Unable to feel tired

Symptoms
#23

well since this particular relapse of insomnia which started at the end of December - I was only taking Amitriptyline for months which had been great - 7 hours sleep a night, mood boots and relief of chronic tension headaches.
Then in December I noticed sleep getting worse and it started dropping down to 3 - 4 hours a night and then the tinnitus started picking up again…like the electric drill buzz/ high pitch pulse sound, just awful .
I had 2 nights back to back of 0 hours sleep in December and after that dropped the Amitrypline (not that I particularly believe that caused insomnia , it did the opposite for months, it was a case of last in first out so I dropped it)
Dr then suggested Pregabalin so I tried that on and off since then …it made me feel great the following day but could still only get 1 - 2 hours sleep with it. this went on for a while and I just couldn’t take any more this week so I have used Zopiclone again for the past couple of nights and this time my plan is to switch over to herbal/ supplements.
Magnesium usually brings on feelings of tiredness for me so I have bought some Floradix liquid magnesium to take around 9pm and then the main problem I have is sleep onset so which in the past CBD oil has helped me fall asleep faster…so my plan is use the liquid magnesium at 9pm and then around lights out at 11:30 have a couple of sprays of CBD oil and I hope the combination should do the trick. If I can get 5 hours broken sleep then thats good for me , thats the desperate state im in with this thing!!

Id be willing to try the NAC though, does the glutathione work on GABA A receptor ? how long did it take to kick in?

Thanks for your reply btw

#24

I also have been diagnosed with ADD/ADHD (although it is more ADD in my case). What really helps me with sleep is making sure I have used up a lot of energy during the day so that I’m actually tired in the evening. Right now with my work from home ‘office job’ this is a bit harder and I also tend to go to bed way too late. I think it will help your sleeping pattern by making sure you exhaust yourself during the day.

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#25

Glutathione induces GABA release through P2X7R activation on Müller glia

Oxidized glutathione promotes sleep in rabbits

How Does Glutathione Benefit Sleep?

Current research has suggested that more glutathione is produced when the body is asleep than during any other time. In addition, there is evidence of a link between higher glutathione levels and better sleep. This creates a cyclical effect of sorts:

It has been shown in numerous animal studies that sleep deprivation results in a significant reduction in glutathione levels . In 2012, the Progress in Neuro-Psychopharmacology and Biological Psychiatry journal published a study that investigated the effects of primary insomnia, or insomnia disorder, on certain biomarkers of oxidative stress.

The healthy participants and patients with primary insomnia had their levels of glutathione, GPx activity, and malondialdehyde , a biomarker of oxidative stress in the body, measured.

It was shown that the patients with primary insomnia had higher levels of malondialdehyde, and significantly lower levels of GPx activity .

The researchers concluded that sleep is crucial in decreasing oxidative stress .

#26

Prior to PFS I’m certain there is no way taking the blend of amino acids and SAMe that I recently took would have made me stay up for 9 days and messed up my sleep for 2 months. My sleep is still not back to regular baseline but I have found the right supplements for my own case that substantially helped my relapse sleep issues. All those amino acids probably did to me was adjust neurotransmitter levels because they are all predecessors of amino acids. I seen the adjustments the amino acids made on before and after urine neurotransmitter testing.

#27

Agreed, I was sleeping a lot better when I was going to the gym last year, but gyms here are sadly closed due to COVID. I’ve been trying to go for walks on an evening to help use up energy as well as calm my mind.

By any chance are you on medication for your ADD/ADHD? I’m not medicated and feeling apprehensive about starting medication, I think I’ll opt for therapy instead. PFS sufferers seem to get mixed reactions from ADHD meds from what I’ve seen scrolling through this forum.

#28

No haven’t been on any medication for a while. I quit everything when I got finasteride side effects.

I was briefly on dextroamphetamine in the past. Eventually I quit dex and gradually started bupropion (for adhd + depression). Then when I quit the bupropion I was prescribed ‘standard’ methylphenidate, which I picked up at the pharmacy but never took.

Personally, I prefer to accept the fact that I am not always equally capable of concentration and discipline and try to make it work for myself naturally with good pacing and a little occasional help from my coach, instead of being dependant on psychoactive meds and still make the same mistakes.

I’m not saying you should do the same.
But do careful research what meds you would take for ADHD if you’re going to take any. I don’t really remember having sides on dex, but it could potentially adversely affect you and I definitely had some side effects with bupropion. I would personally not recommend bupropion to anyone who has trouble sleeping.

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#29

Minerals not vitamins.

#30

ZMA generally helps with sleep though can give vivid dreams. Even zinc on its own helps a lot, try a small dose. It blocks conversion of dopamine to norepinephrine, which is associated with awakeness

#31

I’ll give it a shot when I’m feeling better.
I’m currently on an upward trajectory, and I don’t want to sabotage it.

THanks!

#33

interesting that zinc blocks conversion of dopamine to norepinephrine. My over all amounts of dopamine increased from taking amino acid dopamine predecessor’s. The normal trajectory for more dopamine is usually converting to more norepinephrine. I found it interesting that in spite of having more dopamine in my follow up urine neurotransmitter test my norepinephrine did not also increase…

I wonder if excitatory neurotransmitters such as norepinephrine are generally responsible for increased sexual function and that if my body is keeping excitatory neurotransmitters low to “match” possibly intolerant GABA receptors or for another reason. Just an observation/theory and possible path to explore further in my own case and or for others to possibly explore future for their own cases if they think the theory sounds logical.

#34

What supplement brand did you take?

#35

I only take about 1/3 of a tablet but if I need more then i take it

#36

Cyproheptadine has some side effects (lowers Dopamine, quite sedating) but about 0.25mg can help with sleep at night but only if irregularly taken

#37

Same with me…exactly the same! I can exercise as early as 0500 or 0600 but I still have a challenge staying asleep

#38

The latest multi minerals I’ve taken are from Biotics. I’ll try to find the few brands nutritionists trust because they don’t use synthetic ingredients but they’re usually over $50 for a bottle of anything. Stay away from the cheap options available at Vitamin Shoppe, CVS, Walgreens, Whole Foods and other supermarkets. Biotics, Solgar, Swanson, Thorne, those are pretty good brands. For minerals the best products I found were from small companies I’d never heard of. Unfortunately most chains don’t carry those, only private supplement stores. When you’re buying minerals check what type of magnesium they use. If it’s magnesium oxide then don’t buy that brand because they use the cheapest ingredients.

#39

Hmmm, I think a few people crashed on zinc.

I’ll try out something like chamomile tea first.