Feeling angry at myself

Welcome to our community. Please fill in the following template as a way of introducing yourself, and helping others to understand your background and situation.

Where are you from (country)?
Sorry I prefer not to say, but I am from South Asia

How did you find this forum (Google search – if so, what search terms? Via link from a forum or website – if so, what page? Other?)
Hairloss sites

What is your current age, height, weight?
22, 1.75 m, 80 Kgs

What specific drug did you use (finasteride, dutasteride, saw palmetto, isotretinoin/Accutane, fluoxetine, sertraline, citalopram, leuprorelin, etc…)?
Used a wide variety of anti dht poisons

  1. Finasteride
  2. Dutasteride
  3. Oral Spironolactone
  4. Ketoconazole Shampoo
  5. Minoxidil
  6. Topical Finasteride

What dose did you take (eg. 1 mg/day, 1 mg every other day etc.)?

  1. Finasteride = Dosage depended on side effects, mostly I took 1 mg but when I used to feel extreme headache I used to lower dose for few days.
  2. Dutasteride = 10 Tablets
  3. Oral Spironolactone = A week probably
  4. Ketoconazole Shampoo = once or twice a week
  5. Minoxidil = 10% for 3 months, then 3% and then 2%
  6. Topical Finasteride = 1 month

What condition was being treated with the drug?
Diffuse Hairloss

For how long did you take the drug (weeks/months/years)?
Almost 4.5 months

How old were you, and WHEN (date) did you start the drug?
Started on Dec 2019 (age 22)
Stopped on May 2020 (age 22)

How old were you when you quit, and WHEN (date) did you quit?
22, Quit every product used for hairloss on May 17, 2020

How did you quit (cold turkey or taper off)?
Cold Turkey

How long into your usage did you notice the onset of side effects?
2nd day itself

What side effects did you experience that have yet to resolve since discontinuation?
Feels like all the androgen activity in my body has been shut down.

Check the boxes that apply. You can save your post first, then interactively check/uncheck the boxes by clicking on them. If your symptoms change, please update your list.

Sexual
[:heavy_check_mark:] Loss of Libido / Sex Drive
Erectile Dysfunction
Complete Impotence
[:heavy_check_mark:] Loss of Morning Erections
[:heavy_check_mark:] Loss of Spontaneous Erections
[:heavy_check_mark:] Loss of Nocturnal Erections
Watery Ejaculate
[:heavy_check_mark:] Reduced Ejaculate
Inability or Difficulty to Ejaculate / Orgasm
Reduced Sperm Count / Motility

Mental
[:heavy_check_mark:] Emotional Blunting / Emotionally Flat
[:heavy_check_mark:] Difficulty Focusing / Concentrating
Confusion
Memory Loss / Forgetfulness
Stumbling over Words / Losing Train of Thought
Slurring of Speech
[:heavy_check_mark:] Lack of Motivation / Feeling Passive / Complacency
Extreme Anxiety / Panic Attacks
[:heavy_check_mark:] Severe Depression / Melancholy
Suicidal Thoughts

Physical
Penile Tissue Changes (narrowing, shrinkage, wrinkled)
Penis curvature / rotation on axis
[:heavy_check_mark:] Testicular Pain
[:heavy_check_mark:] Testicular Shrinkage / Loss of Fullness
[:heavy_check_mark:] Genital numbness / sensitivity decrease
Weight Gain
Gynecomastia (male breasts)
Muscle Wastage
[:heavy_check_mark:] Muscle Weakness
Joint Pain
Dry / Dark Circles under eyes

Misc
Prostate pain
[:heavy_check_mark:] Persistent Fatigue / Exhaustion
Stomach Pains / Digestion Problems
Constipation / “Poo Pellets”
Vision - Acuity Decrease / Blurriness
Tinnitus (ringing or high pitched sound in ears)
Hearing loss
Increased hair loss
Frequent urination
[:heavy_check_mark:] Lowered body temperature

[:heavy_check_mark:] Other (please explain)
Muscle Twitches and Body Shakiness. Feels like I don’t have anything in my muscle

What (if any) treatments have you undertaken to recover from your side effects since discontinuation of the drug?
Vitamin D, Multivitamin

If you have pre or post-drug blood tests, what hormonal changes have you encountered since discontinuing the drug (please post your test results in the “Blood Tests” section and link to them in your post)?

Anything not listed in the above questions you’d like to share about your experience?

Tell us your story, in your own words, about your usage and side effects experienced while on/off the drug.
I am a 22 Year old science student who has never smoked or had alcohol, no bad habits, no history of any drugs. Always had extremely high libido and strength and used to love lifting weights, cardio exercises and masturbation. Could masturbate for 7-8 times a day without feeling tired. Could over train myself by working out for 4-5 hours continuously without getting tired. All others used to be jealous of my body. Had a pretty healthy lifestyle and had zero health issues before taking Finasteride.

I noticed my hairloss first time on Feb 2019 when my hair started to look extremely thin. Since then I started a variety of oils and home remedies for hairloss and nothing worked. Eventually I got very depressed and because of seeing me getting depressed day by day my mother told me to visit a dermatologist for hairloss.

On Dec 1, I went to a dermatologist and he gave me a prescription of 1 mg Finasteride, 10% Minoxidil and some multivitamins. He told me to continue this teatment for 4 months and I will see a dramatic change in hairloss. I wasn’t scared about any side effects because I was very very depressed about my Hairloss at this young age.

I started this treatment and as soon as I took 1 pill of 1 mg fin poison, my morning wood, strength, libido everything came down to zero. I took it for 5 days and then stopped when I got to know about PFS from hairloss sites and internet. I stopped Finasteride but continued Minoxidil every night, my body was fine. After 1 month my Hairloss increased and I got tempted to take Finasteride because of these fucking hairloss forums claiming that the side effects eventually go away. This time I was stupidly determined to save my hair anyhow. I abused my body by using various kinds of anti dht poisons like Dutasteride and even oral Spironolactone which is used by transgenders to lower Testosterone because I just didn’t want to go bald at a young age. I took 10 pills of Dutasteride and 25 mg of Spironolactone for a week in March and one night I fainted in my bathroom severely injuring myself. I quit Spironolactone immediately.

Somedays when I took Finasteride 1 mg, I used to get extreme headaches and lower body temperature but I always thought it is just temporary and belived in those Hairloss forums (hairlosstalk and baldtruthtalk), and yes I forgot, there is a guy on Youtube called Kevin Mann, I used to watch this evil guy’s videos and his videos had extreme influence on me regarding hairloss so I continued taking Finasteride and Minoxidil along with Ketoconazole Shampoo twice or thrice a week which is a dht inhibitor as well.

After such an extreme anti dht regimen for almost 4.5 months I quit everything cold turkey on May 17, 2020. The first 2 weeks I was totally impotant and body was like I would be dying anytime. I was sleeping more than usual, very extreme headache and brain fog with zero muscular strength. Felt like I have 0 Testosterone and dht in my body.

I was extremely suicidal for almost 3 weeks but the only thing kept me from not doing so was my mother. I used to constantly visit propeciahelp for some hope and I saw many members reporting these side effects to be permanent and chances of recovery are rare, seeing all this made me think how will I be living with all these symptoms for the rest of my long life. I even cried to my mother that plz let me commit suicide but then she said she would commit the same thing if I did so. My mother is the only person who has expectations from me and loves me in this world, it’s my responsibility to give her back for whatever she did for me and I would be cruel and selfish if I don’t atleast fight against this so I decided I will never think about suicide ever.

I decided to go to an endocrinologist to check his opinion. During waiting for appointment in hospital I felt extremely tired and wanted to lay down. Couldn’t even sit for few minutes. I told everything to my endocrinologist and he made me do some tests…At the end by looking at my blood tests he claimed that I am totally normal and have no problems. I told him about my Finasteride use and he said that it doesn’t have any side effects and it’s half life is very less so it’s side effects can’t remain after quitting for 1 month. I told him to do dht and some other hormone tests but he said its not necessary and dht is only needed for children and adolescents. I felt like crying. He told me again to do some thyroid tests and all such bullshits again after 2 weeks which already came normal so finally I lost all my hope on these doctors. Ruined a lot of money and health by trusting these doctors. I was all alone.

Right now it’s been 1.5 months since quitting and I feel like I don’t have anything in my body. My muscles twitch and shake constantly and I have headache and brain fog. Feels like I have lost something from my brain and body which was very very very important. I have become extremely weak. I am fortunate that I don’t have any sleep problems like insomnia but now I feels sleepy for most of the time. I have no problem in facial hair growth or erection and semen quality but testicles are shrunken. Libido is zero as well. Pain in muscles are just unbearable. Each day I pray for improvement but by just sitting and waiting my body is just same as it was when I quit the drug with some very minor improvements.

My madness for my hair brought me into this miserable pithole. I will fight with whatever I can do against this. I will update soon.

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The first time it’s to hard… But whit the time you feel better. Stay hard friend.

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Seriously, the story about your endocrinologist makes me mad. The ignorance of the medical world is just crazy.

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How do you experience these symptoms and not experience erection or semen volume problems. If your testicles have shrunken your erections must be also weak. I really start to believe that PFS is really different for every person. And the root cause is also different for many people. Weird. I also had low semen volume issue with perfect erections when i first crashed. Then everything else got downhill throughout the years. I have even have prostatitis (check this one) and varicose veins now at the age of 21.

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Welcome to our community @FinDestroyedMe. I’m so sorry to read of your suffering. Many members here, myself included, will understand what you’re going through. On this

You’re still very early on in experiencing these problems (I won’t say PFS quite yet as it hasn’t been three months since you quit antiandrogens). While reports of complete recovery appear to be rare, many patients report significant improvements in time, particularly in the 6-12 month period. Please try to bear this in mind when/if things get really bad.

I’d advise giving our new user guide a read

Of particular interest to you may be our resource pack for health care providers

Your account of being dismissed by your doctor is an experience familiar to many here. It is of course thoroughly unacceptable and we, as an organisation, are trying to change that kind of situation. Part of making that happen is having as many patients as possible report their symptoms to their nation’s drug regulatory agency

Please do this if you haven’t already.

Please stay strong and keep us all updated.

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Hii
Thanks to all who gave me some motivation or atleast took time to read what happened to me.

Right now I am in a very tough road of my life as I feel no matter whatever I do, my body’s androgen activity has been shut down completely. I feel like a child. No aggression or libido. Earlier when I used to lift weights my body used to be on fire rush of hormones, now I feel nothing.

Brain fog is still present. I noted that whenever I watch porn and masturbate, it increases 10×. Shrunken balls feels like I have no semen left in my balls, still whenever I ejaculate the semen is usually thick and white but I guess something like prostate fluid is missing in my semen. Erections ain’t very rock hard but still somewhat better. Muscle Twitches ain’t stopping ever. Skin is very dry. I tried creatine last week, prior to this anti dht regimen whenever I took creatine, my body would turn beastly. This time nothing happened, no reaction at all. Can someone tell me why is this happening?

Fatigue has improved somewhat, I can still lift heavy weights but with zero results. No pumps, Nothing.

I went through some member stories of people like @Tzinkman and I felt very motivated how they overcame such a high level of suicidal thoughts and fought through this.

I feel like my free Testosterone is very low and dht is non existent but I can’t do any blood tests without doctors reference here. I have zero hairloss and my hair is the thickest it’s ever been. I wanted to check my dht and some major hormones like estrogen, shbg, dht, free Testosterone, cortisol but my endocrinologist said it’s not necessary. The place I live has only 2 endocrinologists and they know nothing more than some text book diseases. That doc was even arrogant to me and got irritated when he didn’t understand what was my problem. Anyways, I am posting some blood results which he told me to perform…

CBC: Everything normal
Glucose Random: 91 mg/dl (70-140)
SGPT (ALT): 15 U/L. (0-45)
Alkaline Phosphatase: 98. (40-130)
Sodium: 139. (136-145)
Pottasium: 4.68. (3.5-5.1)
Free T4: 1.88 ng/dl. (0.9-1.7)
TSH(Ultrasensitive): 2.05. (0.54-5.3)
FSH: 5.62. (1.4-15.4)
LH: 6.71. (1.2-7.8)
Prolactin: 14.54. (3.46-19.4)
Total Testosterone: 585.3 ng/dl. (260-1000)
Creatinine: 0.99 (0.72-1.25)

I don’t know what to assume from this. Total Testosterone is normal then why do I don’t have any androgenic activity in my body? Maybe something with free T !! I don’t have any facial swelling or fat gain or anything which I could attribute to high estrogen but nothing like that…idk… This blood test cost me much money as I don’t even have any insurance.

Anyways, I will update once I reach 3 months off. I will need to be making some serious lifestyle changes and push it. Getting out of bed.

I am hoping that you have went back and commented on some of those same videos explaining what happened to you and warning other guys to be cautious. If not, the cycle continues. You may be able to help other guys out down the road by doing so. Kevin, of course, (being the insufferable prick that he appears to be) will disagree.

I went on his channel commenting about what kind of dangerous things this guy is talking about. He speaks about how a trash hormone dht is. Some of his incel followers bashed me and called me a bald psycho when I told them to quit all dht inhibitors as soon as possible. When I started arguing with him and when he seemed that I am starting to gain some support from some sensible people, all my comments just disappeared from his channel. Maybe he blocked me or something. I realised this guy is a sheer evil psychopath trying to manipulate young minds and is highly successful in it, me being one of his previous stupid followers. I was such a stupid to fall in his tricks. Not just him, there are many evil people on youtube shamelessly claiming fin and all other dht blockers are god sent. And those fucking people on hairloss forums are psychopaths as well.

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Those channels are dangerous bro. Between that and reddit posts calling PFS guys crazy hypochondriacs, I decided to take the pill myself and see. And well yeah. turns out it’s real lol

He’s a known incel/autist. He was asking about how to get girls in his thirties unironically.

Anyway, when you just listen you can see that the man is on the spectrum.

I don’t think he’s a bad man though but very ignorant about the pharma industry, thinks he’s smarter than he really is, emotionally invested because he takes fina and believes the Merck studies to be holy, ignoring all the other studies showing the dangers of AA’s.

Yesterday I had a heated argument at my house and I couldn’t handle the stress. I was unable to breathe and my body was like fainting. My head was like going to explode. Earlier in my life when I used to have such arguments with anyone I would feel a Testosterone rise but now it’s all over… I feel extremly depressed day by day that I have to go through this pain. Sometimes I feel suicidal.

brother, you used a whole slew of poison, basically a cocktail.

give your body at least 6 months to re stabilize!!!

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Tomorrow I have my exam and I am not even able to focus on anything. Feels like some oil from by brain has been drained. It’s the reduction of important neurosteroids. Muscle twitches have now started even in face, in cheeks and forehead. Really fucked up right now. Doesn’t even have anyone to share what I am going through. Such a horrible cruelty I did to myself.

Hi buddy,
please, try to stay strong through this and dont be harsh on Yourself. Noone knows this happening before it happens - so please dont blame Yourself. Please remember that most people see many improvments (even recovering) throughout time itself, especially in the first year, two - I have such experiences as well. I wouldnt recommend You to try supplements in general so early but for those twitches - quality magnesium is something that actually may help. What helped me personally was Magnesium L Threonate (it crosses also the BBB). I hope You will get and feel better soon, I wish You good luck

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If you have muscle spasms and so on, maybe try potassium.

But my pottasium is already in range

Pottasium 4.68. (3.5 - 5.1)

Thank You friend. I will try magnesium soon. I feel like I have no androgen activity in my body even though my T levels are normal. I am really afraid about my future.

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Give it proper time my friend - I bet You will be in a really much better shape like a year from now. In the meantime try not to overthink everything neither worry about the future - try to make a life now already with what cards You have at hand - and let the good come itself along the way as You live. And good luck with the magnesium :slight_smile: (please note that different forms of Mg may have different effect-success)

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Maybe try a nice 24-48 hr fast and see what that does.

I’m so sorry to see this, it looks like you have very severe PFS. I am 17 so I’m even younger than you, but I also have higher T at 895ng/dl (December) and still have no androgenic abilities like sweat, erections, libido, sebum production, hair growth, etc.

PFS is so real in fact that even my barber noticed that my hair was growing significantly slower than usual.

Androgen receptors are found quite densely in hair follicles and the scalp, and research shows that they are the catalysts for hair growth. The lack of hair growth is one example of how PFS, which is a severe dysfunction of the androgen receptors’ ability to take in and use testosterone/DHT, affects my body.

I would seriously recommend taking a very cold shower and see how that makes you feel. Also start experimenting with fasting and carb backloading, and eat a paleo diet of mostly meat, fruits, and veggies.

Slower Hair growth in head is a good sign.