wasnt until recently that I found out this, and that it is actually banned in Denmark for its sides.
. This SUCKS, because no sex drive has probably been my biggest complaint. It sucks not wanting to have sex with a sexy girlfriend, it makes it hard to keep a gf. Once the rT3 clears in 2-3 weeks, I will most likely go off of T3 (Cynomel from Mexico) and see if when my thyroid starts producing t4 again, if lots of it converts to the reverseT3. I do not think it will (hope), but it is possible. If it does, I will likely be on T3 for the rest of my life.