Oneday's PCT to Recovery (Correcting HPTA with Nolvadex and hCG)

I saw this in one of the recoveries topics
http://www.propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=537

Based on reading meso-rx.com, I found a posting about aromatase inhibitors (AI) b/c i was interested in trying AI to block the conversion of TESTOS/DHT into estradiol, but decided against it when i read this posting. It seems that once you stop the aromatase inhibitor that it causes a complete HPTA stall then you’ll have to start your pct all over again. READ BELOW

http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/steroid-forum/want-do-pct-right-134248858.html#post518781

van-man on Meso
Senior Member

Think about it, ppl took finasteride (5ar Inhibitor) to block conversion of testosterone to dht, and now, ppl want to take Arimidex (Aromatase Inhibitor) to block conversion of androgen into estrodiol… i’m sorry, but we fucked up once before with FIN and don’t think about locking up the natural enzyme function is a quick fix to give yourself more free testosterone. I honestly believe that FIN stalled our HPTA and using FIN’s cousin Arimidex will just do the same, and you’ll just be fucked up for a long time. I talked to solonjk over skype and he told me that doctors recommended that he took CIPRO based on his doctors advise, and it gave him yr long headaches and floaters in his eye. I use to watch X-FILES when i was young and the show’s motto was TRUST NO ONE.

My point is that doctors don’t always know what they are talking about and it is better that you consult with a person who’s tried it, which is why i go to steroid forums. You’ll find pragmatist, overzealous, or novice individuals that experiment with these type of drugs, and you can ask about the outcome. I find that steroid users over on the other forum are more active with their postings and when u send a private message, they get back to you unlike here. This is a great forum and don’t want to knock it, but there are horrendous users probably because you feel depressed and don’t want to think about your problems, but don’t leave us stranded. Or you are completely cured and decided that you don’t need this site no more b/c that is fucked up and we rely on your postings to get better ourselves. I feel sorry for myself too but I’m not going to stop trying and if i’m cured then i’ll answer any questions i know. Just believe that a cure is out there and you just need to be a little more active in your approach. So don’t give up!

Wednesday, December 31, 2008

Today is day 5 of my pct protocol and yesterday I took 250 iu hCG in my right butt cheek and nolva @ 12:30am (i was suppose to take the pct @10pm but I was typing all night and lost track of time). I didn’t sleep well yesterday b/c circadian rhythm is much attuned lately ever since I took hCG and nolvadex. Every weekend I wake up at 5:30am to go to work and on my off days I still wake up at 5:30am but go back to sleep with brief episodes of awakenings. Prior to PCT, I would never have a compeling desire to wake up at 5:30 and just would sleep through it. It is tolerable and I’m not going to stress about it.

When I woke up this morning, there was a mild morning erection and balls seem maybe 1-2% smaller, but it is a 48% improvement since I’ve started this PCT. At first, I thought that the hcg I used were deteriorating and may have to mix another vial. I noticed that my balls get bigger on the off days when I’m not taking hcg, so I’ll wait till tomorrow for results. Here are links about how long HCG will last:

HCG vial in fridge
http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/steroid-forum/hcg-vial-in-fridge-134252999.html
HCG out of refrigerator
http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/mens-health-forum/hcg-out-of-refrigerator-134238471.html

Sure, I had thoughts about jacking up the dosage of hcG b/c I didn’t see any results, but I had to calm myself down. C’mon it is only 5 days since I began this protocol, so I want to think with logic and not with my balls. Haha. Also I thought that maybe shooting hcg into my butt cheek could have been a reason why it was ineffective but like I said, I’m going to calm down and wait.

It has been 2 yrs since coming off of propecia and I don’t really remember the size of my balls prefinasteride, so there’s nothing to compare it to. It may be possible that they are back to their normal size and will need to rely on lab test to determine if there’s an increase in testosterone.

In a prior posting, I mentioned that I had headaches and hip pain, and have not had those symptoms today. I don’t feel any emotion side effects from this PCT protocol, unless you consider happiness a side effect.

Semen quality has improved lately and it is not as watery as it used to be. Orgasms seems muted and not as pleasurable, maybe it is a direct side effect of nolva. As for erection strength, I’m going to say that erections are stronger under this protocol then without it.

Today I will be taking just nolvadex @10pm.

Thurday, January 1, 2009

Keeping a journal like this is a pain, but it is part of the healing process. It serves as documentation and a audit trail for me and others to review.

So, this is day 6 and I noticed that my nocturnal erections are weaker than usual (prior to pct) but they are more frequent and consistent throughout the night. Every time I wake up from my sleep i notice that I’m erected. This seems natural b/c we’re suppose to get erections during REM sleep, so far, my dreams are not sexually explicit (i wish it was tho b/c i haven’t had a wet dream in 3 yrs) and they are just the typical dreams about work, or about day to day stuff, but i have been dreaming about a female co worker (she’s married) lately.

First thing this morning, i woke up i felt my ball size and it was firm. i think the lower half of my testes are filling in. I’m going to bump up the dosage of hcg to 300 iu hcg and pump it into my thigh sub q bc i think i get better results that way. I’m going to go out and buy some 1000 iu Vitamin E to enhance the affects of hcg on the testicles (Read about this combo by forum users and Anthony Roberts).

After checking out the balls, i decided to test myself with a little youporn.com to see if there has been any improvement between visual stimulation and arousal. Prior to pct, there were days where visual stimulation was not enough and i had to assist it with physcial stimulation to get excited. Well, just watching some milf got it going and mr jones went from flaccid to who is yo DADDY. It was completely erect 90% and lasted for 10-15 minutes. Over the past few days, the structure of my dick looked healthy. It doesn’t look wrinklely, prune like, or scared like it has during the past few years and my gential skin was smooth, as well as relaxed.

Just as a follow up, I don’t have anymore headaches and maybe the headaches were a temporary side effect of my body getting use to nolvadex. Also, I haven’t gotten any left hip pain since that day i complained about it. I hope that it doesn’t come back.

Tonight i will be taking vitamin e, hcg, and nolvadex at 10:30pm.

Happy Years People. I hope that you have a joyful new beginning, along with continued success throughout the year. oneday

Friday, January 2, 2009

This is the 7th day of the PCT and there are 49 days remaining. I had my share of fuck ups with this protocol and one of them is using needles. i was trying to inject HCG into my thigh sub q while standing. i lifted my leg up (picture a Captain Morgan stance), so i was injecting the hcg in the thigh then my leg got tired. when you try this, you’ll notice that you can’t just push the plunger rapidly b/c your body can only accept so much at a time. It should take about 30-60 secs for 0.5-1 cc respectively for the injection. So my leg was getting tired and couldn’t hold that position anymore then my leg dipped and needle came out. My dilemma was do i stab the need back in or reload a fresh needle with fresh hcg. I decided to be safe than sorry and went with the fresh hcg and syringe. For ppl out there, you already have issues with propecia and you don’t need to introduce more issues into your life b/c of a non sterile syringe. So sterilty is paramount and don’t fuck this up. I had .28 cc left in the old syringe and just added fresh .28 cc of hcg from the sterile vile into a fresh syringe. Since i used my right leg already, i pinched some skin from my left leg while sitting down this time and injected the fluid sub q.

here was my calculation for hcg:

(how much I want to take/size of ampule) x bateriostatic water ml = number of cc to inject

( 300 IU / 2500 IU ) x 4 ml = 0.48 cc

I didn’t mix a fresh batch and this calculation was based on how much I mixed the batch originally. The amount of 2500 IU was the size of the ampule (glass bottle of powder hcg) and the 4 ml is the bateriostatic water i used. I didn’t add any fresh fluid or powder to the batch and i had to recalculate b/c i increased my dosage from 250 IU to 300 IU and you have to figure out how many cc are you suppose to take. For a dosage of 300 IU, i took 0.48 cc this at 11:30pm

This morning I was erected again and throughout the night, and i can definitely get use to this. Now i almost expect to have an erection every morning, but one thing that is surprising is that after i had my 4am pee session, i was still erected. So i wake up at 9am and go through my routine which testing out my testicular size. there was no improvement in size, but wanted to mention that there was improvement since day 2. (this is for people out there who wants specifics) On day 2, my testes were cylindrical in shape analogous to a submarine torpedo and it has been gradually taken the shape of a slice of clementine. As for my morning erections, they are somewhat bendable (70%) but if i think about something erotic or concentrate on kegel exercises then it will go from 70% to 85% which is unbendable along the shaft. Everyone’s scale for a good erection is different, so here is my scale:

70% - 79%
erected enough to have shape (pitch a tent),
but it is still bendable

80% - 89%
erected and the only point that it is bendable at the pivot point at
the shaft and balls

90% - 95%
great to have sex with and don’t have to worried
about the performance of your equipment

96% - 100%
erected and throbbing which is my goal

later ppl. oneday

Sounds intense,

I wish you good luck!

Let us know how it turns out and if you notice any signs of recovery. :sunglasses:

Saturday, January 3, 2009

Day 8 of pct, I took only nolvadex last night and this morning of i had a poor morning erection (60%) due to poor sleep. Looking back, a few months ago I wasn’t sleeping that well and I had 1-2 instances of nocturnal and morning erections throughout the week. It all improved as I got better sleep through the use of melatonin 300mcg and gaba supplements. I would take it for 1 week on followed by 1 week off because i didn’t want to sensitize my body and reduce dependency to those supplements. Erections became numerous and numerous with each week that went by. I kept a very good sleep schedule and went to bed at 10:30pm and woke up every morning at 7am. I made sure that the tv was off at 9pm bc I didn’t want to stimulate my mind and emotions with sports or something interesting, such as Terminator: Sarah Cronicles, or 24 (this show definitely gets the heart beating). Now, u know what shows i like, but u have to admit the girl that plays terminator in that show is hot (Summer Glau) and i wouldn’t mind banging the mom (Lena Headey) either. :smiley:

In terms of ball size, there’s no improvement and my balls grow then shrink throughout the day. It is biggest during the mornings and its smallest at night. So measure yourself in the morning to get an accurate reading. It is probably best if you do this in a hot shower b/c your testes will probably hang in the warm environment.

I noticed that there was a decrease in scalp itch and hair loss when taking nolvadex. I’m not advocating that nolvadex is a tool for hair loss prevention, but it is an observation that i notice. Every morning that i wake up, there is an immediate itchy sensation the permeates throughout my scalp. Now, i get a slight isolated itch in the evening and it last a split sec. when i shower, i noticed that there are maybe 5-9 hairs falling out versus 12-15 hairs. Like all of you before propecia, I worry about losing all of my hair and want to keep every strand as long as possible. Many of you, will say who gives a shit about hair and it was the main reason why we are in this mess. Still tho, i still want hair b/c i still want to keep my boyish charm and I don’t have a shapely scalp like Michael Jordan. If I had a nice scalp, then sure, it wouldn’t be that devastating to lose my hair. With the nolvadex, don’t get your hopes up about using it to save hair and I think the hair follicles will fall out sooner or later. I still have hair coverage all over my head, but under a strong light or sunlight, you can definitely see scalp. I’m worried guys!

I’m going to mix a new batch of hcg and here are my instructions(if you find a legit site on mixing instructions then let me know b/c i’m just doing based on what i read on forums):

Mixing Instructions:

materials

alcohol pads
100 IU, 1cc (1ml) insulin syringes
2500 IU hcg ampule
10 ML Presealed Vial
30 ML bateriostatic water

  1. First figure out the calculation given the materials you have. I have a 2500IU ampule of hcg and I want to take 300IU of hcg subcutaneously. I want to add 5 ml of bateriostatic water which is an increase from 4 ml that i have been using. The reason I added 1 more mililiter is to allow the mixture to flow more freely throughout my body. There is no scientific evidence for this and it is what i just thought up on my own.

(how much I want to take/size of ampule) x bateriostatic water ml = number of cc to inject

( 300 IU / 2500 IU ) x 5 ml = 0.60 cc

remember 1 ml is equal to 1 cc

  • I’ll be taking 0.60 cc of the mixture for a dosage of 300IU into my thigh every other night
  1. Wash your hands

  2. Wipe the hcg ampule vial with a fresh alcohol pad

  3. Wipe the Presealed sterile vile with a fresh alcohol pad (this is what you’ll store the remaining HCG)

  4. Clean the bateriostatic water bottle with a fresh alcohol pad

  5. Using a fresh sterile syringe draw 4 ml of bateriostatic water and place it into the Presealed sterile vile.

step by step breakdown:
a) using your insulin and draw in 100 IU of air then add this air to bateriostatic water to increase the air pressue.
b) once the air is added, then draw 100 IU of the bateriostatic water(if you didn’t add the air from step a) then you’ll have a hard time drawing down the plunger b/c of the negative air pressure)
c) pull out the need and add it to the presealed sterile vile.
d) follow steps a), b), and c) for another 3 times, and this will leave 4 ml of bateriostatic water in the presealed sterile vial.

  1. Break open the glass ampule of hcg along the line.

  2. Using a fresh syringe, draw in 1cc of air and then add to bateriostatic water.

  3. Extract another 1cc (1ml) of bateriostatic water and place it into the ampule of hcg powder. You should see it dissolve instantly!

  4. Extract the mixture and put it into the presealed vial which will leave you with 5 ml of hcg solution.

  • you should buy some long needles b/c it can be hard to draw out the mixture from the long ampule vials
  1. Using a fresh needle draw in 0.60cc of air then add to the presealed vial and draw out 0.60 cc of the hcg mixture from the presealed vial. Then I choose an injection site and wipe the area with an alcohol pad and once the alcohol has dried, then i inject myself.
    NOTE: everytime you stick the needle into the presealed vial it will dull your needle.

  2. Put the presealed vile of hcg into the fridge

I heard that the hcg should last about 1 week to 30 days, but it will lose potency as time goes on. For me, I’ll mix a new batch weekly.

Today, i’ll be taking hcg, vitamin E and nolvadex.

Sunday, January 4, 2009

Day 9 of PCT, so far, I’m satisfied with the ongoing results that i’ve been getting. Last night, I had one of the best night of nocturnal erections. It was very hard and strong, so you knew it was there. There was no need to reach down and feel if it was there or not. each night, erections have gotten progressively better and usually i’ve seen marked inprovements every couple of days during the pct. It could have been that I took vitamin E with the hcg which made hcg more effective but who knows. I had a very slight morning erection 25%, maybe b/c i only slept for 6 hrs.

I’ve read that hcg is more effective in a Pulsurary administration and I think if I take low dose 150 IU hcg at the end of the day everyday, then i may see better results. I’ll try this over the next couple of days to see if I notice any improvements.

My libido is unchanged and I thought that it was coming back this afternoon, I almost felt it building up, but never made it. It could be a sign that my body is becoming more chemically balanced and who knows, my libido may be back soon.

Summary of Improvements during PCT

  • More Frequent nocturnal and morning erections
  • Better Semen quality and quantity
  • Feeling more confident and happier
  • Feeling ambitious again about my career,
    tackling home projects and in life.

tonight, i’ll take 150 IU of hcg, vitamin E, and nolvadex

Oneday, everyone,

I too have wondered whether my testicles have atrophied, and/or whether they are really smaller or not, or just whether I am paranoid and so they may just seem smaller, so I am wondering…

…Does anyone think that a professional full panel ‘semen analysis’ could tell us anything about testicular health/production/size etc.??

Please chime in people. This is maybe a good test, or something to look into.

And PS. great journal Oneday. I like! Good luck. I will be following, and hoping for you. Peace man.

It is good to hear from you Boston, i’m in the area all the time…also thanks for the encouragement and kind words. GO CELTICS!!!

since i never had a semen analysis done and it doesn’t tell you anything vital. they just tell you about sperm quantity and motility, and it could be misleading. if you are producing less FSH then of course your semen quality is going to be low. I don’t think i’ll get that test anytime soon and will just go with the eyeball test. If you can see it then it means it is working. My seminal fluid is thicker on PCT and less watery. To put it simply, ejaculate has the consistency of snot and there’s more of it now.

As for your balls, I think that it is possible that your ball size is fine but you cannot tell whether or not you leydig cells have shrunken. Sure, you are producing testosterone which is an indicator that some of your leydig cells are working, but who is to say that they are firing on all cylinders (American expression for “top performance” since i have foreign readers). Also, if you have had low testos for a long time then your body and brain gets use to low testosterone , so if you have a slight increase in testos then the hypothalamus will down regulate the LH in your system. if you plan on using hcg, then you almost have to go onto PCT to keep your brain in check along with your balls.

Anyways, Jimmyjohn took a high dose at 4000iu of hcg and it was able to revive his balls to produce greater testosterone, as well as, maintain it. so who knows, maybe one high dose will get things started or small little dose over time with nolvadex (resensitize pituitary as stated by galapagos http://www.propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=4271&highlight=various+points+treatment+nolvadex+clomid#4271) will get things going again.

jimmyjohn’s story about hcg
http://www.propeciahelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2065

Look forward to hearing from you again. oneday

a user on meso asked me the following question and will post it here, just in case, you ppl had the same question.

hey andysutils,

I took finasteride to prevent hairloss and maintain the hair that i had. It was simply vanity and I cared a lot about how i looked. In hind sight, i should have never took propecia and some ppl may harp on my case, but I had very thick hair at the time when i took the drug. I have gone through a lot with this drug and it’s side effects. I won’t tell people not to take the drug b/c the drug worked for my friend to restore his hair back, but for some of us, you’ll have side effects for yrs. I’m gradually getting better but don’t know if my libido will ever be restored and this is why i started PCT.

It is Russian roulette for finasteride users and you don’t know if you’ll be the unlucky individual. I should have thought about this with greater humility when i first considered propecia. I had great hair and ungodly libido, now, my hair has thinned since the first month I started propecia and my libido has not recovered. I don’t get random sexual thoughts and no more of those throbbing, pulsating, rod-like, youthful erections. I thought that my libido was so strong that propecia would just dull it for a little bit while on the drug and return upon cessation of FIN, but contrarily to what i thought, it completely took away all desire within the 1st day of use. To those who have the same 1st day experience of usage, that is probably in their best interest to stop immediately and consider a good PCT program to maintain their HPTA while your body recovers from the drug.

I was in a total funk for the last 1.5 yrs b/c of the hormonal imbalance. Upon cessation of FIN, I had uncontrollable anxiety and it would manifest itself when i was trying to sleep, so i couldn’t get a restful night’s sleep for 1 year. Taking ZMK, sustain alpha, toco, Reset A.D., and endo amp got rid of the anxiety and I began to sleep better in April-May 08. My sleep is not like what it was 3 yrs ago and if i had to put a percentage on it, then i would say it is about 80% percent recovered.

If Finasteride was a person, then i would say the following: You are a cum tasting,smelly cunt sniffing, ball jerking. asshole-licking, salad tossing, fudge playing, nut guzzling, toilet floater bobbing, roast-beef eating, child porn-surfing, hemroidal, small-dick fucking, crooked titty fucking, snot eating, crab infested pussy snorting, vaginal yeast itching, fart sniffing, stupid asshole jerk! :smiley:

whew, venting felt GOOD. when i get a chance tonight then i will post my 10th day entry in the PCT log. take care. oneday

Monday, January 5, 2009

Lab Results

  • I’ll my complete lab results tomorrow when i get a chance.
    12/22/08

FSH 3.3 (1.4-18.1)mIu/ml
LH 3.0 (1.5-9.3)mIu/ml
DHT 264 (112-955)pg/mL
Total Testosterone 572.83 (241-827)ng/dl
Sex Hormone Bind Globulin 26 (10-60)nmol/L

  • results were prior to PCT protocol,
    but I was taking Royal Jelly, and melatonin at the time
  • Doctor did not do test for free testosterone

11/24/08

FSH 2.9 (1.4-18.1)mIu/ml
LH 2.5 (1.5-9.3)mIu/ml
Free Testosterone 4.8 (12.4-40.0)pg/ml
DHT 319 (112-955)pg/mL

  • was taking zmk at the time but wasn’t really sleeping
    well.
  • I had stopped Sustain Alpha, Reset A.D, toco, endo amp 4 months ago b/c i thought it was making my hair thin.
  • Doctor did not do test for total testosterone

03/18/08

FSH 3.5 (1.4-18.1)mIu/ml
LH 5.1 (1.5-9.3)mIu/ml
DHT 288 (112-955)pg/mL
Total Testosterone 470.51 (241-827)ng/dl
Sex Hormone Bind Globulin 19 (10-60)nmol/L

  • 6 mths after the cessation of Finasteride and
    before any supplements were taken

Tenth day on PCT, I took another dose of 150 hcg and 20 mg nolvadex yesterday. I experienced some erections throughout the night and had pretty decent morning erection. My erection was hard but it was bent at the pivot point between the balls and shaft, and laying on my left leg. I would say that the erection quality was 80% and wilted after i peed. December was a remarkable month for me and I made enormous progress in my sleep quality which translated to my lab results. My total testosterone went from 470.51 (03/18/08) to 572.83 (12/22/08) which is above average. This could explain the night time erections (although weak) and mornings erections (3-5/wk) that was getting prior to PCT. My erection quality are so much stronger now, that it is possible that my testosterone is in the 650-700 range. Based on the recent lab results, I should not be taking hcg b/c my balls seem to be working, so says the doctor. I don’t know the upper range of my testosterone before propecia, so i cannot say if 572.83 is right for me. Maybe it could have been lower or higher, and I just don’t know. So, the game plan is not to desensitize my balls and I will be taking my last dose of hcg this Sunday.

I mentioned that my balls grew a bit on the 3rd day of PCT and it seems that will not grow anymore. Lab results reflect that my testes are functional as of 12/22 and generating testosterone. I don’t know if i should jump the gun to attribute the increase in testosterone to anything but it could be better sleep or royal jelly that helped. Supposedly, Royal Jelly helps with impotence and sleep issues. Just click on the link to see the specific brand of royal jelly i was taking but i didn’t buy it from this website (http://www.ecrater.com/product.php?pid=3127256). If someone wants to give it a shot, then go for it and let me know how it works out for you. I’ve tried other brands of royal jelly but the brand on the website seems to work the best. I would take 1 capsule at 10:30pm to sleep better and it made me sleepier in the afternoon as well. I have yet to take a daytime nap since i stopped fin 2 yrs ago, but it will be a definite sign of improvement if I was able to nap.

One of the sides that I’m starting to despise are the puffy regions of my eyes and nolvadex is notorious for this. Even if I got great sleep, I still have the unrested eyelid look and it is making me look older. Shit, i can’t wait until this program is finished and get rid of this side effect. so far on hcg and nolvadex, there are really no side effects, other than the puffy eyes.

While i was feeling my testicular size in the bathroom, I immediately got an erection and it had great size, as well as strength. After Fin, that type of stimulation would not have garnered any arousal, but it did this time. It could be a sign of improvement.

I have to admit, that my penile shaft and skin is looking healthier everyday. I mentioned in a prior entry that my pecker use to look shriveled up, but no matter how cold the northeast gets, my penis is relaxed and flaccid in the cold weather. When I am peeing throughout the day, I notice that my internal structure has a soft center and longer in length compared to 1 month ago, which was a hard condensed mass and shrunken in length.

Alright enough about shafts and i just want to say to all my readers out there, thank you for your comments and well wishes. I pray to god that this works for me and others. oneday

Hey Oneday

Just wanted to stop by to say thanks very much for this detailed journal of your PCT, and best of luck with it.

For all the talk of kickstarting T production we hear around here, I think this is the first detailed description of a gold-standard PCT that uses HCG to fire up the testes, and a tapered dose of Nolva to maintain the expected rise in T.

It’s the protocol I’ve been considering for a while now, so of course I’m following your progress with interest.

Can I ask for some advice? My sleep is terrible, did you find anything else that helped apart from Royal Jelly? I’m going to give that a try.

Thanks again, and peace to you and all members here in the New Year.

Before all of this, I’ve never written in a journal in my life until recently. After reading all the bullshit entries by people, there wasn’t enough detail and information. Every time i checked for some morsel of information, there wasn’t any, everytime i checked for an update, there wasn’t any. So for my PCT, i knew that i’m not just doing this for me but for ppl who rely on these entries for information, so they can create their custom recovery protocol. It doesn’t take a lot to write a journal and you just literally need an outline. I normally come up with a logical list as shown here, then i just write about it:

Journal List:

Morning erection quality
Nocturnal erection Quality
How to mix HCG
How to inject HCG
Nolvadex administration (do you take it as a suppository or orally) haha. of course, you only take this orally.
Semen Quality
Other Observations

Shit ppl, it is not difficult to keep a journal and everyone should do it. If you have only 30 mins then just bullet point your observations without going into too many tangents like i do, but hey, to each is their own. You owe it to people who are considering taking finasteride or having side effects after cessation. I think at some point during all these side effects, you probably beat yourself for not getting initial blood tests prior to taking propecia and now, you have all this post-blood work that fall into normal ranges and you have nothing to compare it to. My point is that you had an opportunity to capture crucial data about yourself and you lost the chance because no one told you to do it, or the lab costs were prohibitive, which is the same as keeping a journal. Take the opportunity now to document what you know so you have something to compare afterward. I don’t really remember exactly how long i was on propecia and i have to think back, hmmm…was it 6 months or 8 months that i was on propecia, but if i had kept a journal, then i would know precisely. You guys get the point.

To be honest, in the beginning i never liked to write in the journal because i didn’t think i have anything to say, but time went on and i have a reservoir of information that i wanted to pass along, and i’m doing it! It gets easier and easier everyday because your mind starts thinking about topics automatically for the journal. I generally go through my day normally, then i’ll check my ball size which will spawn off past memories which serves as topic points, or just random events that i come across and i’ll make it a point to bring it up during the write phase of my day.

Just some friendly advise. oneday.

hi scaredmale30 from London, it’s good to hear from a UK pal and please say hi to the Queen for me. :smiley:

I have been tackling the sleep issue thang for 2 yrs now and my suggestions is that you get the following:

melatonin
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=10317123

  • take it at 8:30pm for 1 week on followed by 1 week off.

royal jelly
http://www.ecrater.com/product.php?pid=3127256

  • take it at 10:30pm everyday. Optional: take it in the morning after breakfast.

I would take Melatonin 300 mcg at 8:30pm for a 10:30pm bedtime. I pop the tablet and let it completely dissolve under my tongue then wash it down with some water 15 minutes later. I recommend that you only take lose dose melatonin b/c you’ll disrupt your body’s natural production at a higher dose of melatonin. The body only produces about 150 mcg, so you are taking twice that amount. I take Melatonin for 1 week then stop for another 1 week to prevent my body from getting use to it. I make it a point to not watch tv, read anything interesting, or anything that stimulates my emotions before bed. Also you want to make sure that you wake up at the same time everyday to get your body into a routine. I did this for about 20 days, then I noticed that I started to yawn at 9:00pm which i have not done in a long time. I don’t yawn regularly, but had several episodes where I did last month. I notice that my breathing would deepen with the anticipation of sleep which i was not doing before. Anyhow, buy some royal jelly too and i specifically recommend that you buy the same brand I was taking(listed above). I definitely noticed that it made me feel more rested and took away the unrested look from my face. I would take it right before I slept and you should only take 1 capsule b/c it is a bee product which can give u an allergic reaction. I took 2 capsules one night and I broke out with several spots of hives on my face, neck, and belly. I don’t see a problem with taking this everyday or twice a day (1 morning and 1 evening) and I have not read anything about tolerance build up with royal jelly. Don’t over do it with any of these supplements and just give your body/brain time to get use to sleeping again. When I started this routine, it took my body 2 months to get where i am today. In October 08, I would literally wake up 20 times tossing and turning. I will wake to turn around then quickly go back to sleep, and now, i have 3-6 episodes where I don’t really toss and turn, but just wake up for a split second then go right back to sleep. I dream all the time now and up to the very point when i wake up. Before I would just have several dreams and now I always remember that I more than 2 dreams. I don’t remember all my dreams but I know that I dream which is good enough for me. Maybe that is why i’m always getting nocturnal erections which is b/c i’m always in REM sleep.

hope this answers your question scaredmale30. oneday

Tuesday, January 6, 2009

Tonight’s program: take vitamin E, nolvadex, and maybe royal jelly.

Eleventh day on PCT, still having nocturnal and morning erections today. I tested my erection with mental stimulation by trying to fantasize about a cute female co-worker. I started thinking about her and blood started flowing to my face and lips. It use to be more intense prepropecia, remember when you are attracted to someone there is a build up of emotions and blood starts rushing to your mouth and penis. Well, those emotions started to increase to 50% of what it use to be and as i was physically stimulating the male region… the imagery started to fade and I could not hold it in my mind…this is another issue about post FIN and i cannot fantasize as i use to. There must be some internal brain chemical interaction that has not healed. I use to be able to create sexual imagery about anyone, about a friend’s mom :smiley:, about co-workers, crushes on schoolmates, or girls i was dating. Now, i can’t even hold a mental picture of them for more than 30 secs at a time and I had great imagination too. So this mental picture of my co-worker was fading as well as my erection b/c it was the imagery that served as lifesupport for my erection, but climaxed after 5-7mins. This time, semen quality was poor and it was simply watery with no substance to it.

Watching youporn.com, I am able to stay stimulated and erected for 10-15mins, and I don’t know why i can’t imagine as well as i use too. It is possible that I need to replenish the GABA in the brain as so many suggest. Who knows! If I still have imagery/libido issues after this PCT then I’ll reinvestigate the GHB thread and see how italysideffects from propeciahelp.com is doing with GHB. Around 5pm, i decided to give it another try with youporn.com and I stayed very stimulated with the streaming video of ppl wife swapping. It wasn’t streaming well and was cutting in and out, so it made it hard to stay captivated. I was able to stay aroused until climax. This semen quality was decent no water, just substance.

I took another shot of 150 hcg last night and thought my balls has shrunken slightly about 5% but testicular size has improved since day 3. I never really had taters for balls and started to worry about regressing. “Worrying” is what we’ve been doing on a daily basis lately and wondering if we will return back to normal. In my mind, I imagine that if they were the size of taters, even though i never had potato size balls, but it would be reassuring if they were monstrous balls. I had to calm the fuck down and think logically. I knew that i read some where that if your balls atrophy that it shrinks about 10-20% of what they were and realized that I did notice that I did have growth and it doubled in size, so maybe they are ok. From an objective perspective, my boys will not grow anymore b/c they are probably back to normal. To be safe, I won’t take any hcg tonight and will take 500 IU hcg for Wed and Sunday. You definitely get paranoid with this shit and worry if you’re on the right course. I just have to remind myself that it is not a sprint, but a marathon. (It is an expression that is used a lot with American baseball for perseverance and not expanding all your energy in one attempt but over the duration of the course, to reach the final result which is victory). I just have to pace myself and realized what I have gained thus far. I know that my erections have improved, hardness and strength of my erections are better, I can have multiple erections per day now, visual stimulation works, emotions are higher, and less hair is falling out, so with this in mind, I’m not going to panic. I have 45 days left, can you imagine these long fucking entries every day for 45 days. Shit, you’ll need a coup of coffee to stay awake while reading this PCT.

Now go off and stimulate yourself. oneday. :smiley:

Hey everyone,

I only have 18 days left of nolvadex and I need to find a good source. Can anyone recommend a good reputable site for nolvadex? I ordered some from alldaychemist.com and don’t know if they are legit? If i don’t find a good supply soon then i’ll probably regress and start at ground zero again.

please help. oneday

I didn’t notice in reading your posts: how long are you planning on being on the SERM?

hey quint,

It was on the first entry on the journal and i didn’t mention it since. I will be taking it for probably 8 weeks and will try to taper off the nolvadex in the last 2 weeks of the PCT. There have been a lot of entries throughout this PCT and every couple of days I should give a synopsis to avoid confusion. I always welcome advice to better myself and the journal. Thanks for checking this thread out. oneday.

ok, before ppl on this forum starts jumping and stomping on my BALLS about supplies (:smiley: hehe), i originally was going to do a different PCT program when i was considering PCTs and bought the exact amount needed for it.

1st PCT I considered
2-3 weeks of 250iu HCG every other day at night starting from day one
2 weeks of 50 mg Clomid everyday starting from day one.
4 weeks of 20 mg Nolvadex everyday starting week 2.

I discard that pct with clomid and went with a new one which was:

starting day 1:

  1. 20/20/20/20/20/20/10/5/2.5 gm of Nolvadex at 10pm (7-8 week program)
  2. 250 IU HCG every other day at 10pm for 2-3 weeks

Remember, there isn’t no definitive handbook of right and wrong protocols and everyone literally becomes a rocket scienitist to their own therapy. ppl, i wasn’t building a fucking house, and didn’t add an additional 20% for materials, just in case of fuck ups. haha :smiley:. Guess what, from now on, I will treat it as such and get additional supplies just in case, some new lab results demand a change/modification to PCT.

Once, i went onto the new PCT that I realized, “oh shit, I don’t have enough to get me through the program that I started.(to see how i looked, just picture Macaulay Culkin from home alone, when he finds out that his parents has left him home alone. )”:eek: Now, I’m just trying to get my ducks in a row (american expression: getting and organizing my supplies) to sustain my PCT program.

If anyone else thinks www.inhousepharmacy.com is good then let me know. oneday

Wednesday, January 7, 2009

Tonight: I will be taking 300iu hcg, 20 nolvadex, vitamin E

Twelveth day on PCT, I had few nocturnal erections and a decent morning erection (75%). To explain why I didn’t have many nocturnal erections is b/c I woke up at 3:33am with bad dream, also I thought about a girl i just met who isn’t calling me back. Started to worry that she is disinterested… i had to calm the fuck down: 1.) it is night time and i can’t let my mind go rampant b/c i still want to sleep 2.) if i start thinking about too much shit then i won’t be able to fall back to sleep. However, i was able to sleep after i peed. i wasn’t surprised that i didn’t have any erections after the bad dream b/c it is flight or fight response… for me, i never get excited in those situations

My dream was about a doctor who was doing research at a hospital and I was leaving the hospital, as was he. I was walking outside to the parking garage and I passed by the doctor on my way outside. For some strange reason I was carrying a stool (I don’t know why i was carrying a stool) as i was walking. A devious man walks by me and you could tell that he had malicious intentions. It was apparent that he was after the doctor, so did a 180 degrees to follow the devious individual. He whipped out a gun and demanded the doc’s research and the doc did not give it to him, then BANG, he shot him. Then he pointed the gun in my direction and then, i woke up. I started to think why didn’t i throw him the stool so he could protect himself, if i had thrown it to him then what would I protect myself with, then i said HALT IT!!! i need my sleep b/c i can’t play 20 questions with myself trying to figure out WHY… then random thoughts starts to creep into my head about why hasn’t the girl called me back that I just met on Christmas, that is when i decided to pee to clear my mind and went to sleep without any issues.

I don’t know why i’m typing this shit out and if ppl even care to read the inner workings of my mind. Anyways, i checked for an erection, there wasn’t any b/c it was a bad dream.

When i woke up this morning at 9am, I had an erection of 75% and wanted to see if it could be stimulated further. So I go youporn.com to watch a tutorial on doggy style (:smiley: haha). That definitely got things really going, I climaxed after 5-7 mins. I don’t know exactly b/c i wasn’t really timing myself. I think i can last longer if i stayed focused on doing time trials. Remember, this isn’t the Olympics, just a brotha checking out his mojo. Anyhow, for those who want to know my favorite position is day 04 on the karma sutra link (click link and play video How to do 28 kama sutra positions) If you don’t care, then don’t click. My ejaculate was watery again like yesterday and I don’t understand why it is. It seems to be a recent development where my morning ejaculate has been watery with no substance.

ahhh, you guys must think that i’m a spokesperson for youporn, no, just an avid user. Hey it is the only free shit around, so don’t knock it.

Doctor on Monday, gave me a slip for some blood test for Free and Total Testosterone, FSH and LH, I think i should get Estradiol tested b/c nolvadex increases this hormone, Do u guys think i should get my liver enzymes tested, or any additional blood tests?

your brutha from another mutha, oneday.