Hi guys i’m 19 years old and used fincar (.625 mg ) daily finasteride. used it for 6 months then dropped it. Anyways im just wondering if i have hypogonadism
These tests were taken ~11:30 am and i was kinda sick at the time.
Get this: About 1.5 years ago (I was 17.5) i had a testosterone level of 5.8 and FREE testosterone level of 8.2 (same units as this test) so what could have been the issue behind that? What course of action should i take if any? Please ask any questions.
.
Off for about 10 days. I had severely low levels of test/free test about 1.5 yerars ago ( I think the blood test itself might have been a mistake).
Your Total T level is pretty good if you’ve been off for 10 days, actually right about where I was at 8 months off (at 3 months off I was 12.8).
Anyway, you don’t have SHBG, Estradiol, or DHT in your results. Those would be important to know.
By the looks of it, NO you do not have hypogonadism in any shape or form. You would need your T levels to be low, outside the reference range to even be considered as hypogonadal.
As for what you need to do – I’d get retested for T, Free/Bioavailable T, Estradiol, SHBG, LH, FSH, DHT, Androsteinedione, DHEA-S, Prolactin, Progesterone and Cortisol.
If you can’t get everything done again: DHT, Estradiol, SHBG, Androsteinedione for sure… add DHEA-S, Cortisol if possible… and maybe Progesterone.
You need to see Estradiol and DHT in particular, since Fin can elevate Estrogens and obviously, reduced DHT. It can also muck with SHBG in certain anecdotal cases. If Estradiol is high, you need to bring it down, if DHT low, that’s a result of Fin and you may need to discuss further with doc about DHT treatments.
Ideally though, I’d try and get your T levels up naturally through weight training and maybe some supplements such as Tribulus or Tongkat Ali, to start… if you believe they are the issue (I don’t know your history/symptoms).
Thank you for your help mew. I will get retested in a few months time since i dont have any OBVIOUS physical manifestations of symptoms. I will try and include all of the criteria
what symptoms do you have??
Preface:
20 Years old
Good physical shape
I’ve taken Fin During the course of Spring - Fall 2007. I started feeling fine for the whole of 2008, but starting this april, i began experiencing what i can only think is Low T / High E. I haven’t Touched Fin for over a year.
[Size=4]Side effects[/size]
getting dizzy
lightheaded
NO MORNING ERRECTIONS EVER, I never Wake up with an errection.
no more motivation for the gym
TIRDENESS, not crippling, but energy levels vary at 50-70%
Much Longer Recovery times from working out
STIFF back especially upon waking up.
General aches and pains, nothing i cant handle but fuck, its annoying.
Feeling ‘heavy headed’, like it takes more time to process information when im walking around, especially if i’m in an unfamiliar area.
GYNO, which is so fucked up because im a naturally skinny guy, worked out alot and put on about 30 lbs. I have hard tissue behind my nipples, and my nipples are puffy (but NOT sensitive). Tissue isnt huge, but noticeable in certain positions. I had gyno during puberty, but i think it flared up recently.
Softer looking body
Lower Libido – also if i ejaculate more than once in a given day (like say 4 hours apart or something). I feel what i can only describe as pain in the prostate region, very uncomfortable for around 3-5 minutes.
WATERY SPERM
Sometimes trip over my own words when im talking, might just be nervousness IDK.
Blood Tests. TAKEN AT 9:00 AM
NOTE: ESTRADIOL TESTS WERENT “ULTRA-SENSENSITIVE”, MY LAB DIDNT OFFER THAT TEST.
DHT tests are Pending.
Now i realize i dont qualify as hypo gonadal, but i definitely dont feel right. And the thing is, last year my Regular Testosterone was 18.7 (same as now), BUT, free Testosterone was ~55. So apparently it went down by 20%!.
I Dont want to use Exogenous hormones, so i was thinking this:
Since i want to get rid of my GYNO, I was advised to use Aromasin (Exemestane) at 12.5 mg - 25 mg / day along with PramiPexole for prolactin Supression at .5 mg a day. Should i maybe add Clomid in the mix? I want to naturally boost my T production instead of relying on TRT or something like that. I’m under the Halfway zone in FREE - Testosterone, something i dont like.
Please feel free to ask questions about my situation, maybe i left something out.
Don’t use aromasin (Exemestane) because it is a permanent aromatase
inhibitor. You don’t want to mess with something that is permanent.
Normal man function better with estrogen level betwen 20 - 30 pg/ml.
Your result is 86 pmol/l, if you convert it to pg/ml using the formula from
propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=88
your estradiol should be around 23.45 pg/ml. i dont think this is high,
have you check estradiol before ?
If your estradiol base line is unkown, we could assume that your
estradiol has increase.
Better to try DIM or brocolli treatment first and if they do not
work you could try Arimidex wich is an aromatase enzyme inhibitor
( but not permanent) and never take full dose of arimidex which is
1 mg, it is damm to strong.
If you lower estrogen to low you will end up with no libido, no erection and no energy. Basically the side effect is similar to reducing DHT to low.
Why do you want to reduce your prolactin ? your prolactin is 4.9 ug/l
it is not high. Reducing prolactin too low also bring many negative sides.
Have you been drinking a lot of alcohol lately? that could effect you
Do you check your glucose level after eating (ussually after 2 hours)
since your glucose fasting is nearing its max limit.
No, I do not drink often, and when i do it’s never really more than 2-3 drinks. I do smoke weed on occasion, though. My suspicion is that i have ALWAYS been low on T, even when i feel fine because i still had sore knees,back, slow muscle building,avoidance personality, irritability , Minor Gyno… It’s just more exposed now.
Where should i go from here guys? any Extra bloodtests merited?
Ive basically been bouncing back and forth from various issues and various forums and haven’t gotten any progress in over a year.
I took fin Feb - sept in 2007, was 19 at the time. Noticed less scalp itch and watery semen as side effects in april – both persisted, watery semen still persists to a degree. I stopped it because i started to get depressed, but this could have been me begging my studies for the first year. I started losing hair again so i re-tried it using .05 mg EoD in feb 2008. Stopped again within a few months – no acute effects to note: erections, libido were fine. Started working out Alot and eating alot and abusing my body a little bit, had some nagging symptoms like difficulty rising in the morning (along with ‘tight’ muscles) and consistent delaying of going to bed at night, i think i had low cortisol symptoms. Basically fulll on crashed in april 2009 – This seemed like a high stress crash from overtraining, but why would a young guy get overtrained…I wasnt doing that much, 3-4 days a week full compound movements and eating alot of calories, this ‘crash’ happened presumably about a year after stopping fin, feel tired alot more, cant handle stress (start to feel uncomfortable and angry), errections are just NOW (august 2010) getting worse along with libido.
I also have TONS of eye floaters in both eyes, along with deteriorating vision and just shit vision in general. I can still get an errection easily when looking at porn, sometimes it goes slightly softer than usual, usually maintains fine though, definitely worse overall than before. Morning/spontaneous errections are nearly nonexistant, unless i Really think hard about sex. My athletic ability is going downhill, endurance turning to shit (muscles get ‘tired’ alot faster, just feel slower and weaker in general, not as good an athlete as i was like 16 months ago). My recovery is decent from just playing soccer / cardio, i havent tried weightlifting again but i think it’ll probably make me feel like shit as it requires alot of cortisol. My brain still functions reasonably well, However when i get stressed or go without food for a bit, i turn into a bit of a zombie where i just go upstairs and start binging on milk+cookies or other shitty high GI foods. I do generally try to keep an okay diet though.
The decline in april 2009 was rather sharp, all those nagging little symptoms basically exploded, had alot of air hunger, couldnt workout, couldnt recover, felt terrible and overheated in times of stress.
Im thinking its POSSIBLE fin could be the culprit, but i cant say…
Would intraceullar DHT metabolism via 3a-diol and thf/5athf provide definitive answers?
The crash and symptoms are classic fin, the delay in crash is a bit different given the length but I don’t think it rules it out. So you are probably fin fucked like many of us. You need to post ranges along with your tests and see the blood tests section for additional tests to request from your doctor.
Also search for thyroid in recent posts, you should get a full panel including FT3 and RT3 recommended here:
The delay is the only thing throwing me off here. The time elapsed is very long, and the sexual side of things was the last to be affected, about 18 months after stopping fin. I just cant really think of any probable differential diagnoses, there’s so many out there that it could really be ANYTHING
Candida
Leaky gut syndrome
poor lifestyle (shitty sleeping patterns possibly)
Lyme disease
Mercury amalgam problems
depression
food allergies
Am i going crazy? am i just being a huge pussy?
I just dont know where to start looking really.
Fin down regulated AR causing our bodies to reduce its zinc content, in a hurry. Due to us being celiac we were unable to rebsorb zinc from our diet and multi vit. We then become estrogen dominant and accumulated copper, from tap water i suspect to the point of toxicity.
If you have taken zinc and had a bad reaction it is due to the fact that you have began chelating copper, it could take up to 2 weeks of taking zinc before you get chelating effects.
This is simply your pet theory based on nothing scientific whatsoever, as discussed many times ad nauseum.
Tim, you continue to ignore scientific, documented publishings on how Finasteride operates while trying to push this nonsense as the reason for people’s problems fron the drug. Frankly, I and others are getting fed up with this. If this continues the moderators will be forced to make a decision regarding your posting abilities.
I have spoken to many men, and doctors about this condition – celiac disease has nothing to do with it. I do not have celiac disease, Awor does not, SnowKing does not, and I’d bet 99% of the others on this forum do not. Again you seem to just grasp for straws and then apply your thoughts to everyone else’s situation, like you have all the answers with no proof whatsoever.
Vitamins and minerals have nothing to do with our situation in terms of a “cure”. Please, get this through your head already. If it were that easy, this forum wouldn’t need to exist and medical professionals like Dr. Jacobs, Goldstein and Crisler wouldn’t be talking about androgen metabolism as central issues of the condition.
Increased estrogen from Finasteride is due to the drug’s inhibition of DHT. Excess Testosterone cannot metabolize to DHT and so aromatizes to Estradiol as a result. This is documented by Merck and many other scientific papers.
Anyway, I and others are getting tired of arguing with you over this. Please think about the manner in which you post the information and concepts you do, rather than just spam them as the solution to everyone’s problems without any evidence whatsoever.
ok mew from now on i will keep it to my thread
It’s sad to see you here barcafan, I remember you from the hairloss forums.
sucks to see myself here too, its a pain in the ass figuring out whats causing my problems, i cant be sure of any real cause.
barcafan, did you ever get FSH tested?
As others have suggested, 3a androstanediol glucuronide (Adiol-G) would be a useful test to see if your 5 alpha reductase Type 2 is functioning properly, and possibly give some insight as to androgen receptor status.
If this test is not available where you live, get a 24 hour urinary hormone profile and either calculate the metabolite ratios or we will help you calc them and evaluate them - kazman
Hey guys,
I have managed to get a few copies of my blood tests from doctor and although the number of tests are limited there’s a couple similarities with Barcafan.
WBC 4.0
Platelet less than 150
I have also noticed similar numbers a few times on other members’ test. Do you guys think this is much of a concern?
