Prof. Bouloux: PFS is Psychogenic

#1

During a recent appointment with Prof. Bouloux, I asked him for his thoughts on the upcoming studies at Brigham and Women’s Hospital and Baylor College of Medicine. He gave me more than I asked for.

He said that after seeing 80+ patients over 7 years, he feels the idiosyncratic presentation of symptoms suggests a psychological origin. He mentioned past patients with prior “issues” in their lives.

He believes the condition to be perpetuated by the internet, and that updates to the Propecia warning label have exacerbated this.

For the sake of balance, he added that maybe Fin could have adverse effects on certain genotypes, or that it could disrupt the body in ways not yet known. Ultimately, he didn’t believe either of those possibilities.

Directly addressing the studies, he said that a hypothesis involving epigenetic interactions with the AR was “nonsense." And that there was no known evidence for such a hypothesis. He thinks the age matched controls should include current Fin users with no side effects.

With regards to Dr. Shalender Bhasin, Bouloux expressed great respect for him, but felt that he was “roped in” to conducting the study at BWH.

He is aware of Prof. Melcangi’s neurosteroid study, but did not comment on it.

Bouloux seems to be contrary to other “PFS doctors,” in that he was, perhaps, more open minded in the past. He even tried and failed to secure funding for his own study.

I was initially reluctant to post this as I believe it is important for everyone to have their own individual experiences with doctors, rather than read about what others report from their consultations. However, since Bouloux seems to tar his patients with the same brush, I felt it was worth sharing.

#2

On the surface, it’s easy to understand their position. There will always be hypochondriacs and conspiracy theorists with any drug, and since we’re such a rare proportion of total users, you can see why it’s easy associate our problems at a purely psychological level. This has been the verdict of every doctor I’ve visited.

Obviously we know psychology cannot have such a profound physiological effect. The mind cannot alter semen consistency, or cause gyno or muscle atrophy. It can’t remove the pleasure of ejaculation simply because it isn’t into it. Unfortunately all the brain fog issues can be associated with depression, even if we know ourselves our thought process is different than before.

So the problem is, what physical quantitative measure is there to prove the condition? What all encompassing symptom do we all have, that can be tested as abnormal compared to a normal healthy person?

I’m sick to death of being treating like some nutcase. I feel like those Reptilian believers whenever I have to reference this website to professionals, they just will not believe it.

#3

Here is a major major major flaw in his argument. I never even heard of persistent sexual side effects from propecia, especially after taking the pill without symptoms for 9 years!!! In fact, not until my face was red, I couldn’t think straight, I had a tremor, my lower arms and legs began to atrophy, my penis stop working did I even look for what it could be, in fact it was my mom who suggested it was maybe the propecia which I still did not believe at the time. But why am I defending myself against another doctor. Now do I think we potentially have less concentration of a certain neurosteroid/hormone in our brains that potentially exhibits hypochondria or obsessive compulsive, and fin screwed that up…well yes

#4

Interesting, this is pretty much what he said to me when I saw him. However, he did acknowledge that I was very healthy and did not have any factors that would contribute to PFS. I imagine that when he sees people they are usually at their wits’ end and so he assumes that they have had issues in the past - whereas in reality its PFS which has made people like this.

Personally, I think his argument is flawed, incorrect and insulting. I was not aware of PFS and it was only a couple of months after giving up that I became aware of what he would classify “internet hysteria”.

This shows why the studies are so important. At present, it is still easy for healthcare professionals to dismiss PFS sufferers as neurotics who are phsychologically damaged (before taking the drug).

#5

I’m not surprised he said this. I agree with what others have said; propeciahelp has caused a kind of ‘mass hysteria’ in some people.

It took me a while to realise but most of the members of this website and most of the regular posters don’t have PFS.

The biggest problems are that a) PFS is very, very rare. b) There are lots of hypochondriacs (10:1?) c) There is a lack of easily identifiable objective symptoms and symptoms that more easily match depression. The effect of these hypochondriacs cannot be understated.

Maybe he may make more of an effort with research if he saw more people with genuine symptoms.

#6

I guarantee when the brain fMRI studies are released and thy see changes in the metabolism of the brain and excitability in the prefrontal cortex due to changes in important neurosteroid depravation, it will be a new ball game

#7

Bouloux is an Endocrinologist (?) Is he a really old guy, been around the block a few times?

I find that Doctors who have practiced for many years, are not very open minded, or even interested in researching something they are not sure of, to find out the truth. It’s like an old man who gets set in his ways and refuses to believe a handheld device can track your location, or view the planet from space.

Find a Sexual Medicine doctor. I’m seeing the most experienced Doc in the USA and he has many PFS patients on HRT/TRT.

The BIGGEST challenge I’ve realized, is that it’s impossible to find a Doctor with experience or training in ALL areas of PFS symptoms.
Psych, Sexual, Cognitive, Hormones. Each of these requires a different doctor and none of them will get together to talk about the over all picture of our health issues.

So, it’s no surprise to hear an opinion like that from a closed minded doc with only one specialty.

#8

TowmBer- and how successful is your doctor with your treatment?

#9

This. Is. Bull. Shit.

#10

@davey

If he said the same thing to you, then he’s held this opinion for some time.

I understand there is a certain irony in the fact that the validity of his opinions are now under discussion on a site which he believes to be largely responsible for creating and maintaining a mental illness; however, said opinions suggest that an objective, patient by patient, approach to assessing PFS symptoms has been compromised.

His skepticism could be valuable if the upcoming studies produce significant results. He would then have conclusive evidence from his peers.

Currently, his beliefs only hinder the essential need for extensive objective testing.

#11

Well if he’s dealing with stuff like this: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5594#p44293 its no surprise his beliefs have been hindered.

If Bouloux has seen 80 hypochondriacs is his attitude all that strange? There is no way to tell them apart. I blame the hypochondriacs more than Bouloux, his response is to be expected.

#12

Prof. Bouloux sounds like a complete idiot.

#13

Well said Mark

My thoughts exactly.

I’ve read other negative comments relating to Prof Bouloux.

When I was in my early stages looking to see somebody, I stumbled across this guy and my findings on him were that he was fully dismissive of PFS but would be willing to put anybody in TRT for life for PFS related stuff.

He also sounded like a guy more interested in making money than treating the patient properly.

PFS is fucking real, no doubt people can exaggerate theyre symptoms based on this site and other places, but not 80 people for Christ sakes.

I’ve lied about nothing and I know I have PFS
I don’t care what this uneducated money grabber has to say.

#14

This is all very similar to something Dr Alan Jacobs posted; viewtopic.php?f=29&t=7589&hilit=jacobs . He claimed 300+ people had seen him (despite only 10-20 people on the forum reporting doing so) and he claimed 50% of these where just stressed and they, and everyone else, could be treated with TRT or clomid (much to the everyone’s amazement).

Either he is incompetent, lying about everything or a large number of hypochondriacs have been to see him. Unfortunately I think there is a massive interference from hypochondriacs, this is a massive problem.

#15

I’m looking forward to him eating his words. I do hope he calls all his 80+ patients and APOLOGIZES for telling them “it’s all in your head.” I’m going to contact several of the doctors who have told me as much once these studies are released, and point out how terrible they are at their jobs. It is so hilarious to me that people who complete MDs think that transforms them into knowing every possible outcome of every drug in the world on every human being. It’s so asinine that it’s almost frightening.

#16

if he cannot or does not want to help then his opinion on pfs really doesnt matter to me anyways … fuck him

#17

Seriously, maybe we should all fly to see him, drop our pants and show him our cold shrunken veins buldging curved penis to the left and then let this fucking asshole tell us it happened because of “issues in our past”

#18

I will be removing him from the Doctors section of the site, and am truly insulted as are we all.

PFS is not psychogenic… physical changes to one’s body and genital tissues, breast tissue, prostate tissue etc is not psychogenic in the least, not to mention the various documented effects of the drug on hormones and neurosteroids.

1 Like
#19

Superb Mew

Nice work

Think we will all appreciate your actions.

#20

Thanks Mew and thanks Mark_UK for raising this issue. What’s so insulting is that Bouloux charges a fortune for private consultations and then fails to look into each case in its own right. I don’t think it’s occured to him that people may be on edge because of the symptoms they have developed (as opposed to developing symptoms because of their mental state).

In my case he did a quick inspection (pulse rate etc.) and admitted I very very healthy. I explained I only became aware of the “internet hysteria” when my symptoms on the poison persisted but clearly didn’t change his views.

Thank goodness for advocates like Mew and Awor and for the work the PFS Foundation which is funding research and properly looking into this issue.