Theory and last thoughts

General Discussion
#1

Take Finasteride, inhibits DHT the most powerful androgen and male hormone in the body, receptors upregulate, gene expression dimed, body adapts to a lower androgen environment changing numerous genes, 2-3 weeks later DHT and other hormones flood into hypersensitive receptors shocking insulator genes that act as repressors and regulators silencing CPG sites near gene promoters methylating and permanently shutting down the signal, or severely impairing transcription similar to a road block and a car trying to get passed to get to its destination, this may have happened to a multitude of genes including but not limited to neurosteroids. These new methyl marks can remain permanent indifferently leading to disease and can be transgenerational passing onto offspring for up to 3 generations.

Tissues now become starved from DHT and other hormones leading to atrophy of heart tissue, liver and kidney damage, shrinkage of brain tissue and learning centres in brain with brain damage occurring in hippocampus and pre-frontal cortex, accelerated neuronal death and a permanent decline in cognition making PFS patients more susceptible to the likes of neuro disorders and all the hallmarks of a severe traumatic brain injury, multiple gene dysregulation, muscle loss, sexual dysfunction, brittle bones, teeth decay, gum recession, dry skin, metabolic and mitochondrial damage, diabetes, accelerated ageing, telemere shortening and reduced life expectancy.

This cannot be fixed by any supplement or medication currently on the market and as such none should be promoted on this website, after all it has claimed the life’s of at least 3 individuals on here and it is totally irresponsible to allow this platform to be used for these purposes. I won’t talk about my health issues right now but it isn’t looking good, really not good at all. There may be something in the pipeline years from now working off Cas9 technology, however don’t get your hopes up as this won’t be available for decades until commercialisation of epigenetic profiling and disease modifying treatment takes place although when you look at the reality of cures what exactly have they ever cured? Do not expect the pharmaceutical industry to come save the day, they have put us all here in the first place.

This disease has existed for 20 years, 20 years of men suffering, with no help, gaslighting from doctors because they don’t bite the hand that feeds them and a corrupt pharmaceutical industry that paid out a measly 4.3 million to injured men with PFS that had their lives torn apart, all the while governments around the world turn a blind eye to our plight and trust me when I say there is millions suffering from ADR’s who’s cries go unheard.

What can I say other than you’re just going to have to try and live with it and find mechanisms that help you cope other than that good luck.

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#2

Except some people have recovered from this condition.

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#3

I remain very skeptical as PH’s history does not indicate anything of the sort, our bodies may just adjust and get used to the new state or those methyl marks have decreased allowing for transcription to take place which could take a very long time as in decades.

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#4

I doubt this. For transgenerational epigenetic inheritance to occur, methylation of genes within the germline must take place (i.e. in our sperm). However, it has been shown that our condition is tissue specific and thus not inheritable (unless the germline itself has been modified - this has not been shown as of yet).

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#5

Read about the drug Diethylstilbestrol DES which was also an endocrine disrupter. There is a lot of unknowns when it comes to trans inheritance from epigenetic alterations by Finasteride.

#7

Or we finally make research happen and show that PFS exists. You can’t blame medicine for not confronting a problem that doesn’t exist. Unless there is proof that something exists, in science it doesn’t. It has been on us to show that it exists. All we have to do is make research happen.

All we have to do is make research happen. Until we have made an earnest effort in that direction, we have no one but ourselves to blame and blaming others is nothing but counterproductive.

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#8

Some people who thought they had PFS recovered from whatever thing was giving them similar symptoms (e.g., depression, hypogonadism, temporary hormonal upheaval).

There are no confirmed recoveries from PFS, only some people,who self-diagnosed and then at some point in time later claimed they had recovered. Let’s not delude ourselves into pursuing false hope at the expense of actual progress.

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#9

Where’d you read this info on “up to 3 generations”? Goldstein in San Diego told me there are greater risks vs the normal male population of abnormalities and defects in PFS sufferers’ offspring. He specifically mentioned hypospadias. I don’t know what the rate of occurrence is in comparison to the normal populous though.

#10

Yes. I’ve read about tribulus on this forum and I tried it. It destroied me. I think I will die soon.

#11

I think it is pretty clear that TTHCWP (TRT, Trib, HcG, Clomid, Welbutrin, Proviron) as a whole has done much more harm than good to people on this forum.

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#12

According to who’s definition of PFS? Your definition I assume, which is something along the lines of: “PFS is an untreatable condition. Anybody who benefits from any form of treatment means they don’t have PFS”. If we adhere to your definition, of course nobody with ‘PFS’ has benefited from any treatment as your logical is circular.

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#13

It could also be an immune response to androgen hormones, which the body begins to recognize as foreign and attacks the various tissues modulated by testosterone and DHT. This would also explain why the syndrome can occur after the first intake, or after discontinuation. This theory could also provide the missing link that links this syndrome to the analogous (or even the same) one that occurs with serotonergic antidepressants. Serotonin is an important immunoregulator, I will attach a research, for clarity:

the autoimmune theory would also explain why there are people here with symptoms like even if he did not take SSRIs or finasteride, but simply had a particular diet or used other types of enzyme / hormone inhibitors.

The absurd thing - and this is my mere opinion - is that no one has yet wanted to orient research on this theory, they always point to the consequences (neurosteroids, penile tissues, microbiome …), but never to the root.
I have the impression that the researchers also want to get around the goal.

#14

There is no silver bullet research tack people could agree on that would yield a cure and we should therefore sit around trying to unearth by chatting away on a forum among ourselves. A treatment will come if and only if WE do a large number of things to draw attention to the problem, motivate scientific interest, and facilitate its performance to the largest degree possible across a wide array of tacks.

We have done none of those things for 15 years and therefore have lost 15 years.

If and only if we do those things, we have hope to put a stop to the tragedy of PFS. The fact that we have done none of those things means that we have not even begun to tap the potential curability of this condition. A wonderful future awaits us if we can recognise the error of our ways and make the pivot necessary to save our lives.

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#15

@vkg1 The problem is that if you concentrate only on trying to blame the pharmaceutical companies and ask yourself with a warmongering attitude, no researcher will ever listen to us. The first real problem is that you try at all costs to blame the drug, when the latter triggers a condition for which you were most likely predisposed. The right thing to do would be to present yourself as sick for unknown causes, then have studies carried out and then, once you have more data, associate everything with finasteride / ssri … Only in this case we will be able to find someone willing to listen and maybe even funding.

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#16

Listen, why do people give the pharmaceutical industry the benefit of the doubt when it comes to other products even though they got injured by one. The third leading cause of death behind cancer and heart disease is pharmaceuticals.

Brandy Vaughan who suspiciously just lost her life in her sleep was an ex Merck and Co employee explains this all very well. She started the website “learn the risk.”

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#17

Enough research is there to say it exists. If 1000 men came forward saying they were perfectly healthy one day, who then take Finasteride and suddenly all have similar symptoms then the correlation is too high to say it’s a mere coincidence or psychosomatic which is a general term for doctors to otherwise say “nothing to see here!”

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#19

No researchers apart from Melcangi have given us due process. Why? Because the industry is so corrupt even people who have been injured don’t really understand the extent of what’s happening out there. It’s totally barbaric and we’re seen as nothing more than collateral damage to fill the pockets of some CEO. If the medical industry really cared research would have taken place 2 decades ago when the first victim of Finasteride came forward. I look at all the autoimmune issues, syndromes and literally none of them have ever been cured what does that tell you? The whole industry thrives off of illness making us customers for life. Also I’m sorry about your current health issues man :frowning:

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#20

Also this is the technology that I was referring too that could ‘potentially’ be used to treat PFS but I won’t get my hopes up.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/phys.org/news/2020-05-epigenetic-tool-silenced-genes.amp

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#21

I agree completely. People who complain without doing come across as crybabies period, not as advocates for positive change. When they talk about evil corporations, industries, etc they also sound like conspiracy theorists. Complaining about being a victim serves only to undermine credibility and invite dismissal, and what would be the point anyway even if that weren’t the case? It’s not as if there is some kind of global wrong-corrector that goes around and listens to all the victims and fixes their lives for them.

We just have to DO. All of us together. There is no way around that. None of us will have decent lives until we face this fact together.

#22

What do you aim to achieve by focusing on how evil drug companies are? Let’s say drug companies are evil. Ok, now what? If the world would agree that drug companies are evil, then what’s the next step? Do you have any pathway in mind to getting treatment for PFS?