The Harvard study should be published within the next few months. Hopefully that will clarify a lot of things.
Yeah sorry 19 to highjack the thread. I’ve been looking at supps that lower AR. Just important for me whether that has actually been confirmed. Penile tissue it looks like, but is that necessarily the case throughout the entire body?
Yes it is only from penile tissue. From the epithelial and stromal layers.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24959691/
So it is possible that increased AR expression leads to hypersensitivity of the receptor to low levels of androgens. When we take finasteride we likely increase AR expression. When we stop finasteride our bodies ramp up production of DHT and so you have lots of androgens binding to a hypersensitive receptor. It is possible that a post translational modification takes place after the receptor shutting down AR signalling and the activation of androgen responsive genes. This idea would explain why people have only a minimal response to androgens and even perhaps a negative response.
Normally yes increased androgen receptor would lead to more androgen activity. But we modulated things when we took the drug.
I also want to add forskolin and Vitamin E both affect AR too. Forskolin affects ligand binding though so affects the binding of testosterone to receptor. This is likely not a good idea.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12032296
So in summary these things affect the receptor.
Selenium,
DIM,
Milk thistle
Vitamin A
Resveratrol
Vitamin E
Forskolin (probably avoid this one)
Worth noting that cdnuts took Resveratrol as a PCT after AndroHard.
Just a bit wary as these things have negative impact on libido for healthy people. It’s quite a leap of faith to actively look to lowering AR expression, maybe it could help but until we fully understand it may leave us worse off.
Libido is the least of my worries. If I couid sleep well at night, reduce fatigue, and eliminate that unprovoked anxiety, Id be a happy man while science catches up to this. Yeah sorry for the tangent but it is all very confusing. Sounds like increasing or decreasing AR expression are both questionable moves. I’m at the point where I’m ready to add to the blunders of home brew and give a random herb a shot that is known lower AR expression and do some other things seemingly beneficial. So 19 you aw saying that we reconfigured our bodies so that our current AR expression operates opposite to how it normally would. So that means jury is stop out how manipulating them at this point would make us feel?
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Tanshinones, phytochemicals derived from a Chinese medicinal plant (danshen a.k.a. red sage), inhibit nuclear translocation of AR in the presence on androgens:
Y. Zhang, S.-H. Won, C. Jiang, H.-J. Lee, S.-J. Jeong, E.-O. Lee, J. Zhang, M. Ye, S.-H. Kim, and J. Lü, “Tanshinones from Chinese Medicinal Herb Danshen (Salvia miltiorrhiza Bunge) Suppress Prostate Cancer Growth and Androgen Receptor Signaling,” Pharm Res, vol. 29, no. 6, pp. 1595–1608, Jan. 2012.
http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11095-012-0670-3
Related discussion on tanshinones:
http://www.mdpi.com/1422-0067/13/10/13621/htm#b258-ijms-13-13621
Sounds like an MOA that could help with PFS, but I’m hedging my bets until the research is published.
My plan is to reduce AR and then keep testosterone in high normal range.
It is true there is potential for doing this to make you worse. Some might feel more comfortable waiting.
It is possible for example unless you hit the mechanism by which things are overexpressed you could make things worse.
I’m gonna try a few of them. Resveratrol in the past did seem to increase testosterone levels too but it worsened my brain fog. I’m gonna retry it with progesterone in short bursts to help with the fog.
Good luck with the protocol. But it hasn’t been established yet that AR is ovrrexpressed all throughut the body, has it?
minoxidil/rogaine downregulates AR s. which we have high after PFS.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4039155/
Amazing. We could save our hair and get rid of PFS at the same time.
Just to warn that people have experienced adverse reactions to minoxidil.
Hi 19, great posts, and good luck with the protocol. Do let us know what you are trying and how you are doing.
So i can say for sure that resveratrol decreases androgen receptor signalling and expression further as regular ingestion of high doses (as it has a half life of 2-5 hrs on repeated dosing) caused an overall decline in androgen related overall phenotypic expression. This led to a crash. I stopped them all 5 days ago and now i’m gonna wait to see what my body does.
I am hoping it bounces back to a better point than previous. Whenever in the past i have bounced back it takes about 2 weeks to do so.
19, Any updates on this?
May want to consider this part in the Discussion section from the link above…
Finasteride blocks 5ar, so I thought it interesting to find minoxidil can increase it.
BTW, I use minoxidil twice a day.
Very interesting, how does it combat hairloss tho?
19 any news on this?
any update? i took 500mg resveratrol today
anyone knows how 19 is doing these days?
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Any user tried downregulating AR? What was the result?