Side effects determined by balding characteristics?

General Discussion
#1

I have done some investigation into Propecia’s studies recently and have come across something that may be significant. It seems that in nearly all of the trials, the men who participated almost exclusively had hair loss at the crown.

My question therefore is, if side effects are caused by a certain hormonal profile, could there be any bias in studies where most of the men only have balding at the crown? Perhaps being predisposed to such a balding pattern makes you more likely to be immune to side effects from taking Propecia.

In my case it makes sense, since I have prolonged side effects after discontinuing finasteride treatment and only have recesson at the hairline, but what about everybody else?

#2

Good question.

Genetics are certainly involved in the balding process, and in reaction to Finasteride.

viewtopic.php?p=16016#p16016

This company tests for genetic response to Finasteride based on androgen receptor CAG repeats.
hairdx.com

#3

It’s certainly something that has crossed my mind too. I had very fine hair that I got from my mom and my hairline began receding, which led to me taking Propecia. I never started balding uptop.

#4

+1 hair loss at crown

#5

Post the source (I doubt you can).

Btw; I had an alarming diffuse hairloss all over the top.

#6

I was diffuse thinning but temples going faster than anywhere else

#7

I was relatively unaffected at the crown, fwiw. Mine was a temple thing, where the hair was getting much thinner at the temples.

#8

I still have cover on crown (thinning for sure, but cover) but by far the worst of my hair loss was from receding hairline as well.

#9

I wonder if I can create a poll and try to get some basic data on this…

#10

Doubt no longer.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9777765 (Merck Research Laboratories)
Mentions only vertex balding.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22325459(Duke University)
Only men with vertex balding, which they even specify as a limitation of the study. “These studies enrolled men with vertex pattern hair loss; therefore, the findings may not be extrapolated to men with predominantly anterior/mid scalp, frontal, or temporal hair loss.”

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9951956 (New Zealand)
The participants were all men with vertex thinning only once again.

#11

My 23&me test results says that genetically, I have a decreased chance of baldness. I have wondered if that could have anything to do with the adverse effects.

#12

So how do you know that any of these men “had hairloss exclusively at the crown”? The studies concentrated on the results of Finasteride on vertex balding, they dont say thats the only place these chaps where going bald. My doubt has been proved correct.

Anyway, isnt ‘raised hairline’ the most common type? Is this different from the hairloss of most men that use Fin safely?

#13

My point is that if hair loss progresses to the crown it is more aggressive and advanced, which may mean such men have different hormonal levels to men with relatively minor balding. Yes hairline balding is the most common, since it tends to start there, but you seem to miss my point about variations in hormone levels dictating the type and rate of balding and whether that has any bearing on whether men suffer side effects when taking Propecia.

At this stage it’s just a hypothesis.

#14

It’s plausible. I have minor hair loss and noticed serious side effects within 2 months of taking finasteride. According to some the diehard Propecia fans, I’m meant to believe I’m just the unlucky 2%, but I’m extremely suspicious. There has to be more to this.

#15

You said men in the studies had “exclusive” and “only” hairloss at the crown. But there is no evidence for this, so Im correcting you before that disinformation forms part of the canon.

Far far less than 2% get permanent sides Im afraid. More like 1-1000 (so its a bit unlikely they all share the same ‘balding characteristic’!!)
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=6439

#16

If a study says the participants had hair loss at the vertex, then I think it’s reasonable to assume that men with hair loss limited to the hairline ONLY were not included. I don’t know why this is so hard to understand. Can you try to read my posts through a few times until it sinks in? Getting frustrated with repeating myself. It’s bad enough at other forums without dealing with it here too.

#17

…

You said men in the studies had “exclusive” and “only” hairloss at the crown. But there is no evidence for this otherwise the studies you rely on would have said so. So I corrected you.

Now you are guessing men with only ‘raised hairline’ might of been excluded from all studies if they had no vertex balding. Maybe. But thats different to what you had said originally since a man with vertex loss can (or according to your other posts WILL) also have a raised hairline.

So what you should have said was “Men with exclusive hairline recession may not have been included in studies - is it these men that are more prone to sides?”. It is a subtle point, so maybe thats why you are confused/frustrated. I hope I have explained it.

…

I also dont know why its so important that there must be ‘more’ people with sides.

#18

If a drug treated balding at the crown better than it treated hairline recession, doesn’t it make sense that to raise the success rate as high as possible a trial would only focus on the crown?

#19

Yes that’s exactly what I meant. As you said it’s a very subtle point. I’m usually quite articulate but you made made my point better than I did originally.

I don’t think it’s important that there must be “more” men with sides; it’s important that we’re clear how many men get sides. There is no consensus in the studies that have been performed - they range anywhere from 2% up to 7%, which is big margin of error in my opinion. Also, I don’t believe those percentages represent reality, as far as I’ve witnessed both in my personal life and what I’ve seen on forums.

#20

Yes, of course, but if men with hair loss limited to the hair line are excluded from the trials, then it means there is potentially a methological flaw if it turns out that those men are more susceptible to side effects.

It’s only a theory at this point.