Converting T to E instead of T to DHT?

General Discussion
#1

Another theory I’m considering, and by no means is it a new theory, is whether or not our bodies are converting our T to E? The reason I say this is because most of our blood tests, at least the ones that test for E2, show E2 to be in the high range. Moreover, this could also explain why TRT does not work - because the supplemented T turns to E. This may also explain why the broccoli treatment works - it reduces E, if I’m not mistaken. It is also consistent with the many side effects of too much E, as Hypo has explained in his many informative posts.

Legend, I know you’re currently trying TRT, and I know you said you took a baseline blood test of DHT in order to determine whether or not the supplemented T is converting to DHT. However, did you also take baselines of your E2 in order to determine if the T is also being converted to E, or being converted to E2 exclusively?

Just a thought.

#2

I have been on TRT for about 2 months now with no improvement. I am pretty sure, I am converting T to E even though my E2 is only midrange (still high by any good doctors standards). I am just hoping that by lowering the E, I might find a zone that I can work in.

I get an itchy chest and Im not sure if this is a sign of high E or not. Ive heard others who had gyno who said they had itchy chest, but another person told me that an itchy chest is normal when your hormones are adjusting. I dont have any noticable growth either.

Does anyone know if an itchy chest (not nipple) is a sign of E dominence?

#3

guys i don’t think this is the main problem. if our problem was just the increased favor of T conversion to E via the aromatase on the account of T/DHT via the 5 a reductase pathway then an aromatase inhibitor like arimidix would solve our problems. or, lets say, a non-aromatisable androgen would enhance our libido and erection. i believe the problem is more complex than that. :cry:

#4

If I’m not mistaken, ex fin users who took Arimidix experienced positive improvements, no?

#5

Yes they did. A lot of guys claim to have E2 sensitivity. Ive heard of a few who recovered from Armidex. Since DHT keeps E in check, it makes sense.

Also some guys who have never even touched finasteride have high Total E, with normal E2, yet still have all the symptoms of high E such as bloating and itchy chest etc…yet Armidex makes them feel worse. For these guys (which could be some of us here too), the answere lies with estrogen metabolism. For some reason estrogen is not being detoxified and so the person becomes estrogen dominent.

How many here have tried DIM? Apparntly doses of 300mg per day are normal. I am on it at 70mg per day with no improvement.

I think Calcium D Glucarate would help with this also.

#6

i am trying DIM. have been on it about 1 month now.

i am feeling better overall, but can’t say whether it’s due to DIM or not. i’m on other stuff as well like garlic, GABA powder, theanine, and doing intense weightlifting.

am not going to get too excited until i have new blood tests in a few weeks.

#7

I did get the pseudo gyno while on fin. It’s gotten much better since quitting but I do still get itchy nipples/chest and pinching in my nipples every once in a while. Even after more than a year off fin. And when I mentioned this to a doc recently he wanted to know if my Cortisol levels were high.

I just bought some DIM (expensive at $25 for 60 pills). How much are you guys taking? I’m starting with 100mg twice a day.

#8

Which DIM are you taking? What brand? Ive heard you need to be carefull with taking more than about 70mg of Indolplex a day due to a high calcium content in it?

Apparantly also DIM seems to work best if used with I3C, or if its got 13C in it. I have no idea why, but it seems to work better.

A lot of guys seem to have real problems with the dosing of this stuff. A lot of confusion about it. To be safe, I would get a DIM supplement with 13C and stick to 70 - 100mg per day.

This is one of the best ones I know of:

ultimatemedresearch.com/estroblock.html

#9

It’s called Source Naturals. Each pill had 100mg or dim, 50iu E, 25mg Phosphatidyl Choline, 3mg Pepper Fruit Extract (Bioperine). No Calcium. This is it:

vitacost.com/SourceNaturalsD … lylmethane

I’m going to cut it to 100mg/day. What are the problems with taking more?

Thanks for the info.

#10

There is no problem with taking more except that there is meant to be a high calcium content in the Indolplex brand - even though it does not state that on the packaging. Otherwise, if you are sure there is not heaps of calcium in the one your taking, up to 300mg of DIM per day is considered safe.

Large doses of calcium at one time is dangerous to your body.

#11

The bottle doesn’t list calcium but when I search online I see the same product for sale which lists 53mg of calcium. There must have been a change at some point. But either way 53mg seems low.

Thanks for the heads up.

#12

Does anyone think it’s at all possible for DIM to make symptoms worse?

#13

how did everyone go with the DIM supplement?

#14

It’s been 18 years, I suspect it’s not proven to be a game-changer.