Inspiring posts, English. Keep them coming.
Yea, great post. It’s total bullshit but whatever.
Blah blah blah.
Felt fucking brilliant all day today, it is very nice. I am tired now though and no doubt will start slipping back a bit as expected.
Nothing to say though apart from a few replies.
Regards weight and muscle loss, i lost about 30% strength and nearly all intensity. When i went back in the gym i looked like i had just been dug up and was so dizzy that i could barely manage a set of anything without passing out. I probably went for it too much and looking back could have gone more slowly. I think you need to lift when you can, then rest. I sometimes went to the gym while feeling dizzy, weak, blurred vision and afterwards i felt so bad it was depressing, sometimes for 2 days after.
You all know that in the darkest months, it is a case of 28 bad days and 2 or 3 semi optimistic ones that are still awful in comparison to the past.
The trick is to build a base, find some positive result and create 4 semi optimistic days in the month, then 5. What i noticed was that even though i initially put on no muscle despite lifting as hard as possible, i started gaining in strength. This was despite my t being real low at about 300. This was the hook that i used to keep going, i thought OK i am getting strong again, better than nothing, i’m not wimpy anymore, then each week i got a bit better, and added stuff to my recovery plan.
Remember, i was not doing even a third per week of what i am doing now, i literally added stuff as i got better and momentum builds until the wonderful moment comes when you realise that yeah, you’re not better yet, but you know you will be.
Don’t dive straight into stuff to just build androgen levels, you must ensure you are healthy enough elsewhere first, so if you are still so mentally bad that your gut is frozen out of fear then all the exercise in the world will not help you, you must relax first, if you have high cortisol due to the stress and no sleep, then you must take steps to control that first.
Peel the onion. Once you are ready to get properly started, then yes that is when you start building androgen levels through the exercise, diet etc that i have outlined.
People will probably now post that it is not all about androgen levels and that some have t of 700 or even more and still feel shit. That is true, but without androgen levels being in the normal range you cannot feel well, and those with high androgen levels and still feeling shit are highly likely to have high shbg which inactivate it. This is often due to the low insulin resistance (normally a good thing) that they have built from such an unaturally healthy diet for so long, and low insulin levels are almost always linked with high shgb - as in my case. I simply took measures to lower shgb and the result was this complete recovery, transient as it will be.
Just going off on a bit of a tangent - the answer to the high shgb issue long term is to introduce healthy sugars (from honey etc.) into the diet gradually so that insulin levels increase and shgb naturally lowers, but you can only do this gradually, because the gut needs androgens to function correctly, but with too much simple sugar immediately, you will never build androgens! It sounds complex, but it is not, it is a simple case of doing things in the right order, gradually, carefully. So build androgens through diet and exercise, with low glycemic foods and gluten free which allow your gut to function better, this will build shgb unless you’re very lucky, so then use nettle extract and tongkat ali to temporarily reduce shgb, this improves gut function and immunity (immediately in my case by the way) and this then allows you to start introducing healthy simple sugars and building normal insulin levels again. the nettle root and tongkat ali will lose effect after a few weeks, so you go off them for a week and cycle them again, shbg lowers a bit again and you introduce more goodies to your diet and so on, eventually you reach a normal healthy diet, normal insulin levels and normal androgen levels and thus a full recovery.
In response to the guys saying great posts etc. Nice one, thank you and i hope it helps.
In response to the world class idiot that put “yeah but still bullshit whatever” - funny, because i am sitting here typing after feeling fucking brilliant all day, after coming back from hell only 6 months ago. I’m not healed yet but if i lived the rest of my life like i have been feeling in the last 30 days i would die a happy man. If people like me listened to people like you, there would be nobody but negative people at all on these boards and no hope at all for people in pain. Even after asking for people to respect my thread and go elsewhere to post negative stuff, you still post negative. What the fuck is wrong with people like you?
Idiot, you have some choices: 1- carry on being a world class moron on my thread 2- leave me and the other positive people alone to try to recover 3- go somewhere else and post negative to people who like telling each other recovery is not in their hands (wonder if any of them will recover?) 4- Swallow your pride, and try a recovery plan, the only positive possibility open to you that can lead to recovery without waiting for scientists that may never come
1 Like
Things i’ve realised since reading this thread.
1 - cdnuts was right, some people are never going to get better.
2 - I’m going to be one of the people who forces himself to improve.
3 - We Brits swear a fuckload.
Keep the posts coming English! Great to hear from you more often.
Edit - I hate people that do this but… Did you get spider veins on the old man, English? I’m not entirely bothered if they don’t go away but it’d be really nice if they did. Or faded. Zombie cock ain’t exactly sightly.
Just want to add a few lines to my last post.
I made some comments in response to the inevitable negative post - i am correct that that guy is currently an idiot, however i accept he is in a low place and maybe is a good guy just acting an idiot right now. I want to explain to him and others acting like him why it is so important for them to desist from negativity on positive threads:
When i was at my worst, i had read horror stories while researching on this web site, over and over again, and it made me sicker with worry etc. and finally i came across the wonderfully inspiring cdnuts. He, in truth, provided the strength i needed to make a start and turn a corner. There is no way i would now advocate following his protocol to the letter by the way. Let’s face it, it took him 5 years to recover, and his methods were too risky (14 day fasting, pro hormone use etc) and in my view totally unnecessary, however that guy has mental strength to burn and ultimately he recovered and showed it could be done, same as mitch and chi.
If you read through the thread of cdnuts, you will see he got exasperated with negative fools who kept just trying to bring him and others trying the healthly route to recover, and he nearly left a number of times - eventually he did to recover and came back 100% fit, however even then idiots kept driving him away.
If cdnuts had not persevered through the negativity and never came back to report, then i may not have found that first step of inspiration which has all but eventually saved my life. Someone might similarly find strength from my story and so on. Negative comments actively drive the positive people away and that is why there are hardly any here, leading to the false belief that recovery is impossible because this illness is so magically bad!
Allow me to quote (loosely as from memory) some bullshit negative comments that almost drove me into the ground and before i learnt better (through research elsewhere), made me think recovery was impossible and i will also counter them with why i later found them to be utter bullshit:
1- “Fin permanently blocks AR5 11 enzyme function even after cessation” (no it fucking doesn’t! How do i know? Because i found 5 or more examples both on this site and elsewhere of guys with mid and even over high range DHT levels post fin. Given that AR5 11 kicks out 60% of a mans DHT, his assertion was clearly bullshit - thanks idiot for your baseless negativity, how many men did you depress? Did you even kill somebody who was pushed over the edge to suicide by this comment? The answer is i have no idea, but it is possible. What is not possible is to push someone to depression from posting about positive recovery protocols, but out of the 2 options, you chose to be harmfully and baselessly negative.
2- “Raising testosterone and androgens don’t make pfs sufferers feel better because of a faulty gene unique to the pfs condition which basically means we’re all permanently fucked, even hrt won’t help” I can tell you now, reading this bullshit really did scare the shit out of me. But the good news is that this is bullshit, the fact is that many conditions make people still feel shit with high or normal adrogens - depression, low immunity and gut function, high shgb (very common to loads of people and particularly to those that are stressed or eating the wrong things, or even the right things) make people unresponsive. Many anti aging clinics offer counselling to otherwise healthy guys before giving hrt because if you are not mentally ready, the normal response is often a homeostasis response to exogenous androgens. It is far from unique to pfs sufferers, and if this was the case, then how do the tens of recoveries feel great, why am i suddenly feeling great after raising my T levels and lowering shgb? Oh yeah, because that assertion is fucking nonsense. Will HRT work with pfs sufferers? no it won’t most of the time unless they sort their mental state, exercise, diet etc. and then it will. HRT is a genuine option for the poor fuckers that fin has rendered primary hypo, but they too have work to do first. I have read a number of examples of successful HRT to pfs guys, most fail with it here though - i wonder why?!!
3- “Clomid (serms) cannot work long term for pfs sufferers - don’t even bother”- This is bullshit, some lucky guys do great on it. I found 6 or 7 examples of guys feeling like teenagers again on the stuff, one of whom had been on it for 10 years 12.5 mg every other day and he felt ace - got his life back.
I’ll ask one more time, please don’t anyone post negative on my thread, and if you want to have a stab at integrity, even while you’re feeling bad, then don’t post pointlessly negative anywhere.
I’ll be back in a week or so. I’ll be back then to view any replies and update you guys with my progress. Take care all of you, even the negative guys.
Oh and to terrified (just read his reply) - fucking right we fucking do, seems to work though right, up the brits! and yeah, some people will never recover, and it’s a damn shame, but one thing i am realising is that you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it drink. Good night dude.
Terrified, forgot to reply to the spider veins thing. No i didn’t. I’m slightly disappointed by that! Why haven’t i got a zombie cock?!!
One last thing mate, i don’t want to sound like some recovery guru, but i think you should change your screen name. For me, changing my mindset and improving it week by week was what allowed me to make progress. I now understand the value of positive re-enforcement and the damage that negative re-enforcement does, particularly subconsciously. That’s why it drives me crazy when people post negative. Change it to something neutral or positive to reflect your actual attitude.
Good night mate.
Haha. Lucky the misses likes veins huh? I’ve considered changing the name but as time has gone by I realised that it’s just a word that doesn’t really apply to me anymore. It’s a nice reminder actually. Plus when I made the account my brain was fucking fried, I couldn’t think of anything more eloquent.
Thanks for this English. Hope my thread will bring this sorta motivation to someone one day like this did for me.
Cheers.
Fuck me, i got into work and had a whole load of pm’s and e mails from guys on this site requesting phone calls, advice etc.
Look, i desperately want to help and you can all see that from my thread, but i see now that for every reply on the public forum, there are 5 more wanting direct advice. This is the same situation cdnuts found himself in.
The thing is that there is no need whatsoever for people to need personalised advice. This is definitely a service i will be happy to provide to the worse effected when my recovery is complete and fully cemented, but that service will be a nicety. The fact is that it is not needed, at all.
This has absolutely made me realise i have to finish my own recovery away from here so that i can help others in the future, because stress and emotional draining, which definitely occurs when you get desperate people e mailing you all day, takes you back. I’m a sensitive guy so it hurts me and i can’t risk going backwards.
I will summarise all you need to recover, just do this in this order, and you will recover, but if you keep cheating, get a bit better and stop, then you won’t, it is simple as that. How do i know? because the moment i stop my routine, maybe due to a family engagement, business trip, or whatever, progress stops or i go slightly backwards, do it 100%, stick to it unflinchingly, consistently for months and months, and after you have recovered you must still do it for one more year, then live however you wish, here it is:
1- Read every word of the threads of cdnuts and mitch’s recovery post, chi’s post and my posts in this thread, DO NOT READ ANY OTHER POST AT ALL AND SKIP OVER THE NEGATIVE REPLIES YOU FIND WITHIN THOSE THREADS. As you read, take notes.
2- Write your own recovery plan using the common themes in our plans. I am not going to tell you to favour my recovery protocol, because everyone’s should be different, but i will tell you to make sure you do these 4 things within your plan: A- either swim in the sea first thing in the morning and last thing at night, or take a freezing cold shower to replace the swimming if you do not have access to the sea or river or whatever. B- eat gluten free, ideally a paleo ish diet and definitely a fried breakfast with quality gluten free sausages, bacon, and all the trimmings 5 out of 7 days C - exercise, with a bias towards weight lifting, but do some cardio too. D - Sleep, if your sleep is great carry on what you’re doing, if not then get up at 6am to 6.30 every morning and only go to bed when you’re tired. Read “the effortless sleep guide” by Sasha Stevenson.
These are the 4 cornerstones of my recovery, in my opinion, if you miss them out, you will not recover as fast, if at all. But your recovery plan might mean no weights or cardio exercise at first at all, other than walking and stretching maybe, as you might not be ready. You have to apply common sense. Don’t fast for 14 days when not ready. The most fasting i did was for 3 days and only when strong enough. Your plan has to be sensible.
3- As you start your recovery plan, don’t stop researching, but do it away from scary sites, just research and learn gradually about how certain types of weight lifting favours raised T, how insulin affects shgb, how gluten kills your gut function, how immunity is 75% gut related, how immunity affects androgens, what type of food affects adrogens, what type of food metabolises androgens faster or slower. I won’t sugar coat it, there is an endless amount of research you must do, but do it gradually and each time you learn you will slightly better your recovery plan. Your recovery plan should be a live document that you add to as you get stronger and as you learn better techniques. I can’t and never will tell you about all of these areas because each topic is huge and you need to properly digest each one so that you don’t forget and understand why you are doing stuff. Also, those topics are not the only topics to learn, they are just some that came to mind. You will find the topics, trust me, you will fall over them while researching others.
4- THE BIGGEST FACTOR BY FAR - Mental - Relax, know that you will start recovering, know that recovery will be slow at first and know that homeostasis will repeatedly put you back each time you go forward, but month on month, the backward step gets further forward than the month before. Sometimes it is undetectable. You must relax though, enjoy the moment and enjoy your life. Inspire yourself by looking at others way worse off than you. Type in “no arms no legs no worries” into u tube and see what you find. Read the poem “if” listen to inspiring motivational rap music and hip hop and believe that you are a big black motherfucker that can’t be messed with. You are the man, a relaxed strong guy who is recovering. DO NOT ENTERTAIN NEGATIVE THOUGHTS. All of this is difficult and takes months of building and building, but believe me, as your androgen levels rise, it gets easier and easier.
5- Don’t get taken in by pill companies, or you will end up getting stressed over 50 different pills to take each day. If you take any T supplements, then cycle them and it makes them more effective and you have literally one seventh to take and one seventh of the cost. Some supplements and particularly fish oils and a multivitamin are sensible and can give you a leg up, but long term, you will need none at all, and at no point do you need about 20 a day, you just don’t.
Get started, that’s me done guys for sure, i will be back when my recovery is complete and cemented for a period of at least 3 months. Although i feel fully recovered now, i know i will go backwards again, so i estimate it will be at least a year before i am back.
Although you are desperate and weak, your salvation is within yourself, and the inspiration and knowledge you will gain from those threads i mention, as well as research elsewhere.
It will take discipline, but it is not a fight, just relax and do, treat it as a fight and you will fail: relax, be in command and do. Laugh, fuck, exercise, eat, sleep repeat. If you can’t fuck, then try and laugh about it until you can. I never said it would be easy.
Do it, and recover, you will come out of this bigger and better for the rest of your life, you will live a long and contented life, with more self confidence than you ever would have had before, you will see and smell and breathe better, everything will taste better, you will have learnt a compassion for others you never had. You will be by far a better man and you will actually be glad you took that pill, because it gave you this opportunity to appreciate your life, i promise you, and if you can see that pill positively right now because it gave you this mountain to climb, this excellent and tough challenge to overcome, then you are already 50% there. I can’t do it for you though, you have to look to yourself, not scientists, not negative people on discussion forums. What the fuck you waiting for dickhead?..
1 Like
English, do you have any physical changes due to finasteride like penile shrinkage, facial fat loss, loss of facial masculine structure and bone, muscle loss etc… ?
I am several months out now and I have seen some improvements. Mainly sleep and fatigue. I do not attribute the improvements to anything I have supplemented with or diet/exercise. The changes to my anatomy seem to be progressive. In fact when I increase my activity things actually get worse. I get more ghost walking, pain in my dick/balls, bone pain, depression ect.
We all share some of the same symptoms but not all. Here is why I think your optimism is nice, but foolish.
-
There is noting that bodybuilders take that causes genital numbness. The ED this drug causes is not a blood flow issue. In fact they call it ED because they (non-PFS people) don’t know what it is and ED is the only box they can check that makes sense to them. If you tell a doctor you can get it up but you feel no pleasure they think you need to see a shrink.
-
Dry eyes, floaters, blurry vision that cannot be corrected, after images that do not clear as quickly as they should. This would IMO indicate some sort of brain damage. I have been to several eye specialists and they can try to help with dry eyes. None of them can really help with the after image artifacts.
-
Slower thinking, difficulty concentrating, learning, and making decisions. Dr Alan Jacobs has commented on this. Seems that some of us may have gotten a dose of alzheimer’s disease from this. For me this hasn’t cleared up and its fucking aggravating as hell.
Mc… I find exercise does help my mood when I m not ruined with fatigue. It does also clear my head of many of the symptoms you mention in 3) albeit temporarily. A work out certainly helps with symptom management while time passes and hopefully you heal little by little.
I think, as you do, that time passing and luck are the main elements in most recoveries but it is possible to improve your mood and clear your head with exercise. No doubt.
Here is a formerly destroyed member who is now doing well. He claims no protocols, just time.
Hi English,
You mention a few posts back about lowering SHBG and I think I’m in the place where this is now my main issue (besides lack of sleep). I’ve seen that nettle root and tongkat ali can help here but it is a short term fix so I was wondering if you could give more information about how to build the right insulin levels to keep this in check once we are on the healthy diets?
Just popped back literally to change settings on my account as i am getting e mail reminders of my condition each time i get a PM!
While i’m here i will give an update as i am positive i am recovering.
I will not go into what i have been doing, read my thread to find out.
As predicted i did drop back from a feeling of full recovery, but also as predicted, back to a level slightly above my previous recovery level which i estimated at 70%.
These are the improvements on top of the previous 70% estimate:
1- I am now getting some acne on my back and skin in general, for the first time in many months, and my skin is less dry due obviously to some natural oils returning. Fucking brilliant, having skin like a reptile very much bothered me.
2- I am now pretty much back to my normal pre-pfs weight of 13.5 stone or 85kg/187 pounds for the septic tanks (yanks) among you. That is pretty much all muscle although i did purposely leave some fat on me because i did have enough estrogen. I fucking do now though as i keep wanting to cry watching greys anatomy! I have literally been putting on about 2 pounds a week in muscle.
3- My recovery rate has increased vastly and after a weights session (i do 2 x 1 hour session per week now, including rowing machine 300metre sprints x 2) I am no longer wasted the days after, in fact i am fine the next day. I am now strong as fuck and there are not enough weights for me to lift on most of the static weights machines.
I still have some brain fog and anxiety, particularly in the mornings, although it is diminishing. My dick is still quite numb, however the tip has become more sensitive for sure. Libido is back and forth, but in general is a much improving picture.
So i can now have sex whenever i want, i look and feel strong again (this really eat at my confidence when i was down to 75kg) so although the final 20/30% would be great as it would allow me to put all this behind me, the fact is that life is pretty good again.
This is just my opinion, but weights are so important, and pushing yourself to just the right extent, week in week out and never stopping is so important, it really does feel like you are squeezing pfs out of you as your strength and recovery rate etc. gradually improve. I was seriously a dizzy zombie when i started about 7/8 months ago and it takes what feels like superhuman effort to keep doing it, keep getting up early, keeping to the plan etc. Consistent effort and never falling off the horse is key.
I heard from nopecia recently and i see his T is over 20 (about 650) and shgb is just 19. These are excellent stats and it just shows that it is not just about androgens, however you must show your body androgens to repair, that is clear- or logical at least.
So i continue, and now i’m back up to normal weight i will do another 3/4 day fast in Feb/March and i will keep doing that every 6 months.
I’ve got rid of most of my symptoms now, and mitigated others, and i look forward to getting rid of the others too, but i do understand that it could be years yet.
The next challenge for me, is to allow my mental state to return to pre-fin, and i really believe this is the key to a final recovery. I need to relax and enjoy my life, and start thinking about my day and the tasks ahead. I need to lift weights because that is what i always did anyway - not because i am trying to mitigate pfs.
I can barely believe how far i travelled in the abyss - mentally. Every time i make huge strides in this sense l take stock and then realise once again that i am still miles away from mentally thinking like a normal guy. It take me a couple of weeks to realise the next mental goal. I think that is pretty much my last mental goal though, just to start thinking normally again, and leave pfs behind, and this starts with accepting that i am happy the way i am. I know what i must do, but doing it is i believe the most necessary and challenging aspect of recovery. Anyone can lift weights etc. not everyone can control their mind. I have done to an extent, but the next step is simply to relax, not something i have ever been good at.
So i’m going again from this forum but will return to update if i recover fully and have at least 3 months of it.
Oh before i go, someone asked about shgb and insulin. Weirdly, higher insulin has a correlation with low shgb, which is fucked up right? This is a proven fact though, and a fact that led to me eating honey in the evenings, every evening, in order to raise my insulin levels and drop shgb. I do this in the evening because that way you shouldn’t affect cortisol too much given that it is tailing to almost nothing by then anyway, and also honey sugars have less negative impact than processed on digestion etc. Other ways of lowering shgb are lowering stress, less fibre and drinking moderate amounts of alcohol regularly. Again, i now drink a double whiskey every evening for this reason and i reckon that helps with stress too. Note that i did not do these things until i started recovering and had knocked down other issues first (peel the onion)
I do appreciate that not everyone reacts to such things in the ways intended, it is what i do based on science and then i cross my fingers and listen to what my body says to me. For example now i’m crying to greys anatomy i’m taking a week of res100 which is a test boosting anti estrogen, and seeing what happens.
Had to reply to MCIBOTH before logging out:
Regards numb dick - Yeah true, nothing bodybuilders take gives them that, but very low androgens does give you a numb dick and i’ve seen many examples of this on low test forums, it takes time to get it but it does happen. PFS is weird though, granted, because some guys have high T on here and still get it - It is cleary a receptor issue, something that needs time to heal.
Regards vision, floaters, blurred vision etc. - You say it is permanent - well not for me it wasn’t. Pre pfs i wore glasses for reading etc. during the first 6 months of pfs my vision went so blurred i couldn’t see words at all without glasses and it was very disconcerting. I also had floaters. This has now completely cured, in fact, and weirdly, my vision is better than before - seriously. I sometimes forget my glasses when i go to work and don’t realise until i go home and i find they’re not on my head!
Regards mental faculties - I have improved greatly too. I am not quite as i was, but i am on the way. At one point i could literally not remember what i was doing if i switched windows (screens) on my laptop and my short term memory really was like an altzeimers patient. Now i’m virtually back to normal. I have seen it written many times that one of the biggest benefits to ageing males who take HRT is the immediate positive change in their mental faculties. There is not permanent damage in this area and you are over worrying about the issue - something that is very understandable.
What i am doing cannot be foolish, it is has brought me back to life my friend. I read time and again on the recovery threads of chi, cdnuts, mitch etc. that whenever they stopped exercise / diet / got pissed etc. they slipped back into pfs land, which tends to lend credence to a recovery program.
The problem with this type of recovery program, and arguably the only type that can drag you back to life -other than being a seriously lucky fucker and recovering in time - is that it is almost unbelievably hard, both mentally in research effort, and then physically and mentally to keep doing it, never stopping despite feeling depressed, tired, destroyed.
I once did a study of how many current users there on on these boards, ie the ones that post and have posted in the last 12 months, and then counted full recoveries plus 70% + recoveries, and i found that actually about one in 7 recover either completely or almost completely. Of these, over 80% had a recovery program similar to mine, in that they followed a life based on healthy diet, exercise, rest etc.
From my experience of life, i have found that certainly no more than one in 7 humans are capable of such a long term lifestyle of discipline and positive thinking.
This leads me to believe that pretty much everyone can recover from pfs by following a strict recovery programme based on those of chi, mitch, cdnuts (best examples from about 50 recoveries or 70% recoveries i have read about) If they can muster the discipline necessary to be the one in seven.
Of course that is not possible because only one in seven (an approximate) can ever be one in seven.
The remaining 6 of 7 stick around on forums calling people who are recovering foolish and find reasons to argue that symptoms are permanent or can only be cured with time if you are lucky.
I find people like that very tiresome, but mostly illogical.
Arguing that stuff is incurable and generally being negative can only harm you and others. Carrying out a plan based on those that have recovered can only help you, it cannot harm you. And you people choose the former!!
As cdnuts said - and yes he is my idol - “some people will never recover”
Be the one in seven people, prove me wrong that only one can be it.
Im against people who blame other sufferers to not try hard to get rid of this shit.
On this forum, especially in recoveries section, poor guys are pretending like some sort of prophet to recovered guys .thus, these recovered guys turn into arrogant people.
3000 members here, surely a lof guys followed strict diets, hard protocols etc only a minority recovered. Does it make you a savior or superman or something? No.
The fact is, believing that healthy diet can %100 cure you, is totally nonsense. Its like blaming a cancer guy to not try hard to recover himself.
Personally i tried for 4 months a very strict diet and exercise and did nothing to me. Not a single relief. Zero.
God, we are in 21th century and still people think they can fix an organic disease which is caused by finasteride with eating healty.
Hey depressed guy, i’m still here today so allow me to pick at your argument:
1- You say you tried for a whole 4 months with no improvement? First, you only quit in December '13, and from all the reading i’ve done, and no doubt you will have noticed too, the first year is the hardest, and many people can’t do anything at all in that first year. I say to you that A- In the first year if you didn’t go down hill then you saw results B- 4 months is simply not long enough and C- i would bet my life, just from your e mail, that your attempt was somewhat half-hearted.
2- With regards to prophets etc. I hold CDNUTS up as my idol because the guy is intelligent, measured and risked trying all sorts of things. He based his observations on self observation and science, and then he recovered! By the way, i never spoke with him or communicated with him once. I know where he hangs out too with the same screen name, but it is his methods i’m interested in - cold hard science and observation.
I am not a prophet to him or anyone else, in fact i criticize some of CDNUTS plan. I am a prophet to recovery, and it is bloody obvious to me that the way to try to recover is to base your plan on people that have recovered!!!
I see no arrogance in CDNUTS or Chi or Mitch, they are no nonsense and intelligent, nothing more nothing less and they pay no attention to needless negativity. That’s not arrogant, they have recovered for fucks sake - who’s right and who’s wrong, who the fuck knows but my money is on the recovered guy!!!
3- You think it is crazy that in the 21st century some believe this can be cured with diet and exercise? Now let me ponder for a moment why i think that - Oh yeah, it is because tens of people have recovered or at least got their lives back using diet and exercise, and i’m one of them!
It isn’t even an odd concept, we are simply talking about a strict healthy lifestyle at a time when your are feeling awful. To think that diet and exercise amongst other things, cannot improve your condition is madness. Humans improve with good diet and exercise, and we are all still humans, albeit functioning a little differently.
4-Re: It’s like blaming cancer victims for not trying hard enough to recover: I’m not blaming anyone for anything, i never invited people to come and be negative all over my positive thread. You people find your way all the same and cannot help yourselves. I merely started a thread to demonstrate to others that i was improving very quickly, and i am merely telling people what i am doing. People can make their mind up if they want to do it or not.
I personally find the evidence overwhelming in favour of diet and exercise, and what kind of dick would i be if i quietly got on with my own recovery plan, got great results and then didn’t tell people about it. By the way, i spent 10 months researching and had already made great leaps from my plan before i even posted. I wanted to be sure before i spouted off.
The whole one in seven thing is my opinion, based on an unscientific study i did a while back, just as everything i say is my opinion. I shy away from saying this is or that is fact, or this is definite when actually most of it is always going to be opinion. I find it interesting though that the negative types often say things are based on fact, that such and such can’t be cured, fact, that people like me are definitely wrong etc. It’s like you people are desperate for pfs to be incurable, like it’s your comfort blanket, and that’s not such a stupid thing to say as there is comfort in misery and it arguably takes more effort to break away from it than it does to stay in it. I’m thinking Stockholm syndrome with pfs being the captors.
The strangest thing about people who argue like you is that i often see how pfs is incurable and that the ar5 enzymes are broken and cannot ever produce DHT again and probably a million other things permanently broken. Am i completely insane or do i not see with my own eyes many examples of full or near full recoveries?!!!
And will you people stop mis-quoting me, i am not saying that diet and exercise will cure you, far from it. But it may do.
If
You research alot, read all of the main recovery stories and apply them intelligently to your own individual situation.
It is my opinion that you will certainly improve and be far better than you would have been. Not fact, just my opinion, or you can of course just take other peoples word for it that the whole thing is incurable and people like CDNUTS don’t exist, they are just arrogant fuckers living their lives happily with their happy families and their jobs and their healthy bodies. Who the fuck wants to be like them eh? Far better in PFS land.
If i’m their prophet, then i’m proud to be a prophet of hope and not of doom - you fucking twat.
Anyway, that’s me done, not coming back unless i get to full recovery, or plummet, either way i’ll tell you, otherwise assume i am somewhere between 70% and 100% - not so bad.
Good luck guys and all the best during what is the worst time of year for a lot of guys here. Try to allow yourself a smile at xmas.
This is not the solution for everyone. You don’t get visual problems that are not correctable from a drug that you can CURE with diet and exercise. You are arrogant to make such big assumptions. You should be thankful that your personal experience with fin was not much worse.
This is all well and good for you, English, but what about those of us who lived a perfectly healthy lifestyle before, during, and after fin? And we still got completely screwed over by pfs? There’s not exactly much I can do to improve my already healthy lifestyle, yet my symptoms are just getting worse. Anyways, did you recover any of your facial changes? That’s all I really care about at this point since I can deal with the other stuff for now.
And also, you say you take nettle sometimes and that helps you but from what I’ve read it seems nettle is also a 5ar inhibitor? I ask this because I was considering taking nettle, too, but if it really does inhibit 5ar then obviously I wouldn’t want to take it.