I’ll maybe update this better when I have a chance.
I just got this done today at a orthopedic type place for 50 bucks.
I’m very borderline for low Bone density.
Both my t and z score are - 0.4
Low Bone density is below -1
Lean Mass was also very poor.
They don’t recommend a follow-up scan for at least 6 months. That maybe gives an idea of turn around time if any real treatment was found or a sign of health going in the right or wrong direction.
It might be worth trying to do some exercise, running can improve bone density, I believe. It’s all to do with the impact and shock that travels through your bones as you exercise.
I’m not 100% on that, but it could be worth looking at.
Have you experienced any symptoms such as pain and/or height loss?
Yeah it seems muscle and bone building go hand and hand or can stimulate bone growth. I seem to be borderline in a few areas of health. The good news is there’s still time to do some things about it, the bad news would be as some of us get older the aging process itself might start to blur what’s going on and it might become harder to revert back to a healthy state.
I couldnt tell you about distinguishing between actual bone pain from lets say muscle pain, the nurse actually grabbed a rheumatologist real quick and he wasnt overly concerned being that im still in the green for now and that im not older or havent fractured anything.
Muscle weakness is more of a concern of mine atm, its more obvious from what used to be normal.
As far as height, no loss of height that i am aware of, im fairly tall at 6ft
When I talk about muscle weakness, im not just talking about muscles you work out at the gym, thats why I think there could be neurological and/or vascular involvement as well.
Ive had a few tests to back up both of those notions.
Ah I see. As said there seems to be a few routes you can go down in terms of treating this thankfully. Do you have any issues building muscle?
i’ve had problems putting on weight and muscle since Accutane. More recently say the past couple of years, my gut health has been a major issue. I dont expect to see alot of improvement in numerous symptoms until this gets resolved first and then go from there.
My gut is a huge issue too. Have you been tested for SIBO?
Well you just had the antibiotic post and the harms it can do, here’s more. This is one of the many reasons I continue to look at this. I have never tested for SIBO, but I did test positive for h pylori antibody, which I treated with triple therapy. Everytime I have been on an antimicrobial/antibiotic I couldnt wait to get off it. Its Probably not the answer, and could do more harm then good. One might consider Accutane as a Super Antibiotic that kills antibiotic resistant bacteria. Also notice mucus itself playing an important role here.
Antibiotic treatment, commonly prescribed for bacterial infections, depletes and subsequently causes long-term alterations in intestinal microbiota composition. Knowing the importance of the microbiome in the regulation of bone density, we investigated the effect of postantibiotic treatment on gut and bone health. Intestinal microbiome repopulation at 4-weeks postantibiotic treatment resulted in an increase in the Firmicutes:Bacteroidetes ratio, increased intestinal permeability, and notably reduced femoral trabecular bone volume (approximately 30%, p < 0.01). Treatment with a mucus supplement (a high-molecular-weight polymer, MDY-1001 [MDY]) prevented the postantibiotic-induced barrier break as well as bone loss, indicating a mechanistic link between increased intestinal permeability and bone loss. A link between the microbiome composition and bone density was demonstrated by supplementing the mice with probiotic bacteria. Specifically, Lactobacillus reuteri, but not Lactobacillus rhamnosus GG or nonpathogenic Escherichia coli, reduced the postantibiotic elevation of the Firmicutes:Bacteroidetes ratio and prevented femoral and vertebral trabecular bone loss. Consistent with causing bone loss, postantibiotic-induced dysbiosis decreased osteoblast and increased osteoclast activities, changes that were prevented by both L. reuteri and MDY. These data underscore the importance of microbial dysbiosis in the regulation of intestinal permeability and bone health, as well as identify L. reuteri and MDY as novel therapies for preventing these adverse effects.
You see I can make this look real simple. It would be nice if there was a simple solution and everything else eventually fell in line, but I dont know about that.(assume im wrong first)
Even in the slim chance that someone was right about an organic solution, in my case this would be 20 years late with the possible consequence of that.
This study illustrates a direct effect of retinoid administration on intestinal mucus physiology and, subsequently, on the progression of intestinal inflammation.
Interesting. Sorry to keep bombarding you with questions but which antibiotics have you tried and what symptoms did they cause?
Ive tried alot over the years, from amoxicillin to Levofloxacin (same class as cipro).
Cipro type antibiotics can have some very nasty sides, like tendon rupture. Then if you look at something like doxy, I believe intracranial hypertension can also be a rare side. In the case of something like SIBO, you knock something down with these drugs, its likely to come back anyways. If you could cherry pick what you were targeting with antibiotics, it might be helpful, but what and how are a big question in this field right now when it comes to the microbiome influencing health and disease.
My thought is though it’s more so something missing or greatly reduced. In this case bacteria that fights bacteria. Also the metabolites that bacteria produces that could be important to health. Something to plug in basically that could correct dysbiosis.
Thanks for the info man. I’ve been following your probiotic experiment and will continue to do so.
@guitarman01 Gut issues are a big issue, I remember you saying you got a very informed bacteria test done, was H plyori the end conclusion. Was there a reduction in vitamin A pruducing bacteria eg lactobacillus?
Regarding lean mass I think I’m the same. Which questions if there’s some sort of retinoic acid issue with muscles now.
I have never tested estrogen. I have tested T, Free T, and DHT I believe. I dont really focus on hormone blood levels because I know they can be in perfect range with people still having PFS (or problems). I dont really plan on going down the manipulation of hormones path at this point.
H. pylori was a separate antibody test, I tested positive so I figured I might as well treat it. It didnt really seem to help anything. Keep in mind though I did have some mild erosion of the lining of my stomach that h pylori can be related to. Gastritis. Very mild without bleeding.
Yes I did get that test done and its results,
Thanks for the info.
I haven’t had h. Pylori detected but I have been on alot of antibiotics, so it could have been there before. Wouldn’t be surprised.