Have you tried Vortioxetine?
Yeah. It’s very good.
why do you take clomiphene and anastrozole? im considering the first to increase my testostere-production, i reached a new low of 4ng (freeT 10 [10-40]). for how long have u been taking lorazepam?
back to topic: when i was on mirtazapine only, i was several times 5ng total T, rather low E2 and 2,3 tu 2,6 TSH.
when i reduced mirtazapine and added agomelatine TSH dropped to 2 and total T increased towards 6ng.
physically mirtazapine was rather feminizing to me. but mentally its good, i d say nootropic.
agomelatine is like the opposite in me: better shape, but the cognition is less sharp (less deep calculation-skill in chess). though i feel more connected to people in an emotional way (what is this?,oxytocin?,some inderect e2 boost via serotonin??)
Interesting.
I took clomiphene and anastrozole to restart natural testosterone production.
They worked well.
I take lorazepam every night before go to bed.
How long did it take for Vortioxetine to start working for you? Did it help with depression/anxiety? Were they really bad to begin with?
About a week.
It helps a lot with depression and anxiety but also it works great for anhedonia and emotional blunting.
Depression, anxiety and palpitation are awful side effects. You need to treat them asap.
In my case vortioxetine works with a few drops.
ok, i might try clomiphene too.
since when are you taking lorazepam? no tolerance? does your doc say its ok in the long run? because 1mg of this benzo helped me once too, doesnt make me fell buzzed the next day.
what do you guys think of bupropion? is it androgenic? i used it, gave me much more drive, spontaneous erection but also higher bloodpressure and tinnitus well…i had my lowest measured T lever on it.
A few drops? Vortioxetine comes in tablets of 5mg, 10mg and 20mg if I recall correctly.
I have vortioxetine in oral drops (trade name Brintellix).
About 2 years. I have developed no tolerance.
Before clomiphene and anastrozole protocol I ned 2,5 mg of lorazepam to sleep. (now 1,25mg)
For doc it’s ok maybe I could develop some amnesia and memory recall impairment but anxiety, racing heart, depression and insomnia are the worst and they can destroy you very quickly.
thats a nice doc. in my area they are the kind of dogmatics who rather prescribe you 4 ADs than just 1 benzo.even if a good sleep only could fix the problem.
did he prescribe you clomifene too?
Yeah but it’s a off-label treatment.
Update: used 10mg Vortioxetine tabs for two days and crashed hard. I’d wager if a study were conducted they’d find Vortioxetine raises neurosteroids just like most other antidepressants. Stay safe guys.
Hi Borax. When you say you crashed, what do you mean by that? Also, according to the studies available, we are deficient in certain neurosteroids; why would raising them not work for us? Thank you.
Guys, you are playing with fire, i’m from PSSD forum here, do not use SSRI ever. We have exactly the same symptoms like here, i woke up during my taper from Paroxetine completly numb to external stimuli, rubbery skin, anaesthesia, emotional anhedonia, weakness, oily skin, anxiety, change of oddor, extreme hair loss (my pillow was full of hair exactly after crash) Do not do this to you!
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The whole 9 yards. Insane anxiety, impotence, anhedonia, derealization, gastroparesis, all that good stuff.
Because I speculate this raises neurosteroids the same way as other antidepressants, through 3a-HSD, an enzyme that also lowers androgens. As you know, messing with androgen levels is like playing with fire in PFS. I wasn’t aware of Vortioxetine doing so as I didn’t find any literature stating that.
Thought Vortioxetine wasn’t an SSRI. You guys should probably sticky that on the PSSD forum if you haven’t already.
Thank you for describing. In your pfs state do you have all those symptoms anyway but to a lesser degree or are those symptoms that only present during crashes? I’m still trying to get an insight into what people mean when they say crashes. I’m still trying to figure out if my terrible symptoms are going in cycles of crashes or not.
hey borax, what is the effect of lowered androgens on a cellular level? sorry, im not firm with it.
why you put mirtazapine on the list?, i read it does induce 3a-HSD
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3%CE%B1-Hydroxysteroid_dehydrogenase#Clinical_significance
it says activating 3aHSD helps building allopregnenolone which i thought is beneficial for pfs…im confused
[quote=“jakobi, post:27, topic:30490, full:true”]
hey borax, what is the effect of lowered androgens on a cellular level?[/quote]
It’s pretty much what Finasteride, Accutane etc. do, just by a diferent mechanism. In a nut shell: Reducing androgens leads to overexpressed androgen receptors. When we quit the medicine androgen levels increase and these now higher levels link up with overexpressed receptors “overwhelming” the body and resulting in a shut down of the androgen receptor signaling.
For some reason, unlike most patients our system does not return to baseline when we mess with androgen.
Increasing Allo is probably helpful for us. We will see when these analogues are out. Inducing 3aHSD may help with that, but reducing androgens does not. I am a bit surprised that borax crashed so quickly, because often people have a small honeymoon period when reducing androgens before they crash. But in the end, messing with androgens most often leads to more trouble for us.
Unfortunately, many antidepressants seem to work that way. It’s ironic, this condition gives us depression and we cannot even treat it, because most depression treatments do the exact same thing in a different way. This condition really covers all bases.
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