One theory I have come up with regards time for recovery, off propecia.

[A75_Deal_Breaker]

Guys, hope all is getting better. I have a theory , which may easily be torn down, but I thought I would share it with you, and get some feedback.

In regards to how long it takes one propecia pill to wear off, Iv heard it takes up to 5- 7 days, to leave the body, elsewhere Iv heard it may take up to 14 days.

If the idea of accumulation holds any water, and of course the different physiologies of individuals.

And in light of how long it takes some to partially recover.

Hope you guys see where I’m going with this…here goes.

 1) Say we use the 7 day time period for the drug to leave our system.

 2) And in light of the idea of accumulation, due say for different physiologies, or maybe not (nevertheless).

 3) Accordingly If one such as myself took 120 pills: 120 x 7 equals the days it would take to completely leave the body, hence 120 x 7 = 840 days divided by 365 = 2.3 years to leave the body.

 4) or for example if we use the larger time span for each pill to leave the body,say 14 days, we would have 120 x 14 = 1680 divided by 365 = 4.6 years to leave the body.

So regardless of the 12 month, Merck states for everything to come back to normal, which I must disregard since im approaching 11 months as im getting worst, as other here are as well.

My next reasonable expected date of recover will be at least 2.3 years from the date I came off the drug. It definitely offers hope founded on substance, even though it may not be true. And In this case Im half way towards recovery and maybe thats why I’m feeling the worst now at approx 11 months, the mid way point. Only a guess guys so please try not to bash me too hard, since were all in limbo at this point.

I hope I’m right because if so then we would have found the true formula for the time period needed to recover, at least for those who suffer beyond the 12 month period stated by the Merck, if recovery is not beyond some of us.

I definitely believe its something to hold on to. What do you guys think?

And guys please don’t bring to me the notion that others have recovered within the 12 months or so, because I’ve already mentioned this theory to be only applicable for those with a physiology that responds as so and the idea of accumulation which other physiologies would not be affected by.

[rzron2]

nice theory,
ive been diagnosed with Gilberts disease.

Here is a quote:

Gilbert’s syndrome also reduces the liver’s ability to detoxify certain drugs. For example, Gilbert’s syndrome is associated with severe diarrhea and neutropenia in patients who are treated with irinotecan, which is metabolized by UGT1A1.[9]

so pretty much if i take a small dose of some medication it accumulates in my system and takes forever to leave.

I wonder if anyone else might have this here???
You can check your blood tests and if you have elevated bilirubin this might be you >> I was over the range with this test.

Might explain a bit why i was so tired. I am Month 9th off Pro More days feeling better than bad.

Heres the site for more info.
http://gilbertssyndrome.com/

[Mew]

Interesting that you’ve been diagnosed with Gilbert’s Syndrome, but I wouldn’t worry too much about it at this stage – although, if it were present during Finasteride use – which according to the below it would have to be, since it’s an inherited gene – then perhaps it had an effect on reducing your metabolism of the drug at the time.

mayoclinic.com/health/gilber … DSECTION=8

Because Gilbert syndrome is essentially a mild, harmless condition, it doesn’t require treatment. The level of jaundice associated with Gilbert syndrome is typically harmless as well, and goes away on its own.

If you have Gilbert syndrome, you don’t typically need long-term monitoring of your condition or repeat blood tests. But consult your doctor if you notice worsening jaundice or other symptoms.

Possible symptoms
You may experience episodes of:

Fatigue
Weakness
Abdominal pain
However, it’s not known if Gilbert syndrome actually causes such symptoms, or if they’re related to stress or other conditions.

Causes
If you have Gilbert syndrome, you have inherited an abnormal gene that controls the enzyme that helps break down bilirubin. Bilirubin is a yellowish pigment and is a normal waste product from the breakdown of old red blood cells. Bilirubin travels through your bloodstream to the liver. Normally an enzyme in liver cells breaks down the bilirubin and removes it from the bloodstream. The bilirubin passes from the liver into the intestines with bile. It’s then excreted in stool. A small amount of bilirubin remains in the blood.

When you have Gilbert syndrome, you have a lower level of the enzyme that breaks down bilirubin. Consequently, excessive amounts of a form of bilirubin called unconjugated bilirubin can build up in your blood.

Risk factors
Other than the chance of inheriting abnormal genes, there are no known risk factors that increase the likelihood that you’ll get Gilbert syndrome.

More side effects with certain medications
The low level of the bilirubin-processing enzyme may cause increased side effects with certain medications because this enzyme helps eliminate these medications. In particular, irinotecan (Camptosar), a medication used to treat colon cancer, can reach toxic levels if you have Gilbert syndrome, causing severe diarrhea. Because of this potential effect with certain medications, talk to your doctor before taking any new medications if you have Gilbert syndrome.

Prevention
Gilbert syndrome is an inherited genetic disorder. Getting the disorder isn’t related to lifestyle habits or environment.
The only way to theoretically prevent the condition is to keep parents from passing the abnormal gene that causes it on to their children. But more than half the people in the general population carry one copy of this abnormal gene, making it very common. If two people with this abnormal gene have a child, they may pass along the genetic defect that causes Gilbert syndrome — but not always. Not everyone who has two copies of this abnormal gene gets Gilbert syndrome. This means you may have the condition without a family history of it. In contrast, everyone with Gilbert syndrome does have two copies of this abnormal gene.

[B_P]

Actually, that’s not an entirely bad idea. Propecia is a lipophilic (fat-soluble) drug, which means theoretically it could accumulate in fat tissue over time. So even after you stop taking the drug, your body fat basically could act as a “slow-release” reservoir for the drug, and the stored drug could slowly leach out of your fat cells over a long period of time. This is not a new idea; there has been discussion in the medical/scientific community about the possibility of other lipophilic toxins acting in a similar manner (maybe DDT was one? can’t remember for sure). I wonder if weight loss (lowering your body fat percentage) would help “detox”? Among other benefits, fat loss should also reduce peripheral estrogen production as well, since fat cells contain the enzyme (aromatase) that makes estrogen from testosterone.

[The_Ruffneck]

@razorxtr

nice theory,
ive been diagnosed with Gilberts disease.

Here is a quote:

Gilbert’s syndrome also reduces the liver’s ability to detoxify certain drugs. For example, Gilbert’s syndrome is associated with severe diarrhea and neutropenia in patients who are treated with irinotecan, which is metabolized by UGT1A1.[9]

so pretty much if i take a small dose of some medication it accumulates in my system and takes forever to leave.

I wonder if anyone else might have this here???

what were your symptoms?
i woke up with white coated tongue and bad breath everyday , bloodshot eyes , GI disturbances , brain fog , skin rash
i stopped 5% minox about a week ago to support my liver just in case

[rzron2]

Yes the brain fog, I am battling with Very low cortisol and high estradiol
Days are good on and off.

[tim1911]

This is from gilbert’ssyndrome.com

Most Commonly Reported Symptoms

From the following, here are the most common symptoms:

Frequently Reported: fatigue, tiredness, brain fog, headaches, poor memory, dizziness, depression, irritability, anxiety, nausea, loss of appetite, irritable bowel syndrome (IBS), stomach pain & cramping, liver/gallbladder pain, abdominal pain, tremors, itchiness, jaundice

Commonly Reported: insomnia, difficulty concentrating, panic attacks, hypoglycemic reaction to foods, intolerance to carbs, food intolerances, alcohol intolerance, loose stools / diarrhea, abdominal bloating or swelling, breathlessness or labored breathing, heart palpitations, aching muscles / body ache, joint pain, numbness & tingling, weakness, chemical sensitivity, weight loss, lump in the throat, feeling constantly sick

Sometimes Reported: difficulty finding the right words, feeling drunk, vomiting, intolerance to fatty foods, strong hangovers, acid reflux, excessive thirst, chest pain, muscle twitches, cold hands and feet, environmental allergies, swollen lymph nodes, toxic feeling, bitter or metallic taste in the mouth, eye pain

Occasionally Reported: waking panic attack, mood swings, feeling antisocial, intolerance to drugs, constipation, pale stools, indigestion, back pain, dry skin, feeling cold, low body temperature, pale skin, low weight, night sweats, excessive sweating, poor immune system, sore or dry throat, light sensitivity, bloodshot eyes

The bold ones are common to me

jaundice this becoming more noticable to me, sometimes my skin is more red aswell. To put it basic, my skin isnt its normal colour post fin.

This is common in 5-10% of caucasion population.
I can think of 2 guys that have high bilburin on this site, maybe this condition has something to do with ours. If not it strongly suggests the liver is a factor in this.

[Mikey]

To the thread starter A75 Deal Breaker, it’s been over 2.3years since you posted this theory…

Are you recovered?

[keepup]

I took about 100 Propecia pills 7 years ago and nothing has changed. I am still suffering from the same side effects while on Propecia (ED, lack of sensation, reduced ejaculate, no libido etc.)

[Mens_Rea]

keep did u try detox your liver?

[m_81]

Sorry, none of these theories works.

Theory 1:

Accordingly If one such as myself took 120 pills: 120 x 7 equals the days it would take to completely leave the body, hence 120 x 7 = 840 days divided by 365 = 2.3 years to leave the body.

I took 4 pills a year ago, and there are people on the board who took fewer pills longer time ago, just FYI…

Theory 2:

so pretty much if i take a small dose of some medication it accumulates in my system and takes forever to leave.

If this was the problem, and fin was still in our system, we all would have low serum DHT, but that is not the case. In fact, many sufferers, me included, have over the top values of serum DHT.

[tim1911]

Yeah this “formula” to work out how long it takes fin to leave the body is the most circus here.

Maybe i should have started a new thread in regards of gilbert’s disease.

[tim1911]

@m_81

If this was the problem, and fin was still in our system, we all would have low serum DHT, but that is not the case. In fact, many sufferers, me included, have over the top values of serum DHT.

So your saying we can also rule out 5ar2 deficiency?

[m_81]

@tim1911983

@m_81

If this was the problem, and fin was still in our system, we all would have low serum DHT, but that is not the case. In fact, many sufferers, me included, have over the top values of serum DHT.

So your saying we can also rule out 5ar2 deficiency?

Extremely few people get some benefit by increasing their T or DHT. If 5ar2 was the problem for all, then people wouldn’t lose their hair, no? Furthermore, taking DHT (eg. proviron) would solve our problems, but it doesn’t. Finally, 5ar2 deficiency doesn’t explain muscle wasting – muscles are mediated by T, not DHT. For more arguments and references to what I wrote, take a look at this thread: http://www.propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=3251

[keepup]

Colin297, how can I detox my liver? Do you have any advice?

[wlan]

i can get muscled pretty easily. but my penis is numb and lifeless, and i don’t have any muscle waste.