Anonymous user's theory: DHT treatment to increase 5AR2 expression


#21

Hey Ithappens

Masteron certainly would make for an interesting experiment. So far there is evidence that both Proviron (oral DHT) and Andractim (DHT gel) can help in some cases, so there’s a chance that Masteron would also help.

Of course, you could always try either Proviron or Andractim first to see how you respond to DHT supplementation. Then again, even if you didn’t respond to those there is a chance you’d respond to Masteron, who knows.

Will you run it with HCG to ensure you retain testicular function? I think that might be best. I guess ideally you’d do this with an endo’s help, but given that Masteron has very limited clinical use and has a reputation as an anabolic steroid for body builders, I suppose that’s unlikely. Still, your body building friends will probably know all about how to run it, how to combine it with HCG, etc: I’d say if you try it you should do so under close supervision from them.

I’m thinking of trying either Proviron or Andractim, and I’ll report back on how I go. Currently I’m 3.5 weeks into a course of Tamox and I notice no change, so not sure Tamox is going to help me. But I guess I should stick with it for eight weeks at least.

My only question is: I thought you had pretty much got over all this? What symptoms are you still experiencing that you hope Masteron might improve?

Thanks.


#22

Yea I’ve gone over a lot of this with my friend who is a pro bb actually. He told me basically, Masterone doesn’t shut down natural T production, and is safe to run alone by itself without HCG. If I actually do try it I would plan on probably taking 100mg every 3 days or so. I’m not sure exactly of the super high dose the doctor recommended and perhaps we don’t need to go up that high. From my knowledge no one here has ever tried injections of DHT which are much more potent than any oral or gel supplementation so perhaps that’s the best way to go about it.


#23

and his only question was


#24

The only report on DHT injection I’ve seen is that given in the conversation between Josh Fuller and a post-Propecia case called John, mentioned and linked to earlier in this thread.

I can’t remember which of them it was, but he says that he tried DHT gel Andractim with no result. His doctor then gave him an injection of DHT and he says it had him feeling really good with harder and larger erections. For some reason he seems to have left it at that, saying something like: “I think if the doctor would have prescribed more injections at a higher dose it could have helped me a lot”.

Which is weird. I mean, if a doctor gave me an injection of something that had me feeling even remotely good, I’d basically hold him hostage until he prescribed it to me. And if he didn’t, I go out myself and get the stuff black market and learn how to inject, and all that. But hey, that’s just me.

Anyway, good that your friend can advise on how to use Masteron. I’d say be conservative with the dose at first. I mean, we’re talking about pretty potent stuff and we’re messing around with it without doctors. But that’s the hand we’ve been dealt, I guess. If I can’t get a doc to give me Proviron or Andractim, I’ll get it myself.

If you do try it you’ll be breaking new ground, and that’s the type of thing we need.

Good luck, and let us know how you get on.


#25

in terms of that question it’s the same as i stated in my recovery section. Most if not all of my propecia problems are behind me, but it’s still not the 100% recovery i had before. It’s hard to explain, but that’s really the best way i can put it. When I had my two week recovery span I had a few a nights where I truely had normal sleep again and you don’t realize how great it is until u get it again. That’s basically where I think I need to get myself. My sleep is basically normalized where it’s refreshing and ok but not to the point it was before all of this.


#26

Ok, well I just was curious why you’d seek further treatment if you were cured. Maybe you should confirm that this treatment method would solve your complaints, since I never knew DHT helped sleep. HRT can backfire.And if you’re leaning towards new treatments it suggests you’ve still got some symptoms, which is helpful for us to know since your initial treatment holds a lot of interesting questions regarding our own recovery chances.

I personally had wondered the longevity of the GHB reversal, since through using Phenibut I had a rather impermanent recovery, probably since its so quick to develop a tolerance, and the fact that it was only effective for me for about 1.5 - 2 weeks, and when the effect lessened the recovery very gradually faded.

I really don’t see what this will do for you. Dr. Crisler in particular has said that he avoids DHT supplementation as it can crash the HPTA, I guess you know this. With all your horrible symptoms gone I don’t see why you’d need to cycle DHT unless you feel your sex function/libido or androgen isn’t adequate. If I were in your shoes I’d probably just do some lifting and anabolics, especially since you now have the energy and endurance. All I’d say is before you try this make sure you get readouts of your current hormone production. Hope it helps.


#27

Yeah, I’d say running Masteron sounds a bit extreme if all you’re dealing with now is sleep that isn’t quite perfect.

If you’re feeling good on the whole, you don’t want to mess that up. Seems like there’s far more risk than there is potential reward.


#28

I have tried both high dose Proviron and Andractim (5x max. recommended dosage) and can tell you that both just made things worse after a couple of days. But if you want to go ahead and try this route yourself, I suggest you rather start with Andractim (DHT Gel) before injecting Masteron.


#29

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#30

Folks the protocol calls for DHT alone at high doses once a week or else it disrupts the HPTA according to the annonymous doctor, has anyone used it in this respect?


#31

The theory makes sense to explain how we got here, but i do not think extra DHT would necessarilly reverse it.
Since i quit Finasteride, i ve done three DHT blood tests. On my first test, Dht was in normal range, somewhat in the middle of the range. On the following test, it came twice as much the top number of range. And last test (can’t remember the unit, don t have the test with me now):
Range: 298 <–> 960
My result: 1797

I have recovered a little bit after i quit, but then i reached a plateau, and the higher DHT did not cure me. Even though i got better erections when laying down, they re still “dead” erections, no sensitivity, little pleasure.


#32

I just read this thread for the first time. From reading the initial anonomous poster I had one feeling, that this was a person who was an insider from the pharmaceutical industry, who had inside information that he was trying to share with us. Possibly some of the researchers on fin have a conscience and feel bad that they are working for a company that is making 100’s of millions by ruining peoples lives.

I have an appt. next week for some blood work. After the results come in I will try to discuss this theory with my endo. I’m really not expecting anything, but if I could get him to agree to give me once weekly high dose shots of dht to see if it could cure me I’d try it in a heartbeat.


#33

Like the anon email STATED if people read it entirely…he include that even high DHT levels won’t do the trick, 3 adiol g and other parameters have to be measured for true DHT activity.

I thnk you are right, he is a pharm. insider.

Guys, this is a WAKE UP CALL…Is anyone seeing this???


#34

If you read closely, in one of the posts he stated the following:

“I Assure i am a medical doctor.”


#35

He may be a medical doctor but that doesn’t mean he doesn’t work for the pharmaceutical industry. Why would an ordinary doctor, out of the blue, take an interest in our cause? We have hundreds of guys going to the doctors every year to plead our case, and most of them are told it is in their heads. If he’s just an ordinary doctor, why remain anonomous? How does he have such an intimate knowledge of fin, and how it works on the pituitary? Ordinary doctors don’t have that knowledge, even most endos.


#36

Another possible Regimen I’m thinking(don’t take my word for it, IM NOT A DOCTOR)

-Low dose of Dexa to increase cortisone and 5 AR activity.
-1 HIGH DOSE OF DHT Injection per week.
-LOW DOSE of Tamoxifen 3x per week.
-10 mg of cialis 3x a week(to build confidence back)

Am i missing anything? From what i’m reading, this makes sense. Atleast for me, I know clomid responds good to my body, so I don’t need a high dose. Maybe I can use tamoxifen instead, and under doctor supervision take some Dexa and large dose of DHT.

We are getting there…


#37

cialis is an option you always have, regardless of the other regimen.
actually it might help to train your dick working again, via nocturnal night time erections.
dexa is indeed a powerful thing but what means doctor supervision - there is not much a doc can do if you take it. dexa might suppress androgens and you might want to get this checked during treatment.
dexa should not increase cortison production from the glands - it should actually give adrenal glands a relief since it interferes with the feedback loop.
instead of DHT directly one can think about creatine. the advantage i assume would be to avoid a direct supplementation which i consider not the best option. if you just provide the hormones itself it might actually lead to quite some interferences with the endogenous situation. I am just guessing though - but look at TRT. endogenous testo is often shut down after awhile…

…maybe we are onto something here. we have to try the options, experience ourselves and then come to conclusions about how we feel…


#38

I don’t think it matters whether this is a doctor appointed by Merck or whether it was some independent doctor who took an interest. The bottom line here for most people is to try and get better. I think if Merck dedicated 2% of the financial resources they spent on developing this consumer drug towards making ammends for the harm it caused, we would have been 100% back to normal ages ago!


#39

I think the theory makes a lot of sense as far as how we got here. But as far as a cure, i think it is a 5 alpha reductase activator like dilauroyl phosphatidylcholine, not DHT.


#40

We must cover all bases…This is how we will get better. Experimental-Yes, but it has to be done.