Using this thread to document.
I’m experiencing a misery inhuman in its intensity. I feel so bad I feel like I’m going to PUKE. Nausea sits at the back of my throat when it’s at its worst.
Suicide isn’t a guaranteed way out, a lot of people fail when they attempt it and end up in worse pain than before. There’s no sure way to commit suicide.
It’s really not worth it to even try it.
I know, that’s what scares me. I don’t even want to die but this mental pain is so hard, it often becomes intolerable.
If you feel really that bad I cant believe you dont even try some things. When i was at my worst 2 years ago i couldnt accept the situation and ordered progesterone cream and tribulus.
Dont sit on your ass all day and cry. Do something to get better.
If you are really suicidal you would try stuff and take risks.
Yeah I assumed you knew a little bit about it when you stated the shotgun fact. But nobody really knows which part of the brain to hit and shooting it yourself is just asking for trouble, you could end up in the hospital alive with a hole in your head in agony. Short of asking someone to shoot you a few times, which nobody would agree to, this option is a definite no.
Assisted suicide is a joke too, doctors have no idea how much fentanyl to give you, they think a certain dose is lethal but you have no way knowing if you’re gonna throw it up before you die. Again you could easily end up in the hospital with damaged organs.
Do you think I’d do a ten day water fast for the fun of it? I haven’t sat on my ass. I’m doing a comprehensive parasitology stool test though I doubt it will reveal anything. Unless someone can point out something which successfully treats this shocking depression and anhedonia. Does progesterone and tribulus help with that? Mirtazepine isn’t helping though it is mercifully allowing for eight hours sleep at least.
Also, because my symptoms are so wide ranging and severe, trying some things might put me in an even worse position. I am desperately trying to hold on here.
Prog and tribulus safed my life. It doesnt work for everyone, but if youre a bit lucky it could increase your baseline from 0 to 50% within weeks. I was at 0. Had nothing to lose.
If you want details there’s a thread here about progesterone.
2 Likes
From which city are you Invictus? im german too
Can you tell me how you rate your situation before and after the water fast, and what changed during and after? Thanks.
1 Like
Hi Tzinkman,
Extremely sorry to hear how bad of a position you are in right now.
Know that no one who is responding to you is exaggerating the number/rate of people with PFS who recover to a more tolerable state of existence within the first 6 months-year after crashing. I’ve been reading the stories of people with this condition for nearly 8 years now, and it is almost unanimous that a partial recovery happens in the first year. It’s more than simply getting accustomed to the changes. Our brains and bodies must adjust to compensate for what we lost, to some degree.
Please do whatever it takes to survive for the first year at least, by any means necessary.
1 Like
From then until now
In the period since then to now, I’ve had the crazy period where the room was slanting and it was mentally painful all day long to even be alive. During that period I started this thread and went on mirtazepine. I’m happy to say that the slanted room stuff has abated for the most part, I’m sleeping 8 hours uninterrupted most nights and I’ve regained a lot of the lost weight.
Crucially, I generally no longer get the head pressure/swelling after eating now.
In retrospect
As I started the fast during the first four weeks following cessation of the drug, It’s difficult to say how useful it was as some of the improvements could be attributed to the “DHT coming back online” that is said to happen anyway following discontinuation. I distinctly remember going through a puberty-like stage where I was almost hyper sexual, briefly, and my penis was hanging full when flaccid and was becoming erect without much provocation. I can say with certainty that it helped with the brain pressure and fog, naturally, as that was exacerbated by eating. I think it helped with depression also by giving me something to focus on but it’s very difficult to say if the fast itself was lifting depression.
You’ll notice a quite optimistic tone throughout some of the post fast period. A lot of that is due in part to my penis starting to work again. See, I thought that was the hardest part of pfs to recover from. I thought almost all people with pfs experience it the same way. I heard that the mental sides are the first to improve from. Because I could get an erection again, I assumed I would recover fairly quickly in the brain too. I still felt as though I had been hit around the head with a baseball bat, couldn’t play most video games and had vertigo type symptoms. But the fatigue had somehow lifted to the point I was able to go to the gym again and lift weights and I was focused on doing that plus eating organic chicken bone broths and generally trying to remain positive as I was still going through it not knowing what to expect, what was normal even within the scope of what pfs can be, if I would return to normal within 3 months of discontinuation of the drug (as some of the literature I’ve seen claims). At one point though, it dawned on me how really there’d been no change in how I was experiencing reality. My brain has been changed very profoundly and it’s almost impossible to describe it to somebody who has not experienced it.
tl;dr Summary
Situation before the fast was critically bad as it was the first ten days of pfs. During the fast I improved mentally, naturally, as eating was causing intense brain fog. The re-feed was probably the best period as I discovered I could get erections again and my fatigue lifted to the point I could go to the gym. However, since then, my penis has degraded more when flaccid, my fatigue has returned to a terrible degree and the depression has returned. It’s hard to attribute positive and negative things to the fast as it was done during the 30 days post cessation of the drug when negative symptoms are supposed to improve anyway. It’s possible it may have harmed me to only drink water during the initial crash period. However, It felt like it improved me enough at the time to the point where I’d consider fasting again at some point. If I do fast again, I will try to do 21 days.
1 Like
Fasting lowers androgens significantly, thats why it helped.
Instead of starving yourself to death and loosing all your muscles i would try progesterone cream or zinc to lower androgens again.
@milando: Hamburg.
1 Like
Likely. I would not agree with taking those antiandrogens in his fragile position, however. It’s easy to say “nothing to lose” after you had such an unusual response, invictus. He’s on his last legs by the sound of it. I responded extremely badly to zinc in that state.
lol.
Thanks for the detailed account.
How much zinc did you took? I only got positive effects from zinc when I took a mega dose (135mg) . If the dose is too low it could raise 5AR as you know.
Hi Tzinkman, so sorry to hear your story. Please try to quit the medicine, it’s hard but it’s a right way to help you to get well again. Try to do something to explore the world, I know it sounds like a bullshit, but it does help.
Thought I’d post my hormone readings from various blood tests. I have results from pre-finasteride use, days after the crash and the months since.
November 2017 (Months before ever touching finasteride)
Test result HORMONE PROFILE Report, Normal, No Further Action (Patient Informed)
Coded entry Serum total testosterone level 18.1 nmol/L
Coded entry Serum oestradiol level < 73 pmol/L
December 2018 (Months before ever touching finasteride)
Total Testosterone Level 20.6 nmol/L (7.6 - 30.4)
Free Test 0.325 nmol/L (0.3 - 1.0)
SHBG 54 nmol/L (16 - 55)
17 Beta Oestradiol 30.8 pmol/L (0 - 191.99)
March 2018 (Approx 7-10 days after “crashing” upon discontinuation of finasteride)
Test result HORMONE PROFILE Report, Unknown, No Further Action
Coded entry Serum testosterone level 11.3 nmol/L
Coded entry Serum sex hormone binding globulin level 57 nmol/L
April 2018 (Around six weeks after crashing)
June 2018
August 2018
My hormones have jumped around pretty wildly as you can see. The very low testosterone reading on the June test could plausibly be explained by the fact I was eating very little around the time the blood was drawn. What cannot be ignored is the rocketing of my estrogen levels. From having low levels prior to touching finasteride I now have consistently high readings. In fact, it’s increased by more than 50 pmol/L from the April and June readings, which were already very high for a 32 year old male with low body fat with previously low levels of estrogen.
@Tzinkman First, there is no need for suicide because things are going to get significantly better. I know because I was in a similar spot several years ago when I lost my job of 12 years and my girlfriend that I was in a long term relationship with. Fast forward and now I am making more money than I was and the girl I have been seeing now is much hotter, also (and most important) I feel significantly better.
I was one of the first people to do and recommend a full water fast, I ate nothing but pure water for two weeks and experienced the same benefits, especially upon refeeding. What people don’t understand about the fast is one of the reasons it makes you feel better is because you are not eating which takes burden off the body, but also its the absence of sugars and carbs and all the garbage they were eating before.
What I’m saying is you can bring back most of those cognitive effects and benefits of fasting by going on a ketogenic diet, low calorie diet and excluding all sugars, and all stimulants (anything with caffeine, sugar, preworkout boosters, tea etc).
Most people refuse to give up sugars and carbs in exchange for enhanced lifestyle, based on your 10 day water fast you probably have the drive to do it. For me it wasn’t even a question and I’ve been doing so for over five years. PM me if you have questions. How good you want to feel depends on how far you’re willing to go.
3 Likes
Thank you for trying to help me. My cognitive abilities have improved significantly in the six months since I crashed. It’s more a feeling that my entire reason for being has largely evaporated and I can go many days in a row where it feels painful to be alive. I’m willing to go far to try to improve my condition.
Hey dude, thanks for sharing your recommendations and for expressing support. I will have a look into those things. I’ve seen you posting on another site and glad to see you here mate, it’s important we congregate in the same place I think.
1 Like
Hey man, how are you doing today?
I can relate to the short usage, as I crashed after only two pills. Wanted to “try out” finasteride, what a mistake it was.
I have been on the cd nuts protocol for the past month and am seeing some pretty good improvements.