I’ve always wanted to try masteron
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Oh I’ve heard of people doing just HCG. My doctor wanted me to do that first but I just dove in head first and decided to do both. Did it ever make you feel good? What was your body’s T level in blood tests before and after?
The problem with T is that if you want to try it properly you need to do it for 3 months or more. When I started they told me I would not notice anything for 2 to 4 weeks and it’s fairky true. I didn’t feel great until about week 6.
I haven’t done an after test. The last test I did for test levels was before I did anything and total test was high, like 1200. However, free test was below the normal range. I didn’t get an estradiol test at the time as I didn’t know that much back then. I had previously read that HCG affects more than just T which is why I was interested in it. It sounded like some of the other impacts could be beneficial.
I felt really good a week or so ago as far as confidence, body felt lean and strong, etc but genital numbess was just as bad. Didn’t take HCG for a week and Friday was the first time in a while sensitivity wasn’t an issue.
It’s back to being an issue today though. And my balls are super high, like wanting to go up into my stomach high feeling. Is that a typical high estrogen symptom? Also could not ejaculate even after 45 mins of sex and stopping a few times to try to get better numbness wise, which usually works.
I’m going to try to get some blood tests done tomorrow so I can get a better idea where I’m at. I’ve been guessing and impatiently jumping between ideas I read online far too often
Well if your taking testosterone and your your T was at 1200 your estrogen is going to be high. I’m not sure on HCG but I know it has the potential to raise estrogen more than Testosterine injections. If you go to t-nation and do some digging I think I’ve seen many explanations why. As for symptoms, everyone is different. My balks don’t change but the wjaculation thing is 100% something I’ve faced on high E. I do on low E too but technically it’s hard to get an erection on low T. I didn’t know low dose HCG could get you to 1200. I feel pretty mean at 1200. I’ve been all the way up past 1500 (miss calculated dose in the beginning) and I didn’t feel good. My T now is at 800 with injectable T and hcg. I’ve increased a little lately and need my own tests. If I were a gambling man, I’d throw down $1000 on that your E is too high. The problem is on HCG an AI will not help as much as it would with me. Again t-nation can explain why and I’ve read this 20x over there. I do know if your T is at 800 you are taking way too much. Cut your dose down by 1/2 or 1/3. You should skip a week.
Thanks, I’ll do some digging and read some more. I have a feeling high E is the issue as well. Hoping to do some tests tomorrow or Tuesday to see
I also read the last lime of your other post. One of the biggest mistakes I make myself and others make is making changes and not waiting long e Pugh. I don’t know about HCG but I know on T that any change takes 4 weeks to level out and be realized. Playing with hormones is not a fast game.
I think HCG is probably just as long as far as it leveling out. There’s something weird about HCG and estrogen, something about intra cellular or intra testicular estrogen or something that Arimidex can’t do anything about. I remember reading about it but don’t remember all the details
It’s very frustrating to start trying something like HCG or amino acids or whatever that I read about online… then I keep reading and find people that got worse on that treatment so it’s like at the first sign of trouble it’s like screw that… not going to get worse like that person online did, so then I try something else instead of sticking with it long enough to really see how it’s going to work
But yeah, regardless, I need to get some bloodwork done. I decided not to take anything else until I get bloodwork so I can get an idea where I’m at
Any suggestions on what to get tested?
At minimum I’m going to do total test, free test, estradiol, maybe prolactin just to be sure.
Any other suggestions? I really want to get everything possible tested, including thyroid, etc. but until I go to a doc it’s too expensive for me to be paying for out of pocket. Guess I need to work on finding a doc around here that will take me seriously soon too
No not really … How old are you btw? if your young I would not mess with injecting T unless you are below 400 naturally. Even then I’d find an endo who can run periodic tests. most testing centers have a men’s test for those taking T. Sbgh, free T, total t, estrogen etc but I’m not sure what you are doing or why your taking HCG now. If you have insurance you can get a test whether you want, you just have to go to a DR. Were you feeling bad before this? I don’t know your story but it sounds like you were not feeling right and now your playing around with hcg and other things. I’ve done the same and I played with many things including clomid (clomid reset). It’s really important to know your tests before hcg … if you were feeling bad it could be your t3 or t4 or cortisol or estrogen or any number of things. (I had low E and high cortisol) you need a baseline before you start messing with things. Personally I’d stop everything for a while (I.e 4 weeks) and go back to whatever your normal is first. Assuming you have insurance Get an appointment with an endo. I can just create an appointment with any endo in nyc as long as I pay the copay and they have the time. I just wouldn’t go into an endo unless your off the juice for a month. If your late 30s you also need to baseline your PSA before you mess with testosterone just so you can monitor if it’s rising for prostate reasons. I wouldn’t worry about that for now. Now assuming you are not feeling right and assuming you go to an endo is probably be straight up with him and tell him what was going on before and that you tried HCG. I tell mine everything and he’s all about experimenting.
Actually I just read through some of your posts and see it’s sexual and desensitization along with long refractory period. Among everything I said in the last post I’d cut way back on hcg. I’d probably stop for a while. I do have something for you that I use often. I go to Colombia 6 or 7 times a year. I have many lovers there so I basically go for a long weekend or a full week and basically just have sex all weekend haha. Sometimes 6x a day. I needed help because my lovers are half my age so I found a few drugs that work for me. Cialis, horny goat weed (don’t laugh, it works), cabergoline, and provirone. If you drop the HCG and get your estrogen back to normal I can promise this will make you a sex machine in a few days. Technically you only need the caber. .25mg once or maybe twice a week . The provirone isn’t needed but I love it. Makes me a 15yo horny dog. It is a form of DHT so I use it sparingly. Horny goat weed is icing on the cake. I take a supplement with that and maca and ginsing and Arganine etc all in one. I personally drop about .25 caber once a week and within 3 days I’m horny… I don’t do it every week. If you take too much it can have opposite effect on libido. Literally search for “cabergoline dosage sex” and read
Thanks, I’ll have to read through your post a bit closer once I get to work but I agree, I’m stopping everything until I get bloodwork done. My insurance will cover testing as well, but I need to find an endo that is taking new patients around here that will request them
I found a package of tests through Labcorp that covers Prolactin, Total and Free Testosterone, Sensitive Estradiol, DHT, TSH, Free T3 and Free T4 for <$200 so I may go ahead and do that and see where I’m at. Then I’m 2-3 weeks I’ll go to an endo and let them test everything they want to test
Come to think of it, in late 2017 my primary care doc did bloodwork, but I’m not sure what all he tested. That was before I stopped fin and I was much better off symptom wise then, so I’d be interested in seeing those results just to see if they cover any of the sexual hormones or not so I have some sort of baseline. Obviously I’d rather have results from before fin but don’t have a time machine.
Thanks for taking the time to go back and see what my issues are. Yes, desensitizity and long refractory period are my main issues. I don’t have any issues with ED fortunately. If anything I’m a walking hard on these days, haha. But that makes it super frustrating when I can’t get the job done or go half numb during sex.
I have tried caber and proviron already due to other stories like yours of it turning people into sex machines. I am willing to try it again though. I didn’t try the two together. Caber gave me a headache from what I recall. I think that’s why I stopped taking it.
I was only taking about 0.125mg of caber per week, though for my initial dose I took 0.25mg to get things going. I do recall about a week later I had sex twice in one day without any issues, so perhaps it helped after all. I was also quite hungover that day which always makes me want more sex than normal so I don’t know which was to blame.
Proviron was completely ineffective when I tried it. I’m not even sure it was real it had so little effect on me. There are other PFS stories of the same though. Something about the body not utilizing test correctly so adding more doesn’t necessarily help and makes some people actually worse. I did end up with a lot of back acne around then, that was my only sign the stuff was even real. It came from a reputable source but was not name brand. Tried ordering name brand and it got lost in the mail somewhere along the way.
Anyways. As you can see, I’ve tried a lot of stuff. Probably too much without enough time on each thing or bloodwork to see what was going on, but it’s an extremely frustrating issue as pfs doesn’t really have a clear cut answer on what fixes it so I kept reading, finding new ideas and switching things around when something wasn’t working.
I’m planning to do bloodwork in the next day or two then plan on not taking anything for a few more weeks (barring some completely obvious and correctable info from the blood test) so I can see an endo without looking like a crazy person.
After someone mentioned it I’ve been taking 10mg of Pregnenolone. My mood is really freakin great today. Started taking Friday and today I feel a weird pumped type feeling overall. I started thinking about what had changed in my diet and remembered im on pregnenolone. I’m also taking huge doses of probiotics after antibiotics (bio-k 50 billion liquid probiotics and another 50 billion in a pill) so could be that as well but I think it’s the pregnenolone.
I have a supplement with that and DHEA in it but haven’t tried it just yet.
Lots of people seem to improve when they go to low carb so might have to try that soon. I’ve been saying that for weeks though.
I wrote a really good and detailed low carb keto guide for a friend at work. I keto diet 2x a year for a few months to get cut. I’ve been doing it for 4 years and it’s the best I’ve ever felt. I’ll paste it here
Here was my email for my friend.
…I’m really hardcore about this, but below is a lot of info. Im losing 20 lbs in 10 weeks which requires strict math but you can do it a little slower.
Keto Diet basics
Here is all you need to know. The diet is actually really really easy but there are a lot of things below that will help. Your body either burns Carbs (sugar), protein, or fat for energy. If you stop eating carbs and eat enough fat ratio to protein/carbs, your body will begin burning fat for energy. This produces ketones which your body uses as fuel. These ketones make you feel amazing (even slightly high and giddy after a few weeks but not in a bad way) if you have never tried this, it takes about 3 days to enter ketosis and the first 3 days can be really really rough as your body goes through a period of transition that makes you feel a little run down. If you can make it 4 or 5+ days you will suddenly feel amazing and clear headed. I can promise that if you make it to the 7 day mark you will be a fan of Keto! You will feel amazing.
More info … you should google and read a little
The Ketogenic Diet - A Keto Guide for Beginners
An in-depth look for beginners at what to expect when going on a keto diet. From what to eat and what to expect, to your daily needs and common approaches.
A Ketogenic Diet for Beginners - The Ultimate Keto Guide - Diet Doctor
A keto diet is a very low-carb diet, where the body turns fat into ketones for use as energy. This increases fat burning, reduces hunger and more. Learn how to eat a keto diet based on real foods – what to eat, what to avoid and how to avoid side…
The Ketogenic Diet: A Detailed Beginner’s Guide to Keto
The ketogenic diet (keto) is a low-carb, high-fat diet that causes weight loss and provides numerous health benefits. This is a detailed beginner’s guide.
Also note that when you first enter into keto you will immediately lose about 3-4lbs but this is mostly water weight as the keto diet acts as a diuretic. The diet is not magic in itself. If you still gorge on food you will get fat on keto. Losing weight is simple math. You must create a calorie deficit. However keto is wonderful to do that:
1.) Limits hunger … after about a week or 2 you will not be hungry and can watch what you eat (I’m always starving on any other diet)
2.) It gives you a huge burst of energy and well being (after the first week). Amazingly you get clarity of thought after about 1 - 2 weeks
3.) It preserves your muscle. On any other diet your body will eat your muscle. Keto preserves this well. Remember that 1lb of muscle burns 50 calories a day. The fat will melt off you on keto.
Here are my simple rules
1.) Give it at least a 2 week try. Most people do not wait long enough or properly give it a try to see the benefits or they cheat or dont realize they are eating sugar. (you have to look at everything). i keep a log sometimes in the first few days.
2.) Second you must not eat more than 20 to 25 NET grams of carbs a day. the first 2 days <20g net carbs is best. You can google what Net Carbs are but it is simply subtracting the soluble and insoluble fiber from the total carb count in food (If something has sugar alcohol you can remove most of that too) Once you are below a certain net carb point, your body will enter into ketosis. (you can actually up this value later but you lose fat faster at this low level) This is only to enter in ketosis and at a 20 - 25g a day carb intake you will lose weight rapidly. Later at your target weight you can increase net carb intake to 50g, Stay at the low carb (20g) for at least the first 2 weeks or longer. You can buy testing strips you pee on at amazon or CVS to check for ketosis (keto strips at bottom)
net carbs:
3.) After and only after your second or 3rd week , you are allowed 1 cheat meal a week. Cheat days are actually good and reset you but just make sure to only do one. Once you have been in keto a while you can enter keto a little more quickly but it is still a day where you feel like crap getting back into keto. There is a link for keto salts below to help you get into keto faster. If you can get into keto i would personally stay there for a good month to get the benefits.
Keto is not exactly cheap as you are eating a lot of things like steaks and fish.
Below are all the necessary things I have in my house to help …. I highly recommend you get them to help get past the first week.
First, go to the grocery store to prepare. Your first 2-3 days you will not worry about calories and just want comfort foods to get into keto. Remember this is just to help you with the transition from your body burning carbs to it burning fat. If someone is helping you prepare foods then it may be easier. You can eat healthier but you need lots of FAT… You can do this anyway you want but the ratio of FAT needs to be higher. Search for how to enter ketosis to gain more info.
Here are some recommended things but you can do a search and look for Keto recommended snacks. In the links below there are actually some baking mixes which are very low carb that will allow you to make biscuits, pancakes, sausage balls, ect. With the exception of lettuce you should eat no more than roughly 1 cup of vegetables per meal.
A rough shopping list: (you can get whatever you want but this is mine)
· Olive oil / butter
. Cream cheese (you can put this on celery or other keto friendly foods for a snack) There are links to low carb crackers below which I like but you still have to count the carbs
· Half n Half or light cream if you like in your coffee (you cannot use whole milk or most milk now … too much sugar)
· Bacon, eggs, sausage
· A few steaks … any meat will do (fish, pork, chicken, shrimp)
· Buy some sour cream (I put it on everything )
· Cheese … get some swiss or whatever you like snack. Cream cheese
· Peperoni … great with the cheese if you want a snack
· Buy some low carb protein shakes (links below)
· Buy some low carb baking mix for biscuits or pancakes (links below) … get some sugar free jelly … sugar free syrup
· Buy some low carb dressing (ranch is usually low but there are many … use formula above)
· In the frozen section buy some atkins dinners for days when you just need a quick fast meal.
· Sliced meat like turkey or ham … no honey ham
· Buy broccoli or celery for snacks
· Cottage cheese 4% fat
· Get some salad mix … you can have a small salad just watch that some items like carrots have a higher content of carbs
· Anything sugar free … get some sugar free jello for a snack
. you can buy Halotop ice cream but i would not use it for the first few weeks as it has some sugar in it and you should try to be sugar free for at least a month
You get the idea
If you drink alcohol, absolutely no beer! No white wine or champagne … only red wine or liquor with sugar free mixers. You drink anything with sugar and it will set you back a day or 2. See keto salts below. Alcohol will show your weight loss drastically but up to you. I would take a month off just to drop the weight you want first and add alcohol back in
A day in the life of scott to lose wieght is
Coffee in the morning with MCT oil (below) before the gym (google MCT oil and benefits)
A glass of Metamucil with a spoonful of keto salts (below) for the gym for energy
After the gym I drink the lean body shake (link below) in which I add some MCT oil or olive oil. Too much protein without fat will reduce your ketosis
Sometimes i will eat some eggs and bacon
I may have a snack of cheese and peperoni or some low carb crackers and cream cheese or whatever
I may have one of the protein bars listed below as a snack or an atkins bar (they actually taste amazing and not like the shit you buy off the shelves)
I may eat a few squares of chocolate through the day (link to chocolate below)
1 big meal at night (like steak and broccoli or fish and some keto approved veggie)
a 160 cal protein shake a few hours before bed with some olive oil added (link below)
If i really want to lose weight i actually keep a record of my calories. This is the fastest way to lose 2lbs a week. (Its all math. (calories in and calories out) Here is a sample of my day including my workout which I cut and paste. Notice I have biscuits and even ice cream listed … the buscuits are made from a mix below called carbquick and the icecream is the carb smart bryers ice cream
**Today’s intake 8/26
-400 cal morning run
-150 cal on weights
100 coffee (10gp)
25 for 1 dark chocolate square (.5gp 0.6gnc)
280 protein shake (40gp 4gnc)
140 pepperoni
80 cheese
20 ham
160 protein bar wonder slim (15gp 7gnc)
100 crackers w cheese (3gp 3gnc)
50 2 choc squares (1gp 1.2gnc)
88 os trim beef jerkey (14gp 2gnc)
100 Almonds 10 pieces = (3gp 2gnc )
180 atkins bar (8gp 4gnc)
400 salmon dinner (240 tuna + 50 + 100)
1745
180 protein shake (30gp 3gnc)
*8/29
-1000 calories burned gym
100 coffee
50 chocolate
300 protein shake extra fat 40p
200 Chicken legs 20gp
25 chocolate
120 crackers and cheese
160 protein bar 15gp 7nc
25 chocolate
156 eggs 12gp
40 Bacon
40 Cheese
100 Biscuit
100 ice cream
180 atkins bar 8p
150 cottage cheese
1770
160 protein shake
Cheese and bacon
I also have this crap below
CarbQuick - BUY THIS! you can eat bread and biscuits. (there is also another form just called carbulose flour for normal baking) you can also go buy low carb baking mixes. There are also things like almond flour or coconut flour) You can make any dessert with these type of mixes and sugar free.
Amazon.com : Carbquik Baking Biscuit Mix (48oz) : Biscuit Mixes : Grocery & Gourmet Food
Low carb baking mix. 3 lb. Box makes 90 biscuits, just add water. 90% less carbs than quick. 2g net carbs per biscuit.
MCT oil – google the benefits “mct and keto” and you will see that this is converted to energy very quickly. If you feel week, put this in your shake or with coffee (ever heard of bullet proof coffee? You also should always add some fat to your protein shakes. My favorites are below
Amazon.com: mct-oil
Olive oil - you need lots of healthy fats … get whatever brand you want
Amazon.com : Pompeian Robust Extra Virgin Olive Oil, 24 Ounce : Grocery & Gourmet Food
Wonder slim protein bars … I have tried many protein bars and love these. Great for a sweet treat but low carb and high in fiber … low cal.
Amazon.com : WonderSlim Low-Carb 15g Protein Diet Bar - Fluffy Vanilla Crisp - High Fiber Weight Loss Snack Bar - Gluten Free 3 Boxes Value Pack (Save 10%) : Grocery & Gourmet Food
Premier protein
I drink one of these a few hours before bed … taste amazing … casein protein is good before bed . add a little fat
Amazon.com : Premier Protein Hormone Free Shakes 11 oz., 18-pack-Vanilla : Everything Else
My favorite protein shake … I drink these after workout or for lunch. I usually add some MCT oil to this and or olive oil
Amazon.com: LABRADA - Lean Body Ready To Drink Whey Protein Shake, Convenient On-The-Go Meal Replacement Shake for Men & Women, 40 grams of Protein – Zero Sugar, Lactose & Gluten Free, Vanilla (Pack of 12): Health & Personal Care
When you crave some sweets, you can have a square or two of this chocolate. Very low in sugar and high in fat. You just can not eat too much … there are others that are sugar free
Amazon.com : Endangered Species Panther, Dark Chocolate (88%), 3-Ounce Bars (Pack of 12) : Grocery & Gourmet Food
Magnesium citrate. You will want this after a few days on keto. Keto eats up a lot of magnesium and also makes you constipated at first (really constipated) … you want to have half a spoonful of this after a few days every night before bed as it will keep you regular. Careful not to eat too much or you will get the shits. Start slow or you will get the shits!!! Helps you sleep so don’t take in the day unless you need it
Amazon.com: BulkSupplements Magnesium Citrate Powder (500 grams): Health & Personal Care
Metamucil … Add this into the magnesium above before bed … you can also have a scoop during the day In your water to make sure you are getting enough fiber. I like it because it also fills me up and its not bad
Amazon.com: Metamucil Daily Fiber Supplement, Orange Smooth Sugar Free Psyllium Husk Fiber Powder, 114 Doses: Health & Personal Care
Keto salts. id ignore this unless you are going to the gym. These are very expensive but you do not need to take every day and almost a must to help you in the beginning and if you ever cheat. Keto salts put you immediately back into ketosis … I do not use the measured scoop and just use a spoonful. I use
Amazon.com: Nutricost 4-in-1 Exogenous Ketone Supplement (17.86oz) 13g Beta-Hydroxybutyrate (BHB) Per Serving, 500 Grams (Unflavored): Health & Personal Care
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Thanks, I’ll read that in detail
I assume you agree I should give very low carb a try and see what happens?
Yea itvsucks for the first 3-4 days but is awesome after that. Really easy to drop weigh if you do it a few months. I usually do it every January and February to drop 10
I’m already like 150lbs, 6’ tall, lol. Don’t have a whole lot to lose!
I already do the whole intermittent fasting thing, though not on purpose. I just don’t eat breakfast and don’t eat dinner late so I only end up eating lunch at noon and dinner at like 7 latest. I’ve seen a few people mention that helps but who knows.
Guess I’m going to have to give this a try and just make it through the first 3-4 days somehow. I’m going to be craving some Reece’s haha
You don’t have to use it to lose weight but it’s super easy to lose weight on it. Im assuming your young so your going to lean out and could get a 6 pack.
People get angry when I say this but losing weight is easy and only a function of math. Calories in vs calories out. The problem is some people’s resting metabolism is really low so that if they eat more than 1800 calories a day they will gain Weight. There are a few and very few who have weird metabolism disorders that make them fat easily. At my age my resting metabolism is a lot slower than it was at 18 so I gain fat more easily. T increases this. There are a lot of other things such as your muscle content and such but it’s all still math. You can only eat twinkies every day and lose weight. (There is a science teacher who proved this)
I’m an engineer, and I became really good at losing weight over the last 5 years after tackling it as a science problem. I find most people under calculate how many calories they consume in a day. Me included. After PFS I became serious about losing weight and I started writing down every calorie that entered my body. For 2 or 3 weeks I was rediculous and weighed everything I ate and calculated calories. If I ate 1 almond that was 7 calories. What I found is I’m freaking hungry if I don’t eat more than 2000 calories but not on keto. It’s really surprising how easy it is to go over 2000 calories a day. I am 10000% sure that if you eat 1800 calories a day you will lose weight although if you are not exercising it will be slow. This is what’s hard for most people to grasp. They cut back to 1800 calories yet at the end of the month they may have only dropped 1 pound. If you run 30m a day it will increase that loss to maybe 7 or 8lbs in a month. The good thing about keto is that you stop getting hungry after a week or 2. It’s easy to only eat 1500 calories. The other problem is that if you drop your calorie intake too low your body drops your metabolism lower. In other words you can’t go into starvation mode. At that point your body will do everything it can to store food as fat. Keto protects you somewhat from this but men should never go below 1500 calories a day.
I also do IF also and only eat in an 8 hour period. If your craving sugar You can buy sugar free candies. Go to CVS, you can find anything from sugar free penut butter cups to sugar free gummy bears. That stuff gives me crazy gas if I eat too much.
I’m 34, but have always looked really young (good genetics/skin I guess) and have always been thin, slight abs showing but nothing crazy. I have a feeling on this diet they’ll be showing more than ever before
I agree with you totally on people losing weight… it’s almost entirely an issue of people being impatient. Not that I can say anything with all the jumping around on different protocols I’ve done for PFS… in large part because I’m being impatient myself. But people either go to the extreme to get quick results (which usually don’t last) or get frustrated at only losing 1-2 lbs a month. I always ask, how long did it take you to gain it? Years? Exactly. It isn’t going to disappear in 2 months.
Anyways–thanks for all the advice. I’ll read through the Keto diet suggestions in more detail.
I think I may finally start my own thread since I’ve been cluttering everyone else’s up for a while now, lol
Finally got my results back.
Free + Total test: 448 [264 - 916] (within normal but this was around 1100 a few months ago)
Free test: 4.1 [8.7 - 25.1] - LOW
DHT: 50 [30 - 85]
T4: 1.51 [0.82 - 1.77]
TSH: 2.060 [0.450 - 4.500]
Prolactin: 22.9 [4.0 - 15.2] - HIGH
Estradiol, Sensitive: 11.9 [8.0 - 35.0]
T3: 3.2 [2.0 - 4.4]
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