Marijuana got my pfs even worse To the levei that I couldn’t get out of bed. I needed To wake up and wait 30 minutes To get enough energy to get out of bed. Also it gave me worse orgasm, worse erection, worse brain fog, it basically made my pfs get worse.
Thank God I’m improving with my protocol and I would be already cured If I didn’t use this satan herb called weed.
So… Would it be safe to try Tongkat Ali Extract? How can I know if it is packed with Saw-Palmetto or Nettle root?
Just carefully read the label. If it says proprietary blend or some BS avoid it.
What’s RSO?
Guys don’t listen to your endo if he says you can’t get better. Medical doctors don’t know anything about health. All they know is disease, and even then they only know how to suppress symptoms with more chemicals and toxins. Watch “super juice me”. It’s on vimeo.
I haven’t collated a complete list of supplements cdnuts used yet but it’s on that “boost your low testosterone” site.
Yea that really shady ass site. I got one for you… I raised my T and Free T over range. Also keeping E2 in check and it did not return me to normal. If I did something like this Pre-PFS id be uncontrollably horny and packing on muscle like crazy. Now the overall response is very weak. Maybe you will be lucky, I was hoping I would be. But once your done experimenting you will probably also conclude that this is some SciFi shit.
I wish people would come to that conclusion quicker, so that they would stop wasting their time and money on useless doctors and supplements.
I thought this thread got deleted. Happy to see it did not.
I know it’s crazy hard. So far all I have done is a 7 day juice fast. Generally speaking there is a big diff in calories between a juice fast and a water fast. But this ends up coming down to how much juice you drink. I recently found the juice feast which is the same thing as a juice fast but with just drinking more juice.
but the thing of it is, the main purpose of fasting before starting this protocol is to clean your body to get it ready for change. Supposedly you can accomplish this by the water fast or the juice fast or even a juice feast.
I think when it comes to the potential “healing” element of fasting now this is when the water fast is the best option. The logic behind why the body has ability to heal on a fast is not only because you are cleaning or detoxing your body during the fast but also because of the fact that your digestive system is at its closest point possible of being “off” your body now has more energy to use to repair.
So with a water fast your digestive system is “more off” than it is during a juice fast or feast. But the point is that cd believed fasting helped him because it made him clean which caused him to react stronger to cycling DHT pro hormones and T boosters.
Of course he did several water fasts and maybe the reasoning really why they contributed to his recovery was because of the healing element and not the cleaning detoxing element. I mean how can he know really?
But for the sake of trying this protocol and getting things moving I’m going on the theory of hoping that the logic behind why the fasting helps is because of the cleaning element.
If you can’t fast at all maybe you can get the cleaning effect from a strict raw diet consisting of raw fruit and veggies. Actually cd did one of these diets for seven month! This was not counting all the fasting he did.
Thanks for sharing the latest about where you are at. Hopefully with the weather coming back around you can get back into your high intensity training. Sounds like its so easy to fall out of this protocol (or anything close to it). It’s intresting that when you fell out of doing the high intensity work outs you also fell out of the strict diet and vit D intake. At least the vit D intake is an easy fix as it requires no work. I’m using this is a warning to show no weakness by not falling out of sequence with anything as falling out of more follows at that point.
Sounds like you are still doing pretty good. Looking forward to seeing your updates. I have my andro300 ready. I still need the herbs I’m using for my T boosting cycles and my PCT. I should have everything ready by the first or second week of May. Can not wait to run my first DHT cycle.
The only other thing I should add for now is that the Andro 300 bottle comes have empty. According to the supplier this is the norm for their product. Also I don’t like the idea that it did not come with a receipt in the box. Both of these issues give me a bad vibe about the product and the company that sells it. But even with that said I’m still going to give it a fair shot seeing that it’s a transdermal which will greatly reduce any potential harm using pro hormones may cause on the liver.
I’ll report back with my andro 300 experience .
Thanks for posting
Pomegranate, thanks for pointing out that this thread is still alive. I thought it did not make it.
Japanther is member that I’m not familiar with. It sounds like you have really done your home work with researching this forum. I though I have put in hours here researching this forum and reading everyone’s stories but it’s clear you have put in more. I need to go through his thread as well as finish reading all of cdnuts’s other threads outside of his cured thread.
For now though I need to use all of my mental capacity to stay on this protocol. It’s very difficult but it gives you a sense of accomplishment knowing that you truly are doing EVERYTHING in your power to recover . If this is the end for me I feel as if I can accept my fate along if at the end of my road I know I did EVERYTHING in my power.
It sounds like you are doing pretty good and your approach of attempting to recover with out incorporating the DHT pro hormones seems like a logical thing to do seeing that you are pretty close to recovery to the point that you can enjoy some type of a sex life. So in your case no need to “risk it all” with playing around with DHT pro hormones.
I’m incorporating this aspect of the protocol into my own protocol simply because of how bad off I am. So for me the potential benefit out weighs the potential risk.
Congrats on your decision to do a fast. What is the name of the place in IL you are going to for your supervised 14 dat juice fast?
I am interested because Chicago is closer to me than going all the way to the west coast to use the place CD did. I only plan on fasting again if after two complete cycles I have not made any progress. So that has me at the end of this year around December.
Really I should have completed a full 14 day juice fast before running my first cycle but at day 7 of my juice fast I was weighing in at 179 pounds. At 6 foot 5 The weight loss was just to noticeable . With the type of job I have appearance is everything and being 179 was causing problems. I’m hoping I can get lucky and that my short fast cleaned my system enough to respond to my upcoming cycle. If not I’ll drop down to 170 pounds if that’s what it takes.
Actually mentally I’m more than ready for a unsupervised 14 day juice fast. It’s physically I’m worried about. But no worries. No matter what we will get the job done.
“Excellent thread. I’m 1000% convinced that The key ingredient To cure is tboosting herbs. All recoveries I’ve found suggest The use of these Herbs.”
I agree that this is a huge factor here. A few of the reasons why I believe this are as follows:
They increase T with out shutting down your own natural production. They work with our bodies Instead of against it.
The increase in T is to a much lesser degree that we will get on TRT or from a SERM. This is a good thing as a smaller increase in T will obviously mean that we will not have to worry about ending up with crazy high estrogen levels. This is important because as all of us know with this syndrome we are extremely sensitive to estrogen.
One of the main points CD has always tried to get across is that with this syndrome baby steps are the best course of action. Small nudges over time getting your endocrine system back to functioning normal . This idea of small nudges over time being the best course of action is seen as a common pattern amongst everyone the small group that has recovered. Nothing extreme when it comes to altering hormones has worked for the majority of people with this syndrome.
Natural T boosting herbs go along with this concept the best. Also the more I learn about herbalism and the diff types of herbs out there the more I learn about other benefits herbs that we have available to us can have. Superman Herbs is an awesome website. This website sells herbs that not only address the low T levels many of us have but also other common issues we have like digestion and sleeping problems. For now I’m just focusing on a Herb cycle that just addresses the boosting of natty Total and free testosterone levels. But soon I plan on coming up with a herb cycle that will address all three of the issues I mentioned.
“One thing we should avoid is drugs, specially weed because thc is like propecia To our brains.”
Agreed. All drugs for people with this syndrome are a big no. We don’t respond to hormones the right way never mind drugs of any kind. One thing fasting does is detoxifies your system and gets all the stored crap out of your fat cells including traces of prescription meds taken over the years. This is evidenced by the symptoms that most people start to feel at the twenty four hour mark of any fast juice or water. I was dizzy and felt like I was going to throw up at my 24 hour mark. This feeling went away at the 48 hour mark. That’s s detox!! That’s not low blood sugar causing that, no way. I mean we all seen where prescription meds got us and that’s here.
This just further validates your claim of natural herbs being a huge factor here.
“I think that we just NEED To know The way To make this herbs working all The time we decided To cycle it”.
Yes exactly. We need to work together on this. This is key. Yea we talked about all the good things about how these herbs are an alternative to prescription meds and hormones that we don’t respond the right way to. But this means jack if the herbs are not working.
So like you said it’s about taking the right herbs at the right time. It’s about sourcing the strongest and best quality ones we can find. We should start sharing ideas on where to get What herbs from.
I’ll post my list soon. It will include website sourced from and price for each one.
What is your current protocol for your herbs and where are you getting them from?
“If you check light at The end, Beekay, elb recoveries you will see that just like cdnuts they had ups and downs with an upward scale”.
“But all of them could take these herbs and they would work all The time I had some experience with it and I felt 75% cured But I got crashed again from too much drugs even got an intervention from my family”.
These thoughts seem to go along with the main point here. Slow nudges over time to our endocrine systems and bodies is what’s needed. Eventually over time leading to an upward scale and hopefully recovery.
Going backwards sometimes seems to just kinda of go along with some of the aspects of this protocol. A fast for example puts you backwards at first for sure. With my limited experience I have in fasting I can say I deff took a few steps back. Lost muscle, strength and confidence when I lost ten solid pounds of lean muscle. But honestly now about a month after I’m still lighter with almost no stomach fat and I’m also sleeping better now. Not much better but I’ll take what ever I can get. No fat will help me with estrogen when it comes to the small amount of estrogen conversion we need to worry about with T booster herb cycling.
When did you crash recently?
What do you contribute this recent crash to?
What kind of drugs where you taking that you think made you go backwards?
You mentioned a family intervention so I’m assuming that this means you are talking about something other than taking to many hormones or even herbs ? If this is the case it’s important to stop all of that even drinking.
Perhaps a 5-7 day juice fast to detox ?
Let’s deff keep one of the top priorities for now on coming up with the best herb cycling protocol
Yea cd did the paleo diet for a majority of his recovery. This was when he was not doing a 7 month raw diet and a 47 day juice feast. lol… Crazy what this guy did just unreal.
He did not carb back load until after he was recovered. He does however recommend carb back loading during recovery for people who are trying his protocol.
Even though for a time I tried the main aspects of carb backloading I don’t know much about it. This is because I stopped it because eating just paleo all the time is the only diet that my digestive system digests properly. Also I feel as if beyond building yourself up I don’t think carb back loading Is of much use for us. Cd mentioned it being a good way to manipulate hormones but the thing is there is little evidence to support that, he did not incorporate back loading in his recovery and with the herb cycling of T boosters this should be all the increases in T we need. Unless of course you just perfer carb back loading as your stragety to increse your natty T over cycling herbs. But I think we can all aspect a bigger increase in natty T with herb cycling when compared to carb backloading.
But i don’t see how carb backloading can hurt you if you enjoy doing it for training purposes. It can only help and I would prob still do it if my digestive system could actual digest anything other than raw fruit veggie and meat. Main point being if it’s working for you keep doing it.
The other website I found him on along with a Entrophy and English is a site called soul source. But he warned they will attack you big time if you go their.
That’s awesome. I don’t think its luck that your T levels went up as you got older. It’s deff because you have been recovering from what crashed them in the first place by dieting, doing high intensity work outs and strength training. Man on a good herb cycle you could prob push that up info the low 500’s who knows even higher
May be a shady site. Like all of these sites lol.
But keep in mind the main point from that site. It’s telling us that inorder to get LONG TERM increased T from herbs that they need to be cycled. Of course it’s not a scientific proved fact that cycling natural T boosting herbs works for the long term with increasing T but many guys say it works.
Just from cycling tongkat and Trib I matained higher than usual T levels while doing so.
That was verified via labs of course which of pretty scientific if you ask me.
Yes we are aware of the fact that increasing Total and free T does nothing or little for the average PFS guy. Maybe consider trying the protocol and see what hapends?
Remember the key thing here, small nudges over time. Increasing your total and free t over the range is not a gental small nudge that’s an extreme change of hormonal levels. And we know that any extreme change is not going to have a good result with our altered endocrine systems.
The guy’s that recovered solved this problem by gental small nudges.
“Yea that really shady ass site”.
Well I guess all of these sites are shady. Everything about this situation is shady. Weird syndrome, let down by the system. It’s nothing new to any of us. But don’t forgot about keeping a glass is have full view towards things so this way the good or the truth in certain things is not being missed.
The website for example. Is the creator of that website making money off of stating opinions as facts? Sure he is. Are the products on the website being marketed towards guys with these types of problems? Sure they are.
But don’t overlook the biggest concept that the site is trying to get across. Cycling T boosting herbs to keep the body guessing so they can work at increasing a guys hormone levels for the long term.
“I got one for you… I raised my T and Free T over range. Also keeping E2 in check and it did not return me to normal”
Yes we know that when a guy with this syndrome increases his hormone levels it does little to nothing. We know that this is because our altered endocrine systems no longer to response to hormones correctly.
“If I did something like this Pre-PFS id be uncontrollably horny and packing on muscle like crazy”
I’m aware of this. I’m in the same boat as you floating down the never ending river.
“But once your done experimenting you will probably also conclude that this is some SciFi shit”
Keep in mind PH made a “experimental natural diet and exercise thread” for a reason. And that was for well I’m pretty sure we get the point.
Please try to be open minded and understand that no one is claiming that you are wrong about anything you just said.
Also understand that the logic behind why a small group of guys recovered from this type of a protocol is because of small nudges over time. This is the exact opposite of increasing your T above the normal range. Our altered systems will never respond to such an approach. That’s evidenced by the hundreds of guys who have tried that approach and failed and by the small group of guys who went with small nudges over time and recovered.
I want to come up with somthing inteligent to say to you pvdl but it’s not even worth the effort. With you it’s a lost cause. You seem like a smart kid but you see things in a straight line and there is no changing that. Intelligence is not a factor here, experience is.
There are at least three of us on this thread who have a lot more experience than you do with this syndrome. You like the idea of donating to the studies and the world knows that…
Please if that’s the only input you have just stay off this thread. Otherwise join us and try cycling some herbs or fasting for a few days.
Superman herbs.com
The tongkat from those websites are safe in the regard that they do not have any 5 alpha reductase inhibiting properties.
Yes stay away from saw palmetto and nettle root.
Pine pollen tincture extract-$27.95 from SMH’s
Tongkat Ali -$174.95 from SMH’s or world abs)
Tribulus (get from lift mode or world abs)
Mucana-$34.96 from SMH’s
Maral Root extract powder-$44.95 from SMH’s
6)D aspartic acid. (Wicked Sups)-$13.00
Icarrin60 (world ABS)-$70.00 (ordered and shipped)
Avens Sativa. (m.iherb.com/Action-Labs-Avena-Sa … blets/3384)-$17. (Ordered)
That’s my eight herbs for my Natty T cycle. One each day or for two days and move on to the next.
Remember increasing your natty T is not the logic behind why these herbs will make you better.
It’s just one thing we do to keep nudging out bodies back into the right direction.
I wont spam your thread, no worries. I appreciated the disclaimer you formulated in the original post. Good luck.
Thanks appreciate it. We all know we need some luck
If you ever read all of cdnuts’ posts, you will find him. Cdnuts was talking to him a fair bit. Japanther was the only one that really modeled cdnuts protocol very strictly while cdnuts was still on this site.
Karynraw.com… she was featured on a bunch of documentaries like “raw for life” I think, the one that also featured Tony Robbins. There are a bunch of these documentaries so I might be mixing them up but it was a pretty famous one. I was fascinated by her because she said all women in her family died of cancer in their 30s or early 40s and she’s 60 now and still healthy. Also she looks young for her age, and says she has tons of energy, sleeps 4 hours a night and runs 6 businesses. So I looked into her more.
However, I can’t go there now because I need to stay off carbs and especially sugars. So juice fast is out (because of all the fruit). I’m trying to kill oral candidiasis which I was just diagnosed with a week ago, hence the zero carb.
Supposedly fasting is easier in warmer weather. Chicago winter a juice fast is tough. Not sure why but that’s what she said.
What’s your ethnic background, what part of the world did your grand-parents come from? I’ve seen some research that caucasians are the most paleo, whereas more tropical climates people evolved to eat more carbs.