oscar's Hormone & Blood Test results

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#21

Predictable. The source of all the universes information is on this forum, right?

Check the recover section. Time is the most prevalent cure, as you’ll be aware off.

See this is where you reverse engineer things to suit your argument. TRT, yeah, maybe. Fixing their hormones using tailored programs with well monitored bloods? I see very little of this here despite reading about these “countless” attempts i keep hearing about. The one guy that has documented things well and applied a good level of resource and effort on here is JN and he’s had decent success (albeit wavering) which shows there’s definately scope for everyone to enjoy some improvements. This whole “we’re fucked” mentality doesn’t wash with me.

Yeah, you’re right. Do fuck all then. Just wait. That seems to be the mentality with alot of the “defeated” veterans around here. Believe it or not, it’s these guys who stand the least chance in of of this. They’ve gave up and crafted elaborate blanket theories that may or may not apply to everyone. The point is - as Professor Bouloux has said -It doesn’t matter what theories are flying around, every single patient needs to be treated individually (i.e. not by a blanket theory. Not right now anyway!!) in relation to their own symptoms. Yes, its tempting to get suckered into trying to work out WHY this has happened but the most important this is HOW to get better and this CLEARLY varies in different people.

But as you say , its better to not seek out the best treatment humanly possible because that’ll stop scientists trying to solve this generally. Excellent “brain-fogged” logic right there…

I think you underestimate that alot of people do recover, especially over time. Again this forum isn’t the sum of our knowledge (well, mine anyway!!), and lets be honest people are far better at being active on a forum WHEN THEY NEED SOMETHING as opposed to when they don’t…

Anyway im sure Oscar will chime in saying we are spaming his thread. That’s my piece said anyway.

#22

I have been a veteran of the forums you think you and no one else here uses for months, years. I have spoken to chilln probably before you even quit fin. Can’t you get it into your head that Crisler has repeatedly said there is something more serious going on, even using the term androgen resistance?

tbh I don’t see time as a cure in many instances - time doesn’t cure serious hormonal imbalances, and TRT with other hormonal tweaks hasn’t helped many either.

It’s not that difficult: men who’ve had gonadectomies usually respnd fine to TRT, even shit treatments like Nebido. And FTM trans people get muscle growth etc.

And don’t dare slag me for having brain fog you cunt.

#23

Why persist focusing on the negative?

What have YOU tried, yourself, to try improve?

As i said in my thread yesterday - people need to apply smart protocols to give a real chance of success. If they have thyroid problems and adrenal problems then they need to address these alongside the other imbalances. Noone said it isn’t complicated.

#24

You’ve spoken with chiln personally
?

#25

He’s only across on another forum…lol

#26

My testsoterone levels seem to be more or less exactly the same as before starting Propecia. Im sure this proves something :slight_smile:!

I actually had a number of tests carried out just before being prescribed the poison to find out why all my hair was falling out. Hopefully someone will get off their arse at my GP’s surgery and give me all those results, with reference ranges, at some point.

In answer to your question: I have excessive body hair but not a particularly heavy beard. I had no symptoms of someone with low testosterone, although in retrospect I could blame a lot of things, like looking very young and not being paticularly ‘masculine’, on this result.

I should also point out my DHT test was taken much, much later than the others so will be higher in reality. Probably much more than the 5% or 7% that should normally be converted from Testosterone.

#27

Did you ever get 3-adiol-G tested

I need to get this tested in the UK somehow.

#28

clinicheck.com/cms/

These guys test it. I had it done. They will do anything else if you ask them through a doc even things not on their list. Like the 11b-OH-Etiocholanolone.

I’m retesting total test, DHT, 3 adiol g now i’m back to shit land after stopping antibiotics.

#29

Fuck me, what sort of money are you paying for tests like that in the UK?

#30

A few more test results since quitting Propecia;

newer.GIF441×533 43.9 KB

Sperm Test Results


#31

You must be happy that your sperm is ok? how are the other tests? I cannot interpret them. Also, where did you get them done in the UK? NHS?

#32

OK, here are my test results BEFORE USING FINASTERIDE;

old.gif457×611 34.8 KB

I am quite lucky to have these baseline results that I can use to compare with the subsequent testing that I have had done.

As far as I can tell all of the hormones and blood test results are basically still the same as before I used Propecia. My Thyroid hormones are the same and my testosterone (always low) is basically unchanged. This points to my HPTA axis being OK.

The only big change is that my Platelet Count has dropped by about 30% - but is still in range.

The only other consistent changes are that my liver enymes seem to be slightly lowered and my White Blood Cell count (total and neutrophils) are slightly raised. Neither of these results are significant and I wouldnt have noticed unless I had these baseline tests.

#33

How the fuck can your ball shrink and you lose muscle, yet T levels are unchanged before and after drug? Truly, we are in unknown territory. Again points to something going wrong in the brain, beyond hormones although it obviously affects them.

#34

I discovered that something called ‘sickness behaviour’ is very similar to depression and low testosterone mental symptoms - and therefore my mental side effects. It is caused by pro-inflammatory cytokines acting on the brain. Pro-inflammatory cytokines are behind inflammation. I posted a little bit about this here: viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2577&start=100


Cytokines kept on cropping up over and over again in my research, they could in fact cause all of my symptoms (other than sexual ones) so I decided to get tested for them. Cytokines do produce CRP, which i had already tested, but sometimes rarely will not.

C-Reactive Protein. <0.6 mg/L (<5.0)
C-Reactive Protein - High Sensitivity. 0.4 mg/L (0.0 - 5.0)

Cytokines:

Interleuken IL-1 beta. <5.0 pg/ml (<5.0)
Interleuken IL-2 Receptor. 393 U/ml (223 - 710)
Interleuken IL-6. <2.0 pg/ml (<5.9)
Interleuken IL-10. <5.0 pg/ml (<9.1)
Tumour Necrosis Factor alpha. 2.9 pg/ml (0 -12.5)

I have no significant inflammation detectible in my blood.

However I am currently thinking that the return of 5aR may have caused some irritation (inflammation) to my nervous system and therefore a blood test would not detect this. So I will now ask to be referred to a top Neurological Centre in England to look for problems within my CNS. I do think its worth looking into, even if its another dead end. Long term inflammtion will also cause other clusters of problems; (see this interesting paper; Energy regulation and neuroendocrine-immune control in chronic inflammatory diseases. ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20210843) such as Cachexia (unintentional loss of lean body mass), Cachectic obesity(Cachexia plus increased fat deposits), Low Vit D, Dyslipidemia (low HDL cholestorol - which I have), Hypoandrogenaemia (low levels of androgens - which others have), Osteopenia and Sickness Behaviour as well as others.

#35

Did you get a 3-adiol-G reading and if so, which lab? I need to find out for my endo…

#36

i think that paper is a great find oscar. curious if the full version has any suggested treatments.
also, perhaps it woud be wise to test semen for inflammatory markers - i know this doesnt tie in directly with the CNS but just to rule it out for any inflammation

#37

Hi Golf. Not sure what sort of test that would be!? Surely PSA is the test for such things? My PSA is slightly higher than most men on this forum. So maybe i do have some issues there. I am seeing a urologist who is a specialist in ED soon - i’ll see what he has to say about the whole prostate thing.

To be clear here is why i think inflammation of the nervous system could be the cause of some of my more serious problems:

Inflammation acting upon the brain would cause neurological symptoms similar to those that I have.
Inflammation of nerves in the penis/genitals is one source of ED/numbness/anorgasmia.
I have no signs of serious inflammation in my blood. Yet serious health problems.
Inflammation is usually associated with problems of the CNS and peripheral nervous system
3alpha reduced metabolites are neuroprotective (i think we where born with low 3aHSD & 3aDiolG/Allopreg, Fin made it even lower)
DHT can make things worse due to its pro-inflammatory properties (surely its ONLY known negative quality?)
Muscle loss (etc) is due to inflammation causing a raised metabolic rate, increased metabolism leading to catabolism.
Possibly two or three people have had some success with Prednisone/Dexamethasone. Although some people have reported otherwise.

#38

I’ve had blood tested for inflammation before and all clear. It sure feels like I have arthritis sometimes.

I apologize if it’s been mentioned already somewhere, but, is there a test outside the standard ones, that could prove we’re not dreaming up inflammation?

I know my doctor certainly doesn’t think outside the box, nor give a shit really… so relying on him to decipher the cause is pointless.

I believe the guys that say the TRUS can show prostate inflammation, provided the person looking at it knows what they are looking for… What about the rest of the body?

(Popped a cialis a few days ago and I’m sore head to toe… but know that could be a side effect).

#39

C-reactive protein (CRP) blood tests are used to detect inflammation in the body

patient.co.uk/health/Blood-Test-Detecting-Inflammation.htm

#40

bluejaysfan, I have already had every test that i can think of to look for inflammation. And I have done quite a bit of reading on the subject. As you can see above, I have no signs of inflammation in my blood either. When I see a neurologist I will talk with him/her about some of my ideas (what fun!) to try and find out if any other tests exist.

What I want is a spinal tap. I want my cerebro-spinal fluid checked for signs of inflammation.