Exactly. I believe that it’s too low in relation to estradiol.
If something was wrong with the DHT = 3a-DIOL conversion, the DHT level would increase, without affecting the level of androstanediol glucuronide.
3 Alpha a g 2.70 ug/l Range 2.20 -26.0
Bio availble testosterone 3.7 nmol/l Range 1.4-6.1
The above is from 6 weeks of stopping Dustaride and feelin shit. 8 th feb 2011
3 Alpha a g 89.0 ug/l range 2.20-26.0
Bio availible testosterone 27.82 nml/l
the above taken 17th october 2011 after a 350 mill shot of TRT every 2 weeks
I’m taking Dostinex at the moment. Also, at the moment I have only some relatively mild sexual sides. No spontaneous erections or visually stimulated erections, not full erection, but I have nocturnals. I have some tinglings in the pelvic area. Shrinking on occasions.
21 Ganuary 2013
androstenediol glucoronide (RIA)
9.10 ng/ml range 3.4-22
4,63 ng/ml range 2.8-11
Testo 461 ng/dl (241 - 830)
SHBG 19.3 nmol/l (17.3 - 65.8)
Free T 82.88 (23.3 - 103)
LH 10.79 mU/ml (1.4 - 7.2)
FSH 7.29 mU/ml (1.1 - 6.4)
3alpha-Diol G >50 (1.53 - 14.82) !!!
androstandiol-gluccourinide 9.85 (1,6-35,3)
DHT 821 ( 250-990)
Testo 497 ( 300-900)
SHBG 30.1 (10-57)
Prolaktin 14.2 < 15.2
3 AdiolG : 23,5 ng/ml (3,4 - 22,0)
DHT: 0,27 ng/ml (0,25 - 1,00)
Total T: 343 ng/dl (175 - 781)
Free T: 9,79 ng/dl (4,58 - 18,33)
Estradiol: 20 pg/ml (0 - 47)
SHBG: 21,3 nmol/l (13 - 71)
FSH: 4,17 mui/ml (1,27 - 19,26)
LH: 3,43 mui/ml (1,24 - 8,62)
Prolactin: 6,3 nanog/mL (2,6 - 13,1)
I did those tests without any treatment. Now I’m taking cypionate testosterone, but still no improvement… Please, any suggestions?
My 3 AdiolG is beyond the limit… WTF?! Why I’m having ED and low libido??
This test was mentioned on this thread :
It tests both 3adiol and 3bdiol. I have not found anyone who has done this test. If you are in the US please do this test. 3bdiol is a potent estrogen - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5%CE%B1-An … CE%B2-diol
I noted in another threat there is a patent to uses it as a ERB agonist. Maybe that is where our DHT is ending up somehow? This would be especially interesting to those who crashed after quiting.
Please can someone who has low ADIOL G please do the test mentioned. If you have low adiolg and normal T levels we need to figure out where that T / DHT is going. If you have low adiol g and normal bdiol it is quite possible this will cause symptoms of estrogen dominance as bdiol alone is quite estrogenic while adiol is androgenic. So please get this tested asap at meridian labs. I would do it but I am not in the US. I think test for androstenedione, testosterone, dht, 3bdiol and 3adiol is about $200. Thanks
So after all this Adiol-G business, do you guys think that the results of this test is a accurate way to measure are body’s ability to convert testosterone to DHT via the 5 alpha reductase 2 enzyme?
This thread seemed to go a little off track to me.
I’m going to be posting my Adiol-g reading soon. Was hard to get an endo to order this test for me but I finally did it. Waiting on results
My Androstanediol Glucuronide results:
Referance range: 112-1046 ng/dl
“its in your head”
Not sure what you mean by that but if you are implying that this whole thing is in are heads I’m wondering what you are doing here.
You mean your mental health counselor has not been of any help?
I think he is just a little bit sarcastic…or isnt he?
Or just mad because he’s too lazy to go get this stuff done himself.
I came across this thread via Google. I saw that the last comments are dated some time back so I hope I don’t get punished if I awaken this thread from the dead ^^
I just read the first 5 pages of this thread (unfortunately the entries are 5 years old). But is this experiment of measuring your 3 Alpha Androstenediol Glucuronide still going on? Have you come to a conclusion on what causes PFD? Which hormone is the most reliable?
I am really suffering from PFD. Weirdly is that I only started developing symptoms 1 year after I got off the drug. I had some side effects before but they were not so heavy. I could still get an erection and everything but now it has gotten really hard to achieve some kind of erection. Also I feel that I have less feeling in my penis when having sex now. All the other symptoms like brain fog and Depression come with it. I had hard sleeping problems some over a long period of time but fortunately it has gotten better within the last year. Also Cialis can help me with erections. And even after ending Cialis (5 mg/day for 2 months) I feel that the erection is better now. But better doesn’t mean good. And not good enough to have sex until the end. I can get an erection for like 1 minute and then it gets increasingly harder with every second to sustain that erection. Also after half a year of taking Propecia I noticed that my sperm was different. It changed from one day to another (no exaggeration). But it did not get less. It actually got more. But it changed ist consistency. Before it was what I would call normal: some kind of white and viscous. Now it is like water. Translucent and really liquid. It doesn’t defer from Urine (except the color) much.
I had some blood values taken. I don’t have them with me now but my testosterone was really high (nearly over normal) and my DHT was within normal range. My FSH although was 3.1. Normal would be 1.5 - 12. So it’s normal but really low. Could this be why my sperm did change?
I came across this blog:
He also says to have 3 Alpha Androstenediol Glucuronide checked. But unfortunately I haven’t found a lab here in Austria (please don’t confuse it with AustrALia ) that would do this test. Is somebody here from Austria or Germany or Switzerland or maybe somewhere else from Middle Europe who can help me? Has somebody done this test from this region?
Thank you all!
@Vincentv - somehow I cannot respond to PMs. There is no “answer button” anywhere. Am I unable to write PMs? So I have to answer here instead:
I wouldn’t say that I have testicle pain. Sometimes I have kind of a stinging feeling in my testes but nothing really severe or painful. I often have a cold and numb Feeling though. My scrotum AND penis often contract and feel really cold. My penis actually has normal size (compared to before Propecia). At least I cannot tell a big difference. Maybe it lost a little size? I don’t know. But when it’s doing this “contract thing” it’s definitely smaller!! I haven’t noticed this prior to Propecia. And acutally I FIRST noticed it and THEN I read about all the PFS symptoms so it’s not a psyche thing. I have the feeling that this mostly happens when I feel stressed. Maybe it’s got something to do with Cortisol? I don’t know, just guessing. I had my Cortisol measured in my salvia 4 times a day. This was one year ago. And my doctor told me that I have a fucked up curve. I have too much Cortisol during night period (morning and evening actually) but too less during the day. Which causes me to not sleep well but be tired during day. On the other hand other doctors told me that this doesn’t mean anything. I don’t know who to trust here.
My libido is really changing. But at NO POINT it is like it was before Propecia. Before Propecia there were times when I felt like I was “exploding” if you know what I mean. I didn’t have this feeling since Propecia anymore. But now it’s like coming and going. Sometimes there is no libido for weeks at all and sometimes it gets better (but like I said, it’s never like before Propecia).
So if this 3 Alpha Androstenediol Glucuronide does not have anything to say, what does? Did you all come to a conclusion? Or at least some kind of hint? Are our androgen receptors fucked up or what’s the point? My urologist said that with my testosterone I should have no trouble at all. Yet I know that testosterone alone doesn’t say anything. I’m gonna have my blood checked again soon with free testosterone, prolactin and all that stuff. Though I know I’m gonna have to pay myself. But this issue is messing me up so much that I’m willing to do anything. I hope there is some kind of solution. You know, actually if this would had happened naturally, it would not bother me soo much. Then I’d say “Ok, this is the way my body is”. But knowing that this drug that I DECIDED TO USE did it, makes me restless.
All the best
Adiol-G testing had not yielded any results that can be acted on, yet.
Hm ok. I am wondering why it is still being said on this page that this is the most important Hormone one should check:
So I already went through many threads on this forum but I cannot find a common theme. Those are the things that I know about myself:
.) took Propecia for ~ 1 year
.) 1/2 year after start of Propecia -> sperm changed a lot. more amount, more fluid and translucent
.) 3/4 year after start of Propecia -> friend told me that I seemed really depressed. I could feel it myself.
.) Discontinued after ~ 1 year
.) In the first weeks and months I noticed no change
.) 3 months after I stopped I broke up my relationship cause I felt unhappy. It made me even unhappier and I got really depressed during that period
.) 6 months - First started noticing ED but it was very slight
.) 10 months - still had good erections (no need of Cialis or anything) though I noticed that the feeling in my penis got less.
.) 12 months - first time of failed sex.
.) 1 1/2 loss of libido. Could achieve sex but it was hard to sustain errection. Had to stop, pull out and “give a hand” every now and then
.) 2 1/4 years - first time my penis did not react AT ALL. Sex IMPOSSIBLE
.) 2 1/2 year - doctor prescribed me Cialis (5mg/day) -> at beginning heavy errections. Long and sustaining. I took them for 2 months. At the end errections were not that heavy like in the beginning. Like my Body got used to it. But can that be in the case of Cialis?
.) 2 1/2 years - noticed that left chest got feminine like fat tissue
.) 3 years after Propecia and half a year after Cialis -> can get errections now and then. But they don’t last long and are not so hard.
.) Libido is not like before Propecia. It comes and goes, but even on high points it’s not like I’d call myself “horny”.
.) Less feeling in penis
.) contraction of penis and scrotum. Cold feeling. Also in my feet and hands sometimes.
.) poor sleep (that got better within the last year - I started dreaming again for the first time a while ago. Before I had dreamless nights, always in a half-sleep stage)
.) more fat in the chest area. I only noticed that half a year ago. I didn’t gain weight. Just gained fat, mostly in my left chest. Has a feminine kind of look. I used to have fat in that area before but it looks different now (I noticed this before I read about PFS)
.) heavy depression (even went to psychiatrists) -> but have also been getting better within the last year. But on some days it’s like something in my brain changes and I suddenly just want to lie in bed for 3 days in a row. Actually I don’t even wanna do this, at that time NOTHING interests me and I have thoughts of suicide (though I would never do it cause I know that it Ends normally after 3 days)
.) the feeling of standing next to yourself and watching yourself. A passive, dreamy feeling. As if you were watching life through a fog bank. Is it called brain fog?
.) anxiety Problems. Cannot be co-driver in a car. It feels like I’m in a rollercoaster.
.) When looking someone in the eye I have the feeling of fainting. I cannot really explain this.
FSH: 3.1 (normal: 1.5 - 12)
Vitamin D: even in summer very low. I don’t know the unit but mine was at 15. Normal would be 30 - 100. I am taking D3 drops now.
Testosterone – 682 ng/dL range 250-1100
Free Testosterone – 42.2 pg/mL range 46-224
Testosterone Bioavailable – 92.4 ng/dL range 110-575
SHBG – 80 nmol/L range 10 to 50
Albumin,Serum – 4.8g/dL range 3.6-5.1
FSH – 3.9 mIU/mL range 1.6-8.0
LH – 2.2mIU/mL range 1.5-93
Estradiol(Ultrasensative) – 23 pg/mL range <OR=29
Estrogen, Total Serum – 183.6pg/mL range 60-190
Estrone(E1) – 39 pg/mL range <OR=68
Prolactin – 5.6 ng/mL range 2-18
DHT – 60ng/dL range 16-79
Progesterone, LC/MS/MS - <.1 ng/mL range <OR=.2
Progesterone (another one with different range) - <.5 ng/mL range <1.4
Pregnenolone - <5ng/dL range 13 – 208
DHEA S – 172 mcg/dL range 106-464
3A Androstanediol Glucuronide – 764 ng/dL range 251 – 1500