5AR, the root of the problem?

General Discussion
#1

QUESTION:

why if all of us took a 5 AR inhibitor(fina),nobody(me too) never had a 5AR test or a receptor test ,mostly I can read in the forum is that we re just trying to take supplements or hormones… we all know our issue is caused from blocking 5 AR,than the problem probably could/should be there.

I would ask everyone to try to have a 5AR test (anyway u can get it) and a dht receptor test… (i think receptors are blocked) …we could compare and see if many guys are affected by theese problems…

I spent a lot of $$$$ testing all my hormones many times,my penis blood flow etc… (all the time doctors said everything is ok,or not so bad) but that was not the cause…the cause was blocking 5AR by finasteride,than let check the cause…

Did anyone check the cause (5AR or dht receptors)?

I think most of us have normal/not so bad hormonal balance because we have a receptor deficient (many guys has shrinked penis,no sensibility penis,hair loss reduced,prostatitis,brain sideeffects,someone on TRT doesn’t feel anything) due to that dht doesn’t get in the organs it has to…but, hormones are in range and dht is present in our blood,than 5 AR doesn’t work nomore in tissue’s organs.
i would suggest everyone to check 5AR and penis tissue(fibroblast),i’ll try and i’m sure we could find something,at least it’s the real root of our problems,i mean what we touched by finasteride.

let me know.

#2

Most labs don’t do such tests, but here are resources that you could take to a doc, hospital or lab and try and find out where such tests could be done:

Genetic testing: how to check for 5AR2 mutation | Blood testing: how to check for 5AR2 deficiency
propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1453

How to test for 5AR/DHT activity via urine/blood test
propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=761

SHBG test – to check for androgen receptor function/insensitivity syndrome
propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1416

propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1240
Find a blood/genetic testing lab worldwide

I wouldn’t doubt this is a possibility… 5AR2 enzymes are present in various degrees in certain tissues (genital skin, pituitary, liver, seminal vesicles, prostate etc), so if they were inhibited with Finasteride in those tissues and never “recovered”, perhaps that is why DHT does not exert positive effects there anymore.

HOWEVER – this doesn’t necessarily make sense because most here experienced a brief 100% recovery within 2 weeks of quitting the drug, only to find this short-lived, as our T levels came crashing down thereafter… so perhaps it is a question of Androgen Receptor desensitization, or downregulation:
propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1295

So, to solve this mystery, I would expect people to do the following:

  1. Blood testing for 5AR2 activity should be done (especially 3a-Diol G) using various tests listed here: propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=761

  2. Genital Skin fibroblast to assess tissue 5AR2 activity and Androgen Receptor binding ability. If that turns up normal, Genetic testing (check for 5AR2 and Androgen Receptor mutation):
    propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1453

  3. If none of those turn up anything wrong, perhaps NADPH-binding testing should be done… here is a theory I proposed, since Finasteride binds with NADPH to stop T from converting into DHT:
    propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1401

  4. Another theory with some pathways worth testing:
    propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1400

#3

By my teory,I think everyone should try to get theese tests… it could be the key of this shit game. I 'll try having them by a special doc friend… hope i can get them earliest.

#4

i had a dayospital this morning…170 euros,got in just had bloodtests and asked to the doc something about 5AR and receptors… he looked me and said:do u read by internet?..it’s the reason u make your mind work so much!..this means “it’s all in your head”…i said fuck u bitch!..
tomorrow i’ll have some name of real good doctors from a friend and i’ll ask to have thosse tests,i really think it’s the key.

i also have 1 question: are you sure green tea is antiestrogen? i consider to try it.

#5

italy, you need to bring the studies in to PROVE your case, otherwise they won’t believe you.

The studies are linked in the posts above, pring them out and HIGHLIGHT the passages listed in those posts.

#6

ok i’m printing them and tom i’ll give them to the friend (he is a doctor)that is giving me some good names,very important names and he has spoken to them from me explaining them my case…but…i’m printing!..
the doctor this morning knew about 5ar test etc …but he said it is not necessary in my case cause hormones are ok.

#7

today i had a very important doc’s name… my friend told him about my problems and this doc said :
there are 2 kinds of men responding to propecia…the 1 type after quit it return normal after some times, the other type could have messed up and to restore the situation must have a very good interpretation of hormones tests,so i’ll have a visit next weeks…
now the 8 i’ll have all my test results and have an appointment…hope he could find somewhat.

at least this doc believes that fina can makes some problems after quitting it.

#8

hello italysideeffect,

thats good news.
is your doctor in italy ?

#9

yes he’s in italy, he is an important one,still don’t know the name cause i go by my friend and he said me he’ is involved in sport , i didn’t understand exactly but something like juventus team soccer here in italy…and if i can’t have answers from him my friend ll let me go to others more important docs…

this friend is a very big piece, he is a judge and…another thing ,he just told me little things about how to put merk in cause,but i’ll let u know…cause i still don’t know.

i ll open a new post an who need will contribute in to try get compensation from merck…
i’ll let u know everything when i exactly know everything and if he find something…everybody u 'll come here to italy.
i hope so!

#10

yestarday night i took a serenoa repens pill for prostate…i had a bad night,so anxiety and disturbed and… today it was really really,i mean really hard to get an erection with videoporn so i realized that cause was serenoa…don’t try it,i hope i can get back to the point whre i was yestarday .

Now i have confirmed the theory that we suffer from a 5 alfa reductasy deficienty and putting so much testo we want it ll never be recognised from receptors…(dht we have in our body now probably is due from 5ar tipe 1 working more to replace tipe 2) .
Ill speak about this to my doc and ask him some tests to find my theory .

if it was like this do u think it is possible to cure this situation?..and does ghb interferes with 5ar?..if ghb interferes with 5ar than that’s the reason people recovered with it.

#11

If you want more DHT, there are DHT creams and pills one can take… ie, Proviron (active ingredient: Mesterolone). You would of course need to be prescribed this if you want to take it under a doc’s supervision.

But taking DHT externally might cause Testosterone to drop due to negative feedback on the HTPA (which is actually a possible explanation as to why some of us had our T drop after coming off Finasteride – DHT rebounded skyhigh, and this told pituitary to drop T levels to compensate).

Really though, taking some Saw Palmetto does not confirm wether your weak erection is from 5AR1, 5AR2, or prostate issues… you would really need to undergo the above mentioned tests to get a proper diagnosis, ESPECIALLY if you are concerned about 5AR2 deficiency.

#12

tonight i had this dream…

like everyone knows,i think that 5ar in penis tissue and prostate tissue doesn’t work no more and so it doesn’t convert T in DHT in penis and prostate tissues,than this is my new question:

My dick can’t work no more cause this lack of dht in his tissue,what do you thing could happen if i put some DHT cream on my dick’s skin?

Doing like this i think i could add the DHT lack in my penis and probably 5 AR will feel it and could start working good again…it could be an input giving to 5AR to work again .

i don’t know if this is a crazy idea but for me it sounds good,putting some DHT on penis is like saying my body that DHT must be there and now there is not and maybe my body feeling this will restore this lack.
Let me know.

#13

i wrote a mail to the swedish laboratory that makes the test for the 5AR mutation and this is the reply:

"This is a clinical test performed by DNA sequensing the coding parts of SRD5A2 gene, The cost is € 710 if we get isolated DNA. If we get blood we charge €235 extra.

However, we only accept referrals from medical doctors and we only give results to health care personal. In the referral we need some basic clinical data.

Sincerely "

#14

please someone reply to me about adding dht on my penis,cuold it be a good idea to let dht get in penis like it should …(if 5ar theory is the problem) .

#15

Taking external DHT may lower Testosterone levels.

propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1421

Up to you if you want to try.

#16

ok thanks…i know it can do that but i mean that taking a real real little dht dose on penis on alternative days could stimulates conversion from T to DHT by 5 AR that is feeling the necessity of it…doing like this you can educate your body to understand what is right ( having more dht on penis that now there is not enought)… i think it could be a way ,i ll ask to doc cause i think no one can answer to this experiment… but thank you MEW.