You say that as if it’s some sort of crime. If you have consistently bad reactions to it, stay away, fair enough. But jesus christ, just because this has happened we shouldn’t go out and have a drink with friends?
I haven’t touched alcohol for 5 months by the way and it hasn’t benefited me a single bit.
Alcohol lowers testosterone and raises estrogen in addition to affecting allopregnalone. There are science based threads discussing this. So yeah, given this it seems like a bad idea to drink given PFS has likely elevated static estrogen levels and lowered testosterone levels.
Your insecure personal attacks are getting tiresome. Like it or not we are all in the same category and risk groups for taking finasteride and you cannot ignore the fact that alcohol lowers testosterone and raises estrogen. Lots of reported crashes on this board began with alcohol and as you took fin you’re in a high risk group for the same.
By all means though, keep doing whatever you want. Its not like your conditioned worsened and you haven’t had any crashes since youve continued to drink alcohol, have you?
And where do you get you’re information Chi? I don’t think I’ve ever suggested or engaged in this behavior you’re accusing me of. I hardly qualify for sitting on my arse and smoking pot. I don’t live in a place where it’s readily available so in the sporadic times when I have used it it has been spaced out and sparingly and to alleviate genital shrinkage. As I’ve posted I don’t get much benefit or result out of it besides this since the first few times I’ve tried it when I posted about it.
I’m past trying to live normally as normal is impossible. I’m also through with self-denial. Fin has damaged me to the point where I cannot participate in “normal” activities, I can’t have a normal sexual life, and I am not the varsity and extreme sports athlete I used to be.
But keep on trucking Chi, drinking, whatever.
As quoted from your member story:
I get more muscle wastage and increasingly fatigued when I should be growing muscles and recovering. How do you use exercise to recover when this is the result?
And the success of your raw food diet has benefitted from alcohol consumption?
All I did was share facts here. Alcohol lowers testosterone. Alcohol raises estrogen. We don’t knows the full affects of how allopregnalone and other neorusteroids in the brain were affected. As I said, the personal attacks are tiresome.
Yes. I had cut out alcohol for quite a while, barely drank it before fin anyway. However, iv been testing different lifestyle changes ever since this happened and have found that wine (and white wine only, maybe 1 glass a night on average) actually positively impacts my libido during and the day afterwards. The effects don’t appear to be diminishing either, it’s about the same each time.
I apologise for the personal attack Martin, i think it stems from the fact that in my darkest days some of the worst posts i read on here were yours. They gave me NO hope. This forum is for those with perisistent side effects trying their utmost to find a solution; things that help, things that might lead to recovery. Reading your words above, it’s clear you’ve given up this search. I really hope you can find a way to get back on track.
Sorry if my posts affected you both so. I’ve been off propecia now for a number of years and am stuck with PFS accepting it a while ago. I’ve found that anything I done that improves my sides from Propecia such as L Arganine, L Tyrosine, and Vitamin D, it stops working at some point and leaves me wishing I never would have tried it. It’s been the same with sexual activity, the more time that’s gone by the more unpleasant and difficult it’s become. It’s very easy to become overly negative due to this. I don’t live so healthy and carefully because I want to, I do so because not doing so means exacerbating my condition.
Propecia has been one big pile of uninformed consent. I thought I was “blocking a pesky molecule” in my body that caused hair loss rather than permanently killing my sex life as well as causing a bunch of other problems. I guess I just wanted to let you know of further dangers, such as alcohol, before you made it worse unknowingly. And although alcohol can increase libido (possibly through allopregnalone), it tanks testosterone, which long-term doesn’t seem like a good idea for PFS. There are some things you can only correct before the fact.
Me too at times, apart from recovery periods hangovers leave me with libido sort of close to pre fin at times. I can’t wait to get really drunk again for the first time in months. I actually feel amazing when i am drunk, not sexually, but otherwise.
I cut the beer and opt for a good glass of red wine or vodka and tonic these days, i might dabble in some white wine based on Chi’s rave reviews
I don’t know how anyone can miss ‘the spinning’ that shit is terrible. I used to love getting stupidly pissed up until it was time to put my head down on a pillow at the end of the night. From then onwards i was in a world of pain. I very rarely get THAT drunk these days but i am pretty sure i still get the full blown spinning drunk.
I think I noted it already but some of my very best post-fin days have been after going a bit too far with alchohol the night before. In other words when hungover I feel best (sexually).
And no this is not a placebo - true return to normal size, etstciles hanging low and much fuller/normal. It is on these days when I begin to hope that the atrophy is not real or permanent - it feels like my balls just fill up during these days.
I also will note that these days are always with higher body temperature - all other bodily functions feel like crap but below the waist has massive improvements
Mew has posted that allopregnalone is increased with alcohol. Allopregnalone is thought to be involved in sexual arousal and libido. Finasteride also blocked an enzyme that synthesizes allopreg production in the brain, as we know fin crosses the blood/brain barrier.
Neurosteroids may also influence male sexual behavior through GABAA receptors. Allopregnanolone has been shown in male rats to potentiate GABAA channel activity in neurons in the medial POA, a region that also produces neurosteroids and is essential for sexual interest, erection, copulation, and ejaculation (Haage and Johansson, 1999; Uchida et al, 2002; Haage et al, 2005). Pregnenolone sulfate opposes the effects of allopregnanolone. andrologyjournal.org/cgi/content/full/29/5/524
Thanks adam, this is interesting. After reading over the forum and thinking about it I think it makes more sense that the down-regulation happened in our brains (or is mostly in our brains) as the brain is much more pliable. Its interesting that a lot of people recover from brain fog eventually bust still maintain the sexual sides.
Anyhow, there was a doctor/researcher mentioned that is interested in our condition. Is she putting together any studies? What city is she in?
Furthermore, I wanted to say that even though we may be a small minority, the people are/will be interested in studying us and possibly finding a treatment/cure as treating us will open doors for many other conditions. The knowledge gleaned from our condition is invaluable.
It’s the scariest scenarion, nerve/brain damage for which there is no known recovery, or the chances at recovery are much smaller than hormonal disruption or something similar. I think it’s the reason it’s not discussed more on this board, the hopelessness of trying to treat brain damage. Given finasteride crosses the blood/brain barrier, it affects hormones necessary for neurosteroid and nerve development, and the brain is constantly changing it’s quite possible that some changes happened in the brain especially to those who take finasteride for an extended period.
Last night i had a small amount of alcohol - 1 shot and a few other things. I was mildly drunk. I had great sex later in the evening and today i am still a bit horny. Sensitivity has not returned to pre-fin levels, but i would say my libido today has been comparable to some days pre fin. I have observed this increase in libido in the days that follow drinking maybe 6-7 times now. Therefore I am now very intrigued as to what it is that alcohol is doing in the day that follows to make me feel almost normal? (I would say mentally and physically also).