What are the Endos saying about all this. I know most of them don’t believe it at all, but there must be a few that have something to say. Is it DHT, estrogen, testosterone, the HPTA.
It seems like depression is a component in most of the guys that are having problems. Is that one of the causes, or an effect.
Has anyone used 6-oxo, zinc, or tribulus with any success. Or do you have to use the heavy artillery like clomid to get things back on track.
Steroid uses talk about being “shut down” after a cycle, and needing clomid or other similar drugs to get the HPTA to relight.
Is this what we are dealing with? This is a great website, but I would love to know what the endos are telling people because I get nervous trying a treatment based on someone online saying “this is my theory”
The problem is not many endos recognize Finasteride as a problem, let alone trying to find info on the Internet about what they might have said about the drug.
However, there are a few who do understand the damage it can do – particularly Dr John Crisler and Dr Eugene Shippen. View Shippen’s thoughts here – propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=537 , albeit this is second-hand info through the words of a user who has seen him for treatment.
Hopefully you have read through the FAQs at the top of this forum, it may shed some light on things. Everyone has their theories – but for th most part it seems pretty conclusive that the drug does have an effect on the HTPA (Fin upregulates T, lowers DHT, can lead to increase in Estradiol etc… and some men end up with secondary hypogonadism after taking it)despite Merck’s claim to the contrary.
Other possibilities include disruption of neurosteroid levels (ie, dopamine, GABAA), that the drug caused mutation in the 5AR gene and thus it is unable to function properly after Finasteride use, or disruption of other 5AR-metabolite neurosteroids/hormones.
Depression is a symptom many men experience while taking the drug. There are studies in the Finasteride Studies section about it. I personally experienced this, it was unlike anything I’d ever felt in my life. Thankfully after I quit the depression/melancholy feelings cleared up within a few months. The most common symptoms many men share is the drop in T levels after coming off the drug, elevated Estradiol, possibly elevated SHBG and low Free T/DHT, LH, and FSH. Again, Secondary Hypogonadism symptoms.
Check the Drug Therapy and Naturals section. Also review the Member Stories… guys have detailed their experiences with various forms of treatment… ie J89, Legenden. For some guys Clomid/hCG/TRT is something they need to try to try and get things back on track… but it seems to be a difficult process.
You won’t know what you’re dealing with for yourself unless you get the proper bloodtests as outlined in the Blood Tests section. Then you can evaluate your condition and determine further treatment options, hopefully with a competent Endo that will take your case. As for being shutdown, it seems that way for a lot of guys… possibly due to us not cycling Finasteride, and because Fin upregulates T and E2 levels in some men (ie, similar to steroid abusers). But that is just conjecture on my part.
Anyway, research this site. You can also join the old Yahoo group for further research into the archives of posts there.
The general feedback im getting from doctors and others in this predicament is you need to treat this as a difficult case of hypogonadism - if your problems are related to low androgens such as T or DHT.
Forget about Tribulus if its a T problem. Your wasting your money.
I’ve had crap loads of blood work done over the past 2 years. I am completetly in range for everything. I could post my work, but that would take some time, i will do it eventually, im way tired right now.
I have a medical file that is inches thick, I have complained about strangely severe fatigue (its so bad that it hurts). It should be obvious to the Doc’s that Im not a total quack(after 2 years of complaining about the same symptoms), and I don’t go to the doctors office on my day off from work for the shear fun of it. I go there because im desperate for some help.
Tired or not, youve got to post your blood test results or no-one here can really help you. The fact that youve got all of your blood work “in range” doesnt mean you are fine. Please post your bloodwork as soon as you can so we can try and help.
You need to get onto a good anti-aging clinic in your area. Your average GP doesnt have the knowledge to deal with even fatigue stuff let alone finasteride problems.
Depression can be an effect from Fin…or from several other stuff that Fin may have caused. I can understand ppl being depressed cuz they can’t get it up. Also, depression may have been starting all along due to hairloss which leads ppl to Fin.
At age 28 looks to me like your LH and correspondingly, your Testosterone levels are low.
Ideally a guy your age should have Total Testosterone around 650+, ie 700-750 optimally and LH around 4-5 at least.
Your Free T is mid-range but could stand to be higher. We don’t have Estradiol, Prolactin, Progesterone or SHBG so unsure why your Free T is somewhat low…
Best bet is to post your full labs in the Blood Tests section, with ranges and time taken.
9am. I have had alot of the other labs done, I just have to find them. I know that i havent had DHT done. Everytime I ask the endo about propecia and side effects he gets annoyed and says that there are absolutely no side effects, its starting to piss me off.
9 AM? Then I agree with Mew. Your testosterone is likely too low.
Skeptical doctors can be difficult to deal with. If he doesn’t believe it’s the Propecia, then either find a different doctor if possible or avoid mentioning Propecia. It really doesn’t matter what initially triggered our problems. What matters is that we have problems, and in your case, this is reflected in your hormone profile, so the approach would be the same regardless of whether it’s Propecia-related or not.
Get a new doctor. Learn from my mistakes and those of others on this board and dont waste your time and money on doctors who think this is all in your head. They have no idea what they are talking about.
You need someone who specialises in hormones not urology…for now anyway.
