grapefruit reduces the toxic dump on the liver (phase 1)
No Japanther i donāt think that the combination of shcisandra extract and pomegranate extract is bad. Itās just, you must know that pomegranate
can inhibit CYP3A drug metabolism. Hence if you are currently on
other medication there could be a build up in your body due to
promegranate.
Hereās a QUOTE:
in this study, we investigated whether components of pomegran-ate could inhibit CYP3A-mediated drug metabolism. The ability ofpomegranate to inhibit the carbamazepine 10,11-epoxidase activ-ity of CYP3A was examined using human liver microsomes, and pomegranate juice was shown to be a potent inhibitor of humanCYP3A. Addition of 25l (5.0% v/v) of pomegranate juice resultedin almost complete inhibition of the carbamazepine 10,11-epoxi-dase activity of human CYP3A (1.8%). The inhibition potency ofpomegranate juice was similar to that of grapefruit
juice.
and hereās the link :
66.218.69.11/search/cache?ei=UTF ā¦ 1&.intl=us
So while taking the pomegranate extract becareful with what medicine
you take. Have you started the choline ?
i dont use any medicine besideā¦
Okay, today i got the cholinā¦ i also use l- arginin at the moment. Do you think that matters?
now i use schisandra/ pomgranate extractā¦ cholin bitarate and l- arginin.
Yesterday i felt quite good but today was badā¦ i felt very bad at work. Do you think that food can cause that? i was on rawfood all the time and yesterday i ate a little peace of white bread and small friesā¦
i think, always when iĀ“m eating badā¦ its getting worse? can this be true?
do you have any advices for the coorect food? anything to avoid?
thx and best ā¦
I can attest for the food thing. I have been on a raw food diet for the past month and change and I have gone off of the reservation twice, both with disasterous consequences. Food definitely has an effect on our well being. I have noticed that I am starting to get regular morning erections on this diet as well. Something that has not happened for years.
When you said you are eating bad and its getting worse, are you reffering
to axiety and brainfog ? or do you feel fatique after eating (feeling tired)?
I use to have problem with fatique after eating but it is due to being
bloated after heavy meal and the stomach ulcer.
i however never have problem with increase anxiety or brainfog after heavy meal/eating.
According to the chinese healer that i visited i have a weak liver which
is strongly related to my digestion problem (stomach ulcer and bloated
feeling) but i have recover from these condition by simply adding the
choline (i was very surprised by the result by the way).
I now eat 3 times a day (morning, afternoon and evening) with snack
in between and have not have any problem. I try to avoid fried food and
eat more of baked food with vegetables., for snacks i mostly eat breads or bananas.
yes, i feel that the anxiety is getting worse after a bad food, also i feel very tired after it. IS your anxiety still cured? i dont now how long the shit takingā¦ but now after 4 months, i come to the border where i find very very awful. I wanna feel good againā¦ i hate this shit. IĀ“d like to go to these pharma bastards and kick them in their nuts!!
cdnuts, are you cured??
has anyone any other advices which i can do beside the cholin, schisandra l- arginin??
greetings
Far from it.
kemangd,
It wasnāt until I started taking ZMK ( http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/millennium-sport-technologies/zmk-120-tabs.html ) and melatonin (150 mcg) that I started getting better sleep and better erections.
if you ever decide to take this supplement, take 1 in the morning, 1 in the afternoon, then 2 at night. Trust me, youāll progressively better sleep with each night. You wonāt sleep great right away but eventually youāll get up to 8 hours of sleep after 3-4 months, but your erections will be a lot better.
I took the program off of Big Softie but he thought that is was Sustain Alpha that helped, but I realized that ZMK was the major component that will allow you have moderate libido but great erections up to 80-90 percent of your erections. Remember, it will take you a couple of months on being on the ZMK regiment before you see what iām talking about.
I started saw palmetto before I started Propecia ā about a week or two prior, then took it concurrently with Propecia for seven weeks, then stopped saw palmetto, took a break for two weeks, and continued propecia for one last week. The only side effect I noticed from this combination was slurred speech/tripping over words, which I attribute to the Propecia, as it seemed to bring back my speech problems on its own that final week. No problems on saw palmetto prior to starting Propecia either.
Oneday my sleep is ok now after taking all these supplements but thanks
i will surely look into ZMK.
up date on taking DHEA supplement, this week has been bad for me
no Spontaneous erection, no nocturnal erection and even no morning
erection, sleep is of low quality and i sweat alot on my bed.
This happen during the 1st week on Decemberā08.
At first glance i thought i was having too low estrogen since the symptoms
are pointing to that direction and i was taking 0.25 mg of Arimidex, but there is something else i panic alot. Then i remember that the guys
on hypo forum used to corelate panic and high estrogen.
So i decided to up my dose of arimidex to .5 mg on friday (taken in the
morning) and on the evening mood is better, i slept better that night but
still no nocturnal erection, morning erection and my sweat is reduce alot,
i stopped taking DHEA. On monday i took 0.25 mg of Arimidex, sleep
quality improved no nocturnal erection but this morning i got back my morning erection and so far the panic is gone.
It is very strange to me that i am only taking a very low dose of DHEA
and the fact that during the whole process i was taking Arimidex 3 times
a week. This suggest that more testosterone that is coming from DHEA is
simply being turned into estrogen and that my liver ability to convert
testo to DHT is severly compromised.
To rule out any liver problem i test my liver yesterday and here is the
result:
- SGOT: 26 < 33
- SGPT: 29 < 50
- Gamma GT 23 8 - 61
- Fosfatase Alkali 70 53 - 128
- Ureum 30 13 - 43
- Kreatinin 0.9 0.7 - 1.2
- Uric Acid 5.7 < 7.00
Just to rule out all the possibilities i will see an internist and scheduled
for USG of the liver.
I am sad hope that my liver is ok 
will report again
kirrabeachbum you must understand that different people react differently
with the same medicine. Just as the majority of people who take
finasteride do not develop problem but some do experience problems
to the extend that there are permanent.
It is the same with Saw Palmetto Extract, many people use it and they
are doing fine, i however is the minority (very few peole) who develop
problems after taking it for a period of time (gyno, erection problem,
mental side effects etc).
My goal is to post my story so people who want to take Saw Palmetto or
any other anti-DHT drug must know that there are risk involved,
eventhough the risk maybe very small but it is still there for their
consideration 
.
hey kemangd,
i think we all need to look at Post Cycle Therapy because we suffer from symptoms like body builders who abused steroids. Taking propecia definitely affects our androgens like steroids users, they have low libido, hormonal issues and small testis. I have those symptoms through fin use and will be examining the solution posted in this article.
http://mesomorphosis.com/articles/anthony-roberts/post-cycle-therapy.htm
I donāt know the complete mechanism by which propecia screws up our hypothalamic-pituitary-gonadal axis (HPTA), but it does and everyone needs to review how body builders deal with this issue then hopefully, we can fix ours.
check it out and let me know what you think. take care.
Can you be sure itās saw palmetto and not anything else? I just find it hard to believe that a natural supplement can cause such side effects, and if it did cause such side effects, stay with you for more than a couple days.
There have been studies about saw palmettoās mechanism of action. While various mechanisms of action are proposed, saw palmetto does not affect serum prostate specific antigen levels. Therefore, a different mechanism of action in affecting DHT than finasteride is thought, such as binding to DHT itself or androgen receptors instead of affecting the 5-alpha-reductase enzyme.
Bout the live issues.
I went to a chinese healer or similar aswell and was told my liver values were not so good after performing some mumbo jumbo evaluation.
I personally belive that they tell 9 out of 10 ppl who visit them that their liver is the fault of whatever problems they may have.
Its just in chinese or eastern culturre to belive if u have a healthy liver everything else falls into place. I dont share this thought.
I think supporting a good liver function is probably a good idea no matter what but i doubt it will be the cause of our issues. The again, this hole mess is a mystery to every1.
marijuana is a natural product and it causes many āside effectsā
whether its natural or synthetic that does not effect the strength of it
take poisonous mushrooms or snake venom as other examples
SAW PALMETTO FOR THE TREATMENT OF MEN WITH LOWER URINARY TRACT SYMPTOMS .
The Journal of Urology , Volume 163 , Issue 5 , Pages 1408 - 1412
G . GERBER
Quote :
A variety of potential mechanisms of action of saw palmetto have been demonstrated through in vitro studies, including 5-Ī± reductase inhibition, adrenergic receptor antagonism and intraprostatic androgen receptor blockade.
Quote:
Clinical evidence of the relevance of these effects is largely unavailable. The use of saw palmetto in men with benign prostatic hyperplasia is safe with no recognized adverse effects. No effect on serum prostate specific antigen has been noted.
Quote:
However, most studies are significantly limited by methodological flaws, small patient numbers and brief treatment intervals
Hereās the link:
linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve ā¦ 4705676318
The last quote should answer your question kirrabeachbum, almost all the
research on Saw Palmetto is done with small patient number and in
brief time.
Also you must understand that i do not develop all the side effects Immediately, it took around one year of taking two (2) 320mg extract a
day for the Ed and loss of libido to appear.
kirrabeachbum, you only use it for three weeks and what is the dose ? is it in standardise extract or not ? the non standardise extract
is not powerfull you will probably feel nothing. During the first two (2)
months i did not develop any side effect, and i mean not even one
side effect.
You should consider yourself lucky that your encounter with Anti DHT drug
such as saw palmetto and Finasteride only leaves you with Speech/tripping
over words.
it took me about 5-6 weeks for me to get symptoms
of course , this is normal with supplements
any supplements take this long to start working
If you look at the components of saw palmetto (free fatty acids, sterols, free fatty alcoholds, and monoglycerides only), youāll notice that there are no ingredients in saw palmetto that are not found in many of the foods we eat everyday, from rice and soy to tomatoes and oranges to broccoli and blueberries. You might as well blame any side effects on rice, for instance.
I started having symptoms after only three weeks on saw palmetto. Oh wait, I also started Propecia two weeks earlier, so according to your theory, it could not have been the saw palmetto b/c it must take 5-6 weeks to work, ay?
The fact that you obviously donāt believe saw palmetto causes any sides is down right rude and insensitive. Kemangd is tellling you that for him it did. I donāt know why you canāt just accept his story. What does it matter to you anyway? Why do you care so much to prove him wrong? Itās ridiculous. There are way more important thing to try and focus on rather then discounting each others stories. How would you like it if people didnāt believe you were studdering because that isnāt a listed side effect. I could name a hundred studies that show propecia doesnāt cause studdering. Would you like that? Would you like me spending time doing that? GET OVER IT.